Genocide

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Originally Posted by BlueCat

it seems any question that does not set right with you is a PLOY from the left. Fuck the left right shit. We are Americans first. I am not left or right. I am a mom caught in the middle, YOu can support any war you want just don't start talking about sending my kid to anymore wars so you can feel "like you are doing your patriotic duty.

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Your "kid" volunteered just like both of mine.

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It is very understandable not to trust ANYONE that is not willing to put themselves in the same situations you want to put our troops in. Its YOUR right to wage war with other people children?

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I will try one more time it's EVERYBODY'S right to have an opinion even if their Kids aren't over there.

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If you want to debate war and not get personal don't talk to me. It is personal for me. I live it every time the phone rings.

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I hope you don't share that with your son, he has enough to worry about. Knowing this mom can't handle it, is only 1 more thing to take his off whats important,staying alive, and doing the job.

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Heres the education I got from my last call: You want to know what the medics call the brain matter that is stuck on their shoes "OIF". damn I got OIF all over my friends cd player and it stinks. SO I ask what the heck is that? It stands for Operation IRAQI freedom. Just lovely, brain matter and bone is operation iraqi freedom and it is a common term they use everyday. Imagine being covered in blood and shit so much it has a vernacular expression.

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I don't have to imagine to hard

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I have very little to say to arm chair soldiers. Sure it is your right to vote but I think you'd give that vote a lot of thought if it was YOUR kid.

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again I tried to avoid this because it wasn't germane to "our" discussion but it is my kids, and me before that.

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Now you are talking about boots on the ground in the Sudan? DO you think we could finish the Iraqi war 1st?

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We need to re-read my post about "boots on the ground" I think you are a little confused.

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It sickens me how you people feed on war to make yourselves feel like you are doing something good and then call it an American right. Honestly do you have kids? What are their ages oh thats right that is PERSONAL we have to keep this war at a distance wouldn't want to get personal wouldn't want to attach REAL faces.

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Voicing your option is an American right, one worth defending at any time.
It's personal to me.

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We are never going to agree on anything

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Yes we are, it is my sincerest hope that your son returns to you safely.:)

well thanks. I hope they all come home safely.

One question: we were discussing this on the military moms site:
When ever a comment is made on the pure shit that our guys are going though someone else (usually someone with no family in the military) makes the comment Well he volunteered or he enlisted.

THe statement makes no sense. SO I guess that means it is ok for our sons to be killed or maimed because they enlisted they deserve to get their legs blown off? No one knows or can prepare for what they are seeing over there. I guess it is more noble to wait until the country is attacked and then wait again while the goverment re instates a draft...thats going to work real well.
They enlist because they trusted the country and our government NOT TO LIE to them. Volunteering to serve is an honorable thing it should not be used as a way to excuse what is happening to our guys today.

IF you really do have children in this war AND they are down range then I really really don't understand your opinions but that is fine. I never said you could not have an opinion what I said was I don't have to agree nor accept your opinion.

We are BOTH here on the cannabis site so that much we have in common.
So pass the PEACE pipe. :) maybe it will work magic.

All I have to say is
War is a very profitable business for the western world and as long as the west keeps backing sides in the rest of the world they will always have customers for their advanced "defense" systems.

By keeping the developing countries at each others throats and stirring shit up in foreign climes the west makes sure that they don't develop enough to threaten the wests financial grip on the world.

That is why this shit is happening .


PS I love the Goering quote

Thanks Psychocat I agree, years ago I starting reading about arms sells and corporate lobby involvement and I have been following it ever since.

War is big business. Do you read CorpWatch? Its a great site. :)

http://www.corpwatch.org/

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Originally Posted by Blue Cat

well thanks. I hope they all come home safely.

One question: we were discussing this on the military moms site:
When ever a comment is made on the pure shit that our guys are going though someone else (usually someone with no family in the military) makes the comment Well he volunteered or he enlisted.

The statement makes no sense. SO I guess that means it is OK for our sons to be killed or maimed because they enlisted they deserve to get their legs blown off? No one knows or can prepare for what they are seeing over there. I guess it is more noble to wait until the country is attacked and then wait again while the government re instates a draft...thats going to work real well.
They enlist because they trusted the country and our government NOT TO LIE to them. Volunteering to serve is an honorable thing it should not be used as a way to excuse what is happening to our guys today.

IF you really do have children in this war AND they are down range then I really really don't understand your opinions but that is fine. I never said you could not have an opinion what I said was I don't have to agree nor accept your opinion.

We are BOTH here on the cannabis site so that much we have in common.
So pass the PEACE pipe. :) maybe it will work magic.

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I say that because both of mine knew exactly what they were doing. Against my advice they both left collage, I told them both this mess would be going on for decades and it would still be here after they graduated. It looks like I was right.

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the country and our government NOT TO LIE to them.

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I don't believe they see that way, if you are talking WMD's, the solders & parents I talk to think it was gross incompetence, on a world wide scale 15-20 countries Intelligence services were telling OUR Intel that their Intel was the same. I'm not making excuses or trying to justify it, but thats the truth. The voices telling Bush there was no MD were a very small minority in 2002.

When you go down the Government lie/conspiracy road the evidence isn't there, on WMD was a "lie". As a matter of fact I have never heard any solder say the Government "lied" to them about anything. The only people I hear solders call liars is recruiters.

When I hear from my son, him and his over there think they be successful in the end. Given time, they seem almost has worried about the people back home bailing out as they do what they're facing. I tell him to focus on staying alive and doing the job.

We are going to have troops in Iraq for years and years to come (regardless of which party is in charge) Unfortunately I think I am going to be right and he doesn't believe me, again

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We are BOTH here on the cannabis site so that much we have in common.
So pass the PEACE pipe. :) maybe it will work magic.

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I quit toking when the kids came along, I only post in the "politics" section, I enjoy having to defend what and why I believe something.

I will gladly make "peace" with you, I was only debating and exchanging ideas, if I offended you I'm sorry I saw nothing between us as personal.

I will gladly make "peace" with you, I was only debating and exchanging ideas, if I offended you I'm sorry I saw nothing between us as personal. I offer you the same cordiality!

My son seems to worry the most about them pulling out and leaving people there. You know how they are talking about having them go out with the Iraqi police and want to pull a large group of soldiers out? That would be such a big mistake. It is such a mess. You know I can't help but have distain for anybody in the Bush administration because I blame this horrible mess on them. The way it stands now if we leave, soldiers die and if we stay they die. We never should have gone there in the first place.

My son use to talk about staying the course and making it work too. I have never supported the war so I am his pinko commie mom :D
He doesn't say any of that now though, and most of the medical people are now pinko commies too they have had enough and feel they were decieved.
He is not fighting though and he works between both places so he sees both sets of casualties maybe that is why it sounds worse.

I think different military groups see it differently. It makes sense that the Medical people are seeing the more of the result of fighting.
Maybe the ground troops are seeing a different picture. Except he talks to a lot of injured guys and they are not saying things are going well either.



All I know is I wish it was over and he was home for Christmas. This is Christmas number 2 for me. How about you? Wouldn't it be nice if war took a break for the holidays? :)

Anyone who advocates war should read this.

http://christmasspirit.wordpress.com...2%80%99-found/

I found it to be very touching and I'm a cold hearted mofo.

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Originally Posted by BlueCat

All I know is I wish it was over and he was home for Christmas. This is Christmas number 2 for me. How about you? Wouldn't it be nice if war took a break for the holidays? :)

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George Washington beat the English, and their Germans soldiers known as "Hessians", at Trenton on Xmas day because the enemy troops let their guard down.

Washington, along with many other Founding Fathers, was a Deist - and they weren't into Christianity :D

Best of luck for your son. I hope he's safe and home ASAP.

http://www.strike-the-root.com/colum...h/smith33.html

http://www.deism.com/washington.htm

General George Washington crossing the Delaware at the
Battle of Trenton on Christmas night 1776 by Emmanuel Leutze

Thanks Breukelen....:) Hey do you really read Nietzsche? He was really a bad ass wasn't he?:D :D I agreed with a lot of his writings "Untimely Meditations" and "All too Human" are my favorites. I disagree with the "Antichrist" essay though. I think religion is a necessity for the world. I agree it has caused a lot of heart ache but at the same time it gives people hope and is a coping mechanism for those that need it in really difficult times. Without it many people would have abandoned hope, like the Jewish people and all they endured. It was their religious convictions that helped them to cope. That is why I respect the religious beliefs of others even though I am agnostic. Also I see how some people behave in the name of God and shutter to think how they would behave if they believed there was no judgment day. At the same time it is rather amusing that there are more Christians in prison than atheist yet atheist are suppose to be the ungodly sinning heathen monsters. :D

As far as the founding fathers I agree with you. It amazes me how many people talk about our nation's founders and how religious they were when it is not true. How many times have you heard the One nation under God statement? The founding fathers had the wisdom to know the importance of the separation of church and state. Jefferson even had all references to Christ's miracles removed from his bible and Franklin said church was just plain boring.