Tired of "decriminalization" talk

Does anyone else get annoyed how whenever you hear about the reform of cannabis laws, it's never what's right....which is full legalization?

No, it's always some bullshit about decriminilization of small amounts for personal use, meaning if you get caught burning one it's more or less akin to a traffic violation.

First of all, this would in no way eliminate the problems associated with cannabis's illegal black market which creates crime and violence and leads sometimes to harder drugs. It would also still be in violation of people's freedom, because it is still bullshit to have to pay a fucking fine for smoking a wondrous plant.

It also shouldn't matter whether you have 2 grams or 5 ounces of good shit on you.

Baby steps is what it's going to take.. Decriminalization will come before legalization.

But when you think about it, Decriminalization isn't too bad.. just a ticket for being careless.

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Originally Posted by StrwbrryFldsFrvr

Baby steps is what it's going to take.. Decriminalization will come before legalization.

But when you think about it, Decriminalization isn't too bad.. just a ticket for being careless.

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You're right about the baby steps...as long as we eventually get our full legalization I'll be happy....and about the ticket, yeah, it's not a big deal, but there's a principle involved in the injustice of it: it is in NO WAY a crime to smoke weed.

I am not too sure about legalization, yes it would be wonderful for all the potheads, but do we really want a culture of stoners. Most stoners are too stoned to really be a part of any society outside of a few stoner friends. And do we really want millions of stoned people driving down our highways. I used to get stoned and drive in the 60s, 70s, and 80s. The weed since then has severely increased in THC content. If a joint will lay you out, do we really want society functioning on that level? maybe some can handle it but all the people that would try it if it were legal would undoubtably be stoned beyond belief. I'm all for medicinal MJ, but am not convinced a full legalization would be the best plan. Decriminalization for sure. But if you are driving while impaired on MJ then there should be penalties.

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Originally Posted by medicinal

I am not too sure about legalization, yes it would be wonderful for all the potheads, but do we really want a culture of stoners. Most stoners are too stoned to really be a part of any society outside of a few stoner friends. And do we really want millions of stoned people driving down our highways. I used to get stoned and drive in the 60s, 70s, and 80s. <b>The weed since then has severely increased in THC content. If a joint will lay you out, do we really want society functioning on that level?</b>maybe some can handle it but all the people that would try it if it were legal would undoubtably be stoned beyond belief. I'm all for medicinal MJ, but am not convinced a full legalization would be the best plan. Decriminalization for sure. But if you are driving while impaired on MJ then there should be penalties.

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Thats where the government would come in to regulate how much THC is in the bud... I'd still be smoking homegrown though :D

Though it would be a shit load cheaper and better for the US economy if people bought government weed.

MEDICINAL ,your argument about millions of people stoned while driving and having a culture of pot heads laying around and smoking weed all day is nothing but a fanciful laugh.thats the same reasoning people said about booze before they stopped prohabition,''do we really want people drinking all day and hours of the night''making booze legal will just make people drink ..Well that never really happened now did it,Your scared about pot heads driving why??Not that their isnt millions of pot heads driving anyway.Plus its a fact that people who drive while on pot drive slower and are more careful.If anything itll make the streets safer having pot heads drive,im more worried about the guy whos been consumeing the legal drug known as booze than the guy high on pot.The guy driving on pot will only make me late for work cause he is driving like a fucking old lady.Yes i agree that getting a fine for cannabis is bullshit but its better than jail.Also cannabis will never be legal in our lifetime so get use to it.There is too many people who have the power over government like big drug companies and other powerfull people who demonize weed and dictate what our laws should be.poliiticians once elected stop listening to the people and start listening to the companies that contributed to their election efforts in the form of dollars.So all politicians have their masters and its not you or me its the guy who gave him the money so he can get elected.

If they do legalize it, and have the government controlling the amount of THC, it would be compairable to going to by a case of beer where 6 might get you a good buzz going, where as a bottle of wiskey will knock you out, and not everyone goes and drinks a bottle of wiskey and drives all over hell. Personally i think people would be more responsible with it if it was legal. You would see alot less bing smoking, and alot more social smoking. and who here hasnt smoked themselves sober, when your high for so long, you can function normally, but still feel fucked up!

Yeah, medicinal, wtf is this shit about stoners being too stoned to function in society? Many people I know function a lot better in society when stoned, as they're more pleasant and friendly with others, more deep-thinking, and take a greater interest in just about anything.

And yes, there should be penalties for driving high ONLY if you're so fucked up it's making a noticeable and unsafe difference.

And yes, also, it would inherently invoke a greater responsibility if legal because suddenly it isn't a dirty crime only for burnout losers, but an accepted part of social society, which would change people's behaviour.

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Yeah, medicinal, wtf is this shit about stoners being too stoned to function in society? Many people I know function a lot better in society when stoned, as they're more pleasant and friendly with others, more deep-thinking, and take a greater interest in just about anything.

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Wow, now that's the most made up fact i've ever heard.

Not to blow you off or anything, but just because weed makes you happy, doesn't mean a society full of weed will be some perfect utopia. You might as well say if everyone took heroine then we'd all be living in paradise. Legalisation at this stage is a bad idea for 'medicinal's very good reasons. Simply put, marijuana does pose a health risk for a lot of people. It can be addictive (a psychological dependancy IS an addiction) and can bring out illnesses and problems later in life following a heavy addiction at a young age. It's ignorant that people assume because it's not as dangerous as the government makes out, it's not dangerous at all. An acquaintance from my old school hung himself recently following a hard, hard weed addiction and one of my best friends is going absolutely nowhere in life because all the lazy bastard wants to do is smoke up. Yes, he is a lazy bastard, but his addiction and it's effect on his behaviour is very evident. Like any substance, it varies from person to person, and in my opinion, people will take the trouble to smoke up if it's their own choice, legal or not. Legalisation means making another harmful substance readily available. We already have cigarettes and alcohol, do we really need another?

Like it or not, the way forward (at least for now, as another user pointed out) is in these little steps. The key is to make known the reality of the substance, useful for a lot of purposes but still dangerous, particularly now. Reduce punishments for casual users and possessors, legalise for medicinal purposes and give kids and adults alike access to an HONEST and LOGICAL info base. Full legalisation is the narrow minded fantasy of anyone that fails to take into account the socialogical effects of such a move. You can still get high, but think outside the box.

From: Someone that isn't in denial of the harmful effects of their favourite herb.

Also, it'd be nice not to be flamed but challenged sensibly on this viewpoint.

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Originally Posted by B.Basher

Wow, now that's the most made up fact i've ever heard.

Not to blow you off or anything, but just because weed makes you happy, doesn't mean a society full of weed will be some perfect utopia. You might as well say if everyone took heroine then we'd all be living in paradise. Legalisation at this stage is a bad idea for 'medicinal's very good reasons. Simply put, marijuana does pose a health risk for a lot of people. It can be addictive (a psychological dependancy IS an addiction) and can bring out illnesses and problems later in life following a heavy addiction at a young age. It's ignorant that people assume because it's not as dangerous as the government makes out, it's not dangerous at all. An acquaintance from my old school hung himself recently following a hard, hard weed addiction and one of my best friends is going absolutely nowhere in life because all the lazy bastard wants to do is smoke up. Yes, he is a lazy bastard, but his addiction and it's effect on his behaviour is very evident. Like any substance, it varies from person to person, and in my opinion, people will take the trouble to smoke up if it's their own choice, legal or not. Legalisation means making another harmful substance readily available. We already have cigarettes and alcohol, do we really need another?

Like it or not, the way forward (at least for now, as another user pointed out) is in these little steps. The key is to make known the reality of the substance, useful for a lot of purposes but still dangerous, particularly now. Reduce punishments for casual users and possessors, legalise for medicinal purposes and give kids and adults alike access to an HONEST and LOGICAL info base. Full legalisation is the narrow minded fantasy of anyone that fails to take into account the socialogical effects of such a move. You can still get high, but think outside the box.

From: Someone that isn't in denial of the harmful effects of their favourite herb.

Also, it'd be nice not to be flamed but challenged sensibly on this viewpoint.

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antichrist...

jk...good points...i still want it legal though:(

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Originally Posted by medicinal

I am not too sure about legalization, yes it would be wonderful for all the potheads, but do we really want a culture of stoners. Most stoners are too stoned to really be a part of any society outside of a few stoner friends. And do we really want millions of stoned people driving down our highways. I used to get stoned and drive in the 60s, 70s, and 80s. The weed since then has severely increased in THC content. If a joint will lay you out, do we really want society functioning on that level? maybe some can handle it but all the people that would try it if it were legal would undoubtably be stoned beyond belief. I'm all for medicinal MJ, but am not convinced a full legalization would be the best plan. Decriminalization for sure. But if you are driving while impaired on MJ then there should be penalties.

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It has been proven that legalization of Cannabis would most likely not cause an increase in the usage of Cannabis. Think about it, if crack was legalized, would you be inclined at all to smoke some? And about driving, if it were true that there would be an increase in usage, who says that anybody would go driving their first time, or if they were novice smokers? I remember I didn't want to drive for quite awhile, because I wasn't able to handle it as well as I can now. A lot of other people I know were like this as well. Also, why would it be so horrible if this were true? Millions of people drink, and drive drunk. That is way worse than driving stoned. A lot of our culture is around drinking, too. Except most people don't see this as a bad thing... but of course, the illegal Cannabis plant would not be good as a "culture," even though it already is, basically.

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but of course, the illegal Cannabis plant would not be good as a "culture," even though it already is, basically.

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I'd say cannabis is definitely rooted firmly in our culture (UK and US cannabis culture is very similar). It might not be legal but that doesn't stop millions of users across the country toking up and loving it. Anti-weed ad campaigns and the like just fuel the fire. It has been, and always will be a method of personal expression, a rebellious retaliation to a system widely accepted to be flawed and deluded.

Don't you see man, cannabis culture is huge. Do we have head shops for alcohol?

im tired of reading about this bullshit on here bc it will never be legalized. The USA wont completly legalize bc look at who the fuck is running it right now. A puppet. Anyways thats another story, but yes lets quit talking about it who cares about laws keep smoking.

:Tomcat: :Tomcat:

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am not too sure about legalization, yes it would be wonderful for all the potheads, but do we really want a culture of stoners. Most stoners are too stoned to really be a part of any society outside of a few stoner friends. And do we really want millions of stoned people driving down our highways. I used to get stoned and drive in the 60s, 70s, and 80s. The weed since then has severely increased in THC content. If a joint will lay you out, do we really want society functioning on that level? maybe some can handle it but all the people that would try it if it were legal would undoubtably be stoned beyond belief. I'm all for medicinal MJ, but am not convinced a full legalization would be the best plan. Decriminalization for sure. But if you are driving while impaired on MJ then there should be penalties.
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i swear thats something you expect to hear in a reply from an MP to a letter talking about legalisation...

grrr :cursing:

I think the first step to legalization might be getting a way to quickly test the amount in someones system then they can determine a legal driving amount and arrest those driving over it. I think no one should ever drive while on anything that alters or slows the mind PERIOD. But that is just my opinion.
I also think with legalizing it it will do more good someone mentioned their friend getting nowhere. Well if he is thrown in jail that will not help, but I think instead of sppending all the money to throw people in jail we could spend it to help their promblem. Plus the legalization will help our governments debt out hugely by taking in taxes and not going out to arrest these farmers and tokers.

i totaly agree as far as i know there aint nowhere on the planet where it is totally legal and in my life time time it never will be.and shit these baby steps annoy me!!

Mattmao, I am with you on the decrim talk. It is all nonsense. Baby steps? Why is it illegal in the first place? Is there a legitimate reason? Granted the UK banned weed before the US by a decade, but that prohibition was done for reason that where really unrelated to a problem with marijuana. It was a knee jerk reaction that occurred due to international diplomatic manuveering. Prohibition as we know it today is a direct result of the USA's campaign between 1935 and 1937. The demonization of marijuana that occurred at that time cemented future attitudes toward weed and has resulted in the quagmire that we currently find ourselves in. Does anyone know why the US deemed it necessary to prohibit marijuana? Was there a legitimate reason? We know that the science cited by prohibitionist in 1937 as a reason for outlawing marijuana was bogus. So why prohibit marijuana, why lie? Why commit fraud against the world community by slandering the herb? Historians in the US assert that it was because of Mexican immigrants and African-American jazz musicians, but when asked why the Federal Bureau of Narcotics made the final push to prohibit marijuana they have no definitive answer. Paraphrasing one of the first observers (Becker, 1966): Whatever the reason may have been they decided to prohibit marijuana. In other words we don't really know why? Other historians talk about political pressure from the individual states, however, if you bother to check the source of the pressure the trail leads you right back to the Federal Bureau of Narcotics. Sure several states had banned marijuana before the Bureau was created, but these laws simply banned the smoking of marijuana cigarettes. Truth be told, Parke-Davis bud was available anywhere in the US by mail order for 35 cents an ounce. According to a 1917 US Government report, the Mexicans preferred the PD bud over their shitty mexi weed. Go figure. Wrapping up this rant, I just want to ask why we'd talk about decriminalization when illegality in the first place is suspect? I am not a lawyer, but there is a law - US Code Chapt 18 Sec 1001 - False statements. It covers the misrepresentation of the truth. The prohibition of marijuana should be completely repealed based on the original lies of demonization. Lies that are essentially acknowledged by the US Shaffer Commission in the early 1970s. Prohibition would not have occurred if the Bureau of Narcotics had not demonized marijuana in 1937, thereby polluting the public perception of what was previously known by other names like hemp, cannabis, ganja, muggles, reefer, etc. Several generations passed before people began to evaluate the consensus opinion about marijuana in the late 1960s and early 1970s. By this time the damage had been wrought. More later. Decriminalization is wrong, for the simple reason that marijuana should have never been criminalized in the first place!

It's a gold mine for the pharmaceutical companies. Profits from cannabis derived drugs doubled last year from over 300 million to 709 million. Money talks and when the drug companies see unlimited dollar signs on the horizon they do everything in their power to lobby the government into not legalizing.

It's also discouraging to see a bias within this forum on 'potheads' and 'stoners'.