The Real Origins Of The 9/11 Truth Movement

[pisshead]

The Real Origins Of The 9/11 Truth Movement

Paul Joseph Watson | May 3, 2005 (http://www.prisonplanet.com/index.html)

Infowars | May 4, 2005
By Alex Jones

Nearly four years after the tragic events of September 11th, the 9/11 Truth Movement has expanded from a small group skeptics and activists into a real political force.

Over time several individuals have sought to place themselves at the center of this unprecedented citizen campaign by declaring themselves to be its 'founders.'

Whether their motivation is fueled by malevolence or by a genuine desire to steer people toward the truth, their behavior is dangerous to the ultimate success of the movement.

Within a popular front such as this, the title of "founder" carries with it enormous authority to many people. Those who claim to have founded this movement are also claiming the moral authority to define what others should investigate, what they should focus their efforts on, and what they should believe.

Shouting at the top of my lungs, I came forward months in advance of September 11th, trying to warn the country of the sinister events on the horizon, and of the impending crime that powerful, elite members of the federal government were going to perpetrate on the American people under the guise of foreign terrorism.

Shortly after the attacks, I released the very first 9/11 film to expose the government connections to the attack. Yet, despite being first to champion the truth about 9/11, I do not seek the title of 'founder,'

I only seek to further warn others in this crusade to beware of those who would attempt to limit and control the scope of our investigations, who would tell us what we ought to believe and who would stand in the the way of our mission to expose deceit and reveal the truth.



Four years ago in May 2001, I watched a British Channel 4 documentary about Alex Jones' infiltration into Bohemian Grove. At first glance the show seemed to be a hit piece aimed at discrediting Alex and his work. But I wanted to make sure so I visited Alex's website and started listening to his radio show.

Alex was gripped with anguish and apprehension. He was talking about how the government were about to carry out an act of terrorism to bolster the construction of a police state and a new world order.

Alex dubbed his campaign 'Expose the Government Terrorists' and urged his listeners to call the White House and tell them to call off the operation.

He gave out White House switchboard numbers on his radio and television show on a daily basis.

On his television show Alex elaborated on the fact that the Globalists were about to use their asset Osama bin Laden to attack New York. Alex is not psychic. He did not have a crystal ball. He was able to make the call because he could see the conditioning in the media. Bin laden is a threat, bin Laden will attack. When bin Laden attacks, give up your rights.

This was the incessantly replayed mantra from the controlled media.

Click here (http://www.prisonplanet.tv/articles/august2004/082604alexwarned.htm)for a clip from Alex's TV show, taped on July 25th 2001.

I watched all this develop before I even spoke to Alex Jones or started my own website.

Alex predicted the 9/11 attack BEFORE it happened.

On the day of the attack Alex called in to the Derry Brown show which was being broadcast on GCN before Alex's own show came on air.

Alex was adamant that the government were behind the attack. They had been conditioning the public before the attack and they had the most to gain from carrying out the attack.

While others were squabbling over issues of prior knowledge, Alex was firm in pointing the finger directly at the criminals inside the Military-Industrial Complex for being intimately involved in 9/11.

The evidence is now overwhelming and clear that this is exactly what happened.

In the days and weeks following 9/11, Alex was the first to draw attention to the crucial testimony of people like David Shippers (http://www.infowars.com/transcript_schippers.html) and Greg Palast (http://www.infowars.com/transcripts/palastnew.htm), respectable figures blowing the whistle on government connections and protection of the terrorists.

Greg Palast thanked Alex (http://www.infowars.com/print_palast.htm) for being the only radio host to pay attention to W199I, a leaked document concerning FBI protected of groups linked to Al-Qaeda.

In mid to late 2004 several prominent self-proclaimed 9/11 ringleaders started talking about the fact that wargames were used as a cover for the operational execution of the 9/11 attack. Alex was talking about this two years beforehand in his film, Masters of Terror and again in an April 2004 television show, a clip of which can be viewed here (http://www.prisonplanet.tv/articles/september2004/200904wargames.htm) .

I point out these examples not to lionize Alex Jones as some kind of messiah but in response to the claims of many researchers that they are the 'grandfather' of the 9/11 truth movement or words to that effect.

It is disturbing to note that in many instances these same researchers have been seen to push obvious frauds like the peak oil theory.

At least three years ago Alex Jones warned people that the establishment would allow the truth about 9/11 to get out simply because it was too big a monster to hide.

Alex pointed out however that the establishment would spin the issue to make people believe that the evil right-wing American imperialists were behind the terrorism and so the only solution would be a left-wing world government to counter them. So you would be forced to accept a false choice between a right-wing world government and a left-wing world government.

Many prominent 9/11 researchers, either unwittingly or deliberately, have promulgated this dangerous notion, stating for example that we need a 'global democracy' to defeat the evil right-wing Neo-Cons.

The fact that these individuals have been labelled the 'godfathers of the 9/11 movement' is therefore a worrying development. This has given them the credibility required to create a '9/11 orthodoxy' and marginalizes anyone who discusses 9/11 issues that THEY feel shouldn't be circulated.

We vehemently disagree with and are highly suspicious of people who claim to be the bellwether 9/11' authority figures,' especially when people like Alex Jones and others were way ahead of the curve on 9/11.

The examples presented in this article underscore our conviction on this matter.

[sensiskunk]

and u call yourself a republican? Sound more like a dem, or an anti republican to me!

[XTC]

Here's what I think on 9/11. Did they know something Might happen. Probably. In New York probably. In New York City? Maybe. But on the When and How this attack might take place they probably had no clue. And what should they have done. Evacuate the entire city of New York. The events that happened were tragic, but I feel the goverment had no clue on how and when these things were going to take place.

[amsterdam]

if anyone knew it was coming who do you think it was???i will lay it out for you.

-in february 1993,the world trade center was bombed by muslim fanatics,killing 5 people,wounding hundreds.

clinton did nothing.

october 1993,eighteen american troops were killed in a savage firefight in somalia.the corpse of one american was dragged through the streets of mogadishu as the somalin hordes cheered.

clinton responded by ordering our troops home.bin laden later told abc news"the youth realized the american soldier is a paper tiger and runs from battle after a few blows."

november 1995,5 americans killed and thiety wounded by a car bomb in saudi arabia set by muslim fanatics.

clinton did nothing.

june 1996 a U.S. Air Forse base in saudi arabia was bombed by fanatics.

clinton did nothing.

months later,saddam attacked the kurdish city of erbil.clinton lobbed some bombs into iraq,HUNDREDS of miles from saddams forces.

november 1997,iraq refuced to allow un weapons inspectors to do their jobs and threatened to shoot down a u2 spy plane.

clinton did nothing.

february 1998,clinton threatened to bomb iraq,but called it off because the un said no.

august 7,1998,U.S. embassies in Kenya and Tanzania were bombed by al queda.

clinton did nothing.

august 20,monica lewinsky appeared for the second time to testify before a grand jury.

clinton responded by bombing afghanistan and sudan,severely damaging a aspirin factory.

december 16,the house of representatives prepared to impeach clinton the next day.

clinton retaliated by ordering major air strikes against iraq.

october 2000,our warship the USS COLE was attacked by al queda.

CLINTON DID NOTHING.

[sensiskunk]

so what did u want him to do, go bomb every single fucking country? Clinton was actually smart, and didnt jump to a conclusion and bomb who he THOUGHT had done it. If it was GW in that same situation, there would be nothing left of Saudi Arabia, Afghanistan, Iraq, or Iran. All those countries would retaliate and there would be nothing left of America. Clinton actually cared about international support for America, so thus, he didnt just GUESS, he wanted to know, unlike GW who had no fucking clue what he was doing, and obviously still doesnt. Also, the economy wasnt in a HUGE shit hole during the Clinton presidency, GW was left with the biggest surplus in history, and now were in the biggest deficit in history. Al queda is distributed throughout the whole fucking world, should we just bomb the whole world because of some crazy ass mother fuckers? Al queda knows this, but unfortunately, you dont!

[amsterdam]

so what did u want him to do, go bomb every single fucking country? Clinton was actually smart, and didnt jump to a conclusion and bomb who he THOUGHT had done it. If it was GW in that same situation, there would be nothing left of Saudi Arabia, Afghanistan, Iraq, or Iran. All those countries would retaliate and there would be nothing left of America. Clinton actually cared about international support for America, so thus, he didnt just GUESS, he wanted to know, unlike GW who had no fucking clue what he was doing, and obviously still doesnt. Also, the economy wasnt in a HUGE shit hole during the Clinton presidency, GW was left with the biggest surplus in history, and now were in the biggest deficit in history. Al queda is distributed throughout the whole fucking world, should we just bomb the whole world because of some crazy ass mother fuckers? Al queda knows this, but unfortunately, you dont!

WIERD.,THE RECESSION STARTED UNDER CLINTON?

with the HUGE victories in the middle east and eastern europe toward democracy i believe you might be the only one on the planet in the know who isnt wondering,"was bush right all along?"

learn your politics kiddo

[amsterdam]

at least he could have stood up for our country.clinton was a scum bag who couldnt help but steal 175,000$$ worth of white house furniture when he left.what a joke.

please run hillary in '08,please.

[sensiskunk]

Your a funny guy! Bush is making millions off of us, and u bitch about 175K, who gives a fuck! Clinton was by far a 10X better president than Bush, no matter what right wing propaganda you try and say, its common sense bro. Every leader in history has a downfall, but Bush, in my opinion, is one of the worst.

[amsterdam]

clinton!LOL!CAN YOU SAY IMPEACHMENT?that dumb shit will always be remembered for lying before congress,on national television, and sitting on his ass.what a legacy that is.LOL.

i know that isnt alot of money,but they STOLE it and then had to return it when they got popped.scum.the perfect example of the democrat party is clinton.

[amsterdam]

the new york post ran real article about 2 years ago titled " The 25 most evil people of the millennium"

only hitler edgedout clinton by 39 votes.he handily beat STALIN by 20 votes,

sure,clinton is a real legend.keep telling yourself that.

[amsterdam]

at least he was our first black president!

[amsterdam]

what do you mean it was only 175k??he was the president?and he is a thief>it is too funny how far some people will go to defend that waste of time.

[amsterdam]

say bill clinton was a good president is like saying Max Cleland is a war hero.LOL.

it just isnt true.

[Edgar]

the perfect example of the democrat party is clinton.

A while back you said he was a republican in dems clothing. So which is it? Or is it that it really doesn't matter if its dems or republican because both parties stink of corruption?

[pisshead]

you're getting too deep for our simple minded, keep it simple stupid resident genius.

[Marlboroman]

Pisshead I'm with you 100% man. the number one reason we havent caught Osama is because he did the powers at be a favor. We were attacked apon our own accord.

I for one am looking at the next election wondering if the powers at be will figure out a reason to make us keep W in office.

the down economy is all part of their plan to make the US devided by rich and poor, us working for them.

further more I believe that the economy shift is done on purpose to force our younger less fanacial secure men and woman into the armed forces. I was in the military and I can tell you from experience that when it was time to get out Clinton had the economy rolling smooth and I couldnt bail on the Navy fast enough. Our sons and daughters dont stay in the militay from a sense of duty or patriotism anymore, they are there to put food on tables. and if we dont watch it it may be the only steady job to be had.

Not to mention wtf we need all these troops for?? we rolled over our so called largest threat in 2 weeks. Yet the GOV smacks this fear campaghn in our faces evertytime W has something dirty to air. You cant scare me anymore, I dont give a shit if they come on the news telling me that Osama was spotted in Manhatten with a tommygun, Its all desighend to strip you of your civil liberties.I really wish more people would pay fucking attention to what is going on.

In the end I think we invaded Iraq to get the oil to combat Korea, or atleast have some control over them. See I find it more likely that Sadam was selling oil to Korea and W said stop. Sadam says fuck you american pig and off we go. Its all about controling the oil.

On a side note, I know allot of people want hybrid cars and solar power and all that jazz, renewable resources and all, but be carefull what you wish for cause here is the catch. as soon as the automobile companies have sorted out hybrids and such and curb the publics dependency on fossil fuels it also frees up all that juicy petrol for the US war machine. And if i were to speculate further I would say that the current GOV would like nothing better than to have soul control over the gasoline that fuels the tanks and jets. this would all but cripple any sort of real revolt we as the american people could stage against a newly forming police state. Again, its all about the oil.

For all those that will say i am crazy and no such things can happen.

I say this, were the hell you think you are Never Land? this is the world, and nasty things have been happening since the dawn of time. Do you think the Jews had any idea of what lied ahead for them in WW2? It's the same sort of situation here, except they are not seperating us based on religion, they are doing it based on income.

[Marlboroman]

if anyone knew it was coming who do you think it was???i will lay it out for you.

-in february 1993,the world trade center was bombed by muslim fanatics,killing 5 people,wounding hundreds.

clinton did nothing.

october 1993,eighteen american troops were killed in a savage firefight in somalia.the corpse of one american was dragged through the streets of mogadishu as the somalin hordes cheered.

clinton responded by ordering our troops home.bin laden later told abc news"the youth realized the american soldier is a paper tiger and runs from battle after a few blows."

november 1995,5 americans killed and thiety wounded by a car bomb in saudi arabia set by muslim fanatics.

clinton did nothing.

june 1996 a U.S. Air Forse base in saudi arabia was bombed by fanatics.

clinton did nothing.

months later,saddam attacked the kurdish city of erbil.clinton lobbed some bombs into iraq,HUNDREDS of miles from saddams forces.

november 1997,iraq refuced to allow un weapons inspectors to do their jobs and threatened to shoot down a u2 spy plane.

clinton did nothing.

february 1998,clinton threatened to bomb iraq,but called it off because the un said no.

august 7,1998,U.S. embassies in Kenya and Tanzania were bombed by al queda.

clinton did nothing.

august 20,monica lewinsky appeared for the second time to testify before a grand jury.

clinton responded by bombing afghanistan and sudan,severely damaging a aspirin factory.

december 16,the house of representatives prepared to impeach clinton the next day.

clinton retaliated by ordering major air strikes against iraq.

october 2000,our warship the USS COLE was attacked by al queda.

CLINTON DID NOTHING.


This whole bit here is mindless to look at i think. not knocking your facts but you are blinded by the same shit they blind us all with. You only get 2 choices for president.

you have to pick dumb or dumber.

But none the less it doesnt matter who you vote for, its the same mother fuckers runnin the show. And its clear those assholes have a hankering for world domination. That was simply the build up of the fear campaighn, they have to get you scared for your life before you will let go of your freedoms.

I know its hard for everyone to let go of what they have been taught all their lives, in school or at home. but the plain and simple truth is we have all been duped into beleiveing that the threat to our country lies outside our borders.

[amsterdam]

there are more people outside this country who want to kill us than there are in it thats for sure.however there are tons of people already here who want to inflict damage also.

[Marlboroman]

wanting to kill americans is a far cry from actually being able to do it. and as for the number of people actually able to inflict damage apon us is minimal considering the worlds population.

Besides I'm not saying our GOV wants us dead, I'm saying they want us more or less as slaves. Oh they plan on paying us but my bet is it will be hardly enough to survive on.

Thats why our GOV supplements millions of incomes every year with programs, that are not desighend to help you. they are there to keep you dependent on them, so when you lose them you have no choice but to,

1. enter the military(so you can further the facist ways of W)

2. get a minimum wage job (pays almost as well as the military)

3. or turn to crime( in which case you go to prison and W's pals make money off your ass in prison)

4. lets not discount entrepenuership (sp) ( isnt that why we are on this board?)

think about it for a second Amsterdam, why has Bush dropped so many public programs? its not funding, I'ts been proven that they can find the money for them. Bottom line is keeping those programs running isnt good for the armed forces and thats what W is building atm.

one last thing, if you believe that the relativly low numbers of actual terrorist that can hurt us, is what threatens the United States and our way of life you are not seeing things clearly in my opinion. the imagfe of terrorists is merely the engine driveing the movement to rip your liberties away from you.

[amsterdam]

wanting to kill americans is a far cry from actually being able to do it. and as for the number of people actually able to inflict damage apon us is minimal considering the worlds population.

Besides I'm not saying our GOV wants us dead, I'm saying they want us more or less as slaves. Oh they plan on paying us but my bet is it will be hardly enough to survive on.

Thats why our GOV supplements millions of incomes every year with programs, that are not desighend to help you. they are there to keep you dependent on them, so when you lose them you have no choice but to,

1. enter the military(so you can further the facist ways of W)

2. get a minimum wage job (pays almost as well as the military)

3. or turn to crime( in which case you go to prison and W's pals make money off your ass in prison)

4. lets not discount entrepenuership (sp) ( but isnt that why we are on this board?)

think about it for a second Amsterdam, why has Bush dropped so many public programs? its not funding, I'ts been proven that they can find the money for them. Bottom line is keeping those programs running isnt good for the armed forces and thats what W is building atm.

one last thing, if you believe that the relativly low numbers of actual terrorist that can hurt us, is what threatens the United States and our way of life you are not seeing things clearly in my opinion. the imagfe of terrorists is merely the engine driveing the movement to rip your liberties away from you.


why dont you apply for student loans like everyone else?i paid my way.you pay yours.make your own way.

you guys be scared if you want.i am gonna use the govt and all that it has given me with chances and make it.if you cant make it in this country you are in trouble.

[amsterdam]

just the title of the post is silly.the 9/11 truth movement.there is no movement.

[XTC]

wanting to kill americans is a far cry from actually being able to do it. and as for the number of people actually able to inflict damage apon us is minimal considering the worlds population.

Besides I'm not saying our GOV wants us dead, I'm saying they want us more or less as slaves. Oh they plan on paying us but my bet is it will be hardly enough to survive on.

Thats why our GOV supplements millions of incomes every year with programs, that are not desighend to help you. they are there to keep you dependent on them, so when you lose them you have no choice but to,

1. enter the military(so you can further the facist ways of W)

2. get a minimum wage job (pays almost as well as the military)

3. or turn to crime( in which case you go to prison and W's pals make money off your ass in prison)

4. lets not discount entrepenuership (sp) ( isnt that why we are on this board?)

think about it for a second Amsterdam, why has Bush dropped so many public programs? its not funding, I'ts been proven that they can find the money for them. Bottom line is keeping those programs running isnt good for the armed forces and thats what W is building atm.

one last thing, if you believe that the relativly low numbers of actual terrorist that can hurt us, is what threatens the United States and our way of life you are not seeing things clearly in my opinion. the imagfe of terrorists is merely the engine driveing the movement to rip your liberties away from you.


See, then you have your Far left wingers. These guys are REALLY Paronoid. I mean come on. Bush isnt that smart to think of that theory.

[Marlboroman]

See, then you have your Far left wingers. These guys are REALLY Paronoid. I mean come on. Bush isnt that smart to think of that theory.

Bush didnt think it up, he is only executeing it.

[Marlboroman]

why dont you apply for student loans like everyone else?i paid my way.you pay yours.make your own way.

you guys be scared if you want.i am gonna use the govt and all that it has given me with chances and make it.if you cant make it in this country you are in trouble.

I'm not in money trouble Amsterdam, I dont need a student loan. your the one thats scared enough to let go of your liberties.

[amsterdam]

I'm not in money trouble Amsterdam, I dont need a student loan. your the one thats scared enough to let go of your liberties.


i bet you cant name one liberty i or you have lost without making it up.name 1.

[amsterdam]

See, then you have your Far left wingers. These guys are REALLY Paronoid. I mean come on. Bush isnt that smart to think of that theory.


the republicans love that people think bush is stupid.he was smart enough to smoker the dems in two elections and shape the political landscape in the republicans favor.the dems have turned into children and whine about everything.

[Marlboroman]

See, then you have your Far left wingers. These guys are REALLY Paronoid. I mean come on. Bush isnt that smart to think of that theory.


Also just by calling me a far left wing means you actually beleive there is a left and a right..... but if you read what im saying, there is no difference between them. Both parties have the same goal, and thats to control the masses of american people. But it wont stop there because it cant, once a system of GOV like that starts to take over it will cicle the globe.

and since we only Korea and China stand in the way, we will simply starve their oil supply until they have no choice but to join us as well.

what im saying doesnt happen over night you see. If you put the frogs in the hot water they jump out. you have to heat the water while they swim.

[XTC]

I am assuming you didn't vote then.. If that is the case.... Then you have you non voting, so they can bitch at whoever gets elected

[Marlboroman]

the republicans love that people think bush is stupid.he was smart enough to smoker the dems in two elections and shape the political landscape in the republicans favor.the dems have turned into children and whine about everything.


Im not republic or democrat but like i said before, there is no difference. its a made up conflict these days. they might have actually had some different points of view once apon a time. but as for anything that really matters and the future of the US these guys are together in their policies.

[Marlboroman]

I am assuming you didn't vote then.. If that is the case.... Then you have you non voting, so they can bitch at whoever gets elected

I voted, but not for either of them, why only 2 choices tho?

[amsterdam]

Im not republic or democrat but like i said before, there is no difference. its a made up conflict these days. they might have actually had some different points of view once apon a time. but as for anything that really matters and the future of the US these guys are together in their policies.

please dont say you voted for badnarick?

[Marlboroman]

please dont say you voted for badnarick?

nope

[amsterdam]

did you vote?

[XTC]

I already asked that.. He did

[XTC]

Not Nader.. Dont say him... He wants American to cut off Big Ass Companies so we can lose even more money

[amsterdam]

thank god,so someone tell me exactly what freedoms they have personally lost?any?

[amsterdam]

and bill mahr in '08 xtc?c'mon.

[XTC]

I never said it was a good idea.. I just said I heard about it

[amsterdam]

and it was serious or he needed to create a little hype to get people to watch his show.i would guess the latter.

[Marlboroman]

Not Nader.. Dont say him... He wants American to cut off Big Ass Companies so we can lose even more money

I did not vote for Nader, but it is those big bussinesses that control allot of the policies that are in effect. this aspect of it is about money istead of oil.

its about addicting your children to legal GOV supported Pharms.

its about giveing a credit card to a 20 year old kid with a 10k limit and then takeing away his or her right to claim bankrupty to get out from under the money blanket that covers them.

granted they should have been taught how to manage money, and you can say that they should go to school and whatnot. but thats not going to stop the credit card companies from soliciting the younger less money adept peoples. in fact giveing them the tools to indebt whole generations of people with no real way out.

see once you get into credit card debt they start banging you for 20% interest after time. thereby makeing your interest payment more than the principal amount. then take away your right to claim bankruptcy and now you will never get out of debt. unless of course you go into the military get 3 hots and a cot and spend no money then maybe you can get out.

your gonna say that its their fault for getting into that situation, and yes it is. but thats not stopping it from happening is it? and that still doesnt take away from the fact that the credit card companies get you into debt on purpose. the things im stateing are not nearly the end of the exapmles. its just scratching the surface.

[Marlboroman]

Credit card companies could in fact be the next generation of bussinesses to use people as slaves. paid slaves but only paid enough to stay just in debt.

Look what the coal mineing industry did, it housed hundreds of people in small towns. controlling their work hours and rate of pay. Also controlling the cost of liveing in the town, which was very simple to even it out so no money if any was left for the families after paying the company for their way.

I am in no way saying this is the next step mind you but it wouldnt be a far leap.

[amsterdam]

I did not vote for Nader, but it is those big bussinesses that control allot of the policies that are in effect. this aspect of it is about money istead of oil.

its about addicting your children to legal GOV supported Pharms.

its about giveing a credit card to a 20 year old kid with a 10k limit and then takeing away his or her right to claim bankrupty to get out from under the money blanket that covers them.

granted they should have been taught how to manage money, and you can say that they should go to school and whatnot. but thats not going to stop the credit card companies from soliciting the younger less money adept peoples. in fact giveing them the tools to indebt whole generations of people with no real way out.

see once you get into credit card debt they start banging you for 20% interest after time. thereby makeing your interest payment more than the principal amount. then take away your right to claim bankruptcy and now you will never get out of debt. unless of course you go into the military get 3 hots and a cot and spend no money then maybe you can get out.

your gonna say that its their fault for getting into that situation, and yes it is. but thats not stopping it from happening is it? and that still doesnt take away from the fact that the credit card companies get you into debt on purpose. the things im stateing are not nearly the end of the exapmles. its just scratching the surface.

credit card debt??that its their own fault is the point.

if people are to stupid to know that credit card companies are hustlers than they deserve to get fucked.

ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh those poor people.what a sob story.those big mean credit card companies tricked them :cool:

[XTC]

I say if you think your responsible enough for a credit card then you should be responsible enough at spending money. ANd what about the teen's that are responsible enough at spending. They shouldn't have credit cause some kid doesn't live off mommy anymore? Live and learn. It's a dog eat dog world.

[amsterdam]

hey xtc,im in wilmette!where are you?

[XTC]

lol.. Lockport/Joliet area...

[amsterdam]

nice,we should have a pint sometime and i can try to clear your mind of all that liberal bullshit you have been force fed through the years.lol.j/k

[Marlboroman]

God you 2 have no clue about the real world do you. you think everyone in this country is basically handed a handbook to success. its no doubt im not talking about YOUR kids, im talking about poor kids, the kids liveing in the trailor park you drive by on your way to work.

YA lets fuckem!

why dont you and I start a credit card company and specifically target those areas.. damn on paper we will have millions and billions comeing to us...

if its not happeing right now then great its a wide open market for you and I.

what about the GOV supported Pharms?

nah yer right its prob just more of my liberal bullshit

stop thinking in terms of left and right, anyone who still maintains they are seperate is an idiot. and other than you calling my liberal which im not I cant stand o ton of things Dems stand for and i cant stand a ton of things Reps stand for.

I am my own party and happy to stay that way some of this some of that, its a well rounded view of the world not just the US.

at 26 with a house 2 cars and kids you have been very busy... have you even been to another country? do you even know how others live outside of your seemily well protected life? I will guess no or very short stints in close places...

you come here and tell others im force feeding liberism. atleast im force feeding some type of info..

you seem to be stuck on one liners... and force feeding them back as well.

[amsterdam]

God you 2 have no clue about the real world do you. you think everyone in this country is basically handed a handbook to success. its no doubt im not talking about YOUR kids, im talking about poor kids, the kids liveing in the trailor park you drive by on your way to work.

YA lets fuckem!

why dont you and I start a credit card company and specifically target those areas.. damn on paper we will have millions and billions comeing to us...

if its not happeing right now then great its a wide open market for you and I.

what about the GOV supported Pharms?

nah yer right its prob just more of my liberal bullshit

stop thinking in terms of left and right, anyone who still maintains they are seperate is an idiot. and other than you calling my liberal which im not I cant stand o ton of things Dems stand for and i cant stand a ton of things Reps stand for.

I am my own party and happy to stay that way some of this some of that, its a well rounded view of the world not just the US.

at 26 with a house 2 cars and kids you have been very busy... have you even been to another country? do you even know how others live outside of your seemily well protected life? I will guess no or very short stints in close places...

you come here and tell others im force feeding liberism. atleast im force feeding some type of info..

you seem to be stuck on one liners... and force feeding them back as well.


i lived in Holland with my fathers family for two years.i traveled all over europe by train and stayed in hostiles.i have been to israel,saudi arabia,morracco,and met up with a guy i went to military school with who lived in beirut.before i went to europe i was one of those anti-goverment,everyone is out to get me nonsense.once i had met the real people,heard what they said,saw how they lived, my life and ideas were changed forever.believe me i have seen some shit in my life.i made my own way kiddo.i worked REAL hard and it paid off bigtime.

i still talk to many of the people i met along the way that live in those countries.let me tell YOU those people love america and the oppurtunities we have.people are too spoiled in this GREAT country and complain about everything under the moon.thats where my GET OVER IT attitude comes from.95%of people have NEVER4 STEPPED a foot in a middle eastern country and seen people whipped for holding hands.i have my friend. :cool:

[Marlboroman]

well im glad you have seen atleast some of the world, allot of it it seems. but sayinghow good it is here and then saying we are spoiled is retarded.

your get over it attitude cant come from saying we are spoiled. so life is good here and we wont get beat for holding hands. they dont have to inflict control on you in those manners. here they use the media among other things to do that very thing.

if we didnt have the media who is to say that local GOV wouldnt flog us for holding hands. its happen in the past, why not the future. I have stepped foot in a middle eastern country ive also stepped a foot in allot of other places. and I am far from a "kiddo"

I think with this whole conversation my point is being lost.

I am not talking about the current state of the union. I'm talking about the future state of the union.

why put that part into the patriot act that makes it an act of terroism to try to sway the GOV policies? See many Taliban marching up Martin Luther King Blvrd do you?

it was put into place to control YOU and ME and that guy over there. So in the event things get out of hand like they did in the 60's they can just lock your asses up and call you terrorists... and the so called right wing will love it and jump on that band wagon lickity split.

it really is mind numbing trying to get my point across to you. There is no left and no right. they are the same parties with the same agendas. Hate me all you want man your only fueling your blindness.

[XTC]

Personally I think you are listening to much to Rage Against the Machine. Here's what I think. The goverment wont break your balls as long as your not making bomb's in your basement or plotting attacks against America. I am not a big fan of Bush but he isn't that going to go after the Average Joe. In my opinion your just as bad as Far Right Wing Republicans.

[Marlboroman]

Personally I think you are listening to much to Rage Against the Machine. Here's what I think. The goverment wont break your balls as long as your not making bomb's in your basement or plotting attacks against America. I am not a big fan of Bush but he isn't that going to go after the Average Joe. In my opinion your just as bad as Far Right Wing Republicans.

again with this left and right nonsense, whether you agree with what im saying or not, the FACT remains that both parties are exactly the same when it comes to foreighn and domestic policies.

there is no prevailing differences with the way either of them deal with the world as far as Policies go.

as far as the gov not breaking my balls.. well your right. Don't give them a reason to come for you and they wont, but thats for today.

let them continue on their path and they will be comeing to our doors for no reasons.

[amsterdam]

it appears to alot of people as if the dems have more of a "lets not worry about it" attitude.that isnt what what we need at this time.

[Marlboroman]

It would appear that way because its true. the Dem party is the same as the Rep party.

Reps have superior control over our GOV right now and even if the Dems managed to get a pres in it wouldnt matter much because the Reps control everything else.

so ya I can see why they would drawn that attitude, but in the same sentence is it a disregard for whats happening or is that being helped along by the Rep?

I think the image of Dems not being able to proceed politically is a direct result of Rep smear campaighn, but not solely the reason. the fact that the Rep party controls the GOV more now than ever is also helping. And lets face it the people on the Rep side of the invisible conflict have lots and lots of money. I dont mean allot i mean ALLOT.

and i think we can all agree that useing the media you can effectively smear mud on anyones name, or on any organization for that matter when you have lots and lots of money. and traditionally Rep are white collar and Dems are blue collar. That right there should give you a sense of the money factor seperating the 2 parties.

Rep have wealth, Dems dont, and for this simple reason the Rep party will always appear to be the stronger of the 2.

the 2 parties will never see eye to eye on the issues they argue over and thats done on purpose to keep us at eachothers throats. I feel 100% confident that if me and you actually sat down to discuss this shit we would be in agreement on allot of things and closer in the rest than you would probably care to admit.

Im gonna kick myself in the ass for all this later im sure. I normally try to stay away from these types of conversation because people dont want to hear it.

[Edgar]

Yeah, we shouldn't be giving them so much power, that nuts.
"Power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutely." <= VERY true words.

Republicans used to be the party of less government. (or so im told) Now it seems the only time they want less government is when cash flow is being restricted.

Thats not to say I'd ever vote Democrat either. Both parties are only playing to their lobbyists and few on either side actually give a damn about the public.

[amsterdam]

It would appear that way because its true. the Dem party is the same as the Rep party.

Reps have superior control over our GOV right now and even if the Dems managed to get a pres in it wouldnt matter much because the Reps control everything else.

so ya I can see why they would drawn that attitude, but in the same sentence is it a disregard for whats happening or is that being helped along by the Rep?

I think the image of Dems not being able to proceed politically is a direct result of Rep smear campaighn, but not solely the reason. the fact that the Rep party controls the GOV more now than ever is also helping. And lets face it the people on the Rep side of the invisible conflict have lots and lots of money. I dont mean allot i mean ALLOT.

and i think we can all agree that useing the media you can effectively smear mud on anyones name, or on any organization for that matter when you have lots and lots of money. and traditionally Rep are white collar and Dems are blue collar. That right there should give you a sense of the money factor seperating the 2 parties.

Rep have wealth, Dems dont, and for this simple reason the Rep party will always appear to be the stronger of the 2.

the 2 parties will never see eye to eye on the issues they argue over and thats done on purpose to keep us at eachothers throats. I feel 100% confident that if me and you actually sat down to discuss this shit we would be in agreement on allot of things and closer in the rest than you would probably care to admit.

Im gonna kick myself in the ass for all this later im sure. I normally try to stay away from these types of conversation because people dont want to hear it.



do you know who donates all the money to the democratic party??rich people!!!!!!!!!!!!!malibu ,new york,HOLLYWOOD.

THATS THEIR BASE.RICH PEOPLE.that is some backwards thinking.everyone in politics knows that the democrats are the party of the rich.look at their donor lists wich are public records.all the money is raised at malibu beach parties.in the 2000 recount gore raised 85% of his money at one MALIBU BEACH PARTY.

[Marlboroman]

do you know who donates all the money to the democratic party??rich people!!!!!!!!!!!!!malibu ,new york,HOLLYWOOD.

THATS THEIR BASE.RICH PEOPLE.that is some backwards thinking.everyone in politics knows that the democrats are the party of the rich.look at their donor lists wich are public records.all the money is raised at malibu beach parties.in the 2000 recount gore raised 85% of his money at one MALIBU BEACH PARTY.


your going to try and tell me that there is more money in Malibu than on wallstreet? of course the money comes from rich people ... who the fuck else can afford to give it away. Im saying the republicans have more of it. AND they control the GOV.

[Edgar]

do you know who donates all the money to the democratic party??rich people!!!!!!!!!!!!!malibu ,new york,HOLLYWOOD.

THATS THEIR BASE.RICH PEOPLE.that is some backwards thinking.everyone in politics knows that the democrats are the party of the rich.look at their donor lists wich are public records.all the money is raised at malibu beach parties.in the 2000 recount gore raised 85% of his money at one MALIBU BEACH PARTY.

Yeah? Well where did Bush get his funding? I'll give you 1 guess.

[Marlboroman]

Yeah? Well where did Bush get his funding? I'll give you 1 guess.


WHOA ease up Edger lol you have to give Amsterdam the truth in small doses bro lol

[amsterdam]

30 million donations of under 5000$$$$.we are talking about the recount money.bush raised 13.5 million dollars in donations 5000$$ or less.check it out.study it.gore raised 5.6 million with more than half raised at two parties,one was a malibu beach party,the other was a new york party at the ritz.

[amsterdam]

like i said,the party of the rich.why do you think we pick up african american voters every time?magic?

they are beginning to see the truth and they dont like it.

[Marlboroman]

30 million donations of under 5000$$$$.we are talking about the recount money.bush raised 13.5 million dollars in donations 5000$$ or less.check it out.study it.gore raised 5.6 million with more than half raised at two parties,one was a malibu beach party,the other was a new york party at the ritz.


you dont get it do you? who is in control of the GOV? Republicans

who waged a war based on things that havent heppen yet? Republicans

who makes the tanks, airplanes, guns, ammo, body armor, munitions, for such a war? Republicans

who makes the money from the spoils or war? Republicans

So.... we just had a really profittable war and on top of that secured millions of barrels of oil.

So who is holding the money smart guy?

[amsterdam]

do yousay the things you hear from moveon.org?its the argument 17 year olds with dreadlocks make.good stuff.

i will promise you in 20 years George W. Bush will be regarded as one of the greatest presidents in history.mark my word.

[Marlboroman]

do yousay the things you hear from moveon.org?its the argument 17 year olds with dreadlocks make.good stuff.

i will promise you in 20 years George W. Bush will be regarded as one of the greatest presidents in history.mark my word.


you never answer any question that is asked of you do you?

you simply make statements that can be used in your favor.

Ive never been to moveon.org

and in 20 years we will have either gotten rid of him or he will still be there, I myself think its conceiveable that they will find a way to keep W in office. He fits the role so damn well.

[amsterdam]

you never answer any question that is asked of you do you?

you simply make statements that can be used in your favor.

Ive never been to moveon.org

and in 20 years we will have either gotten rid of him or he will still be there, I myself think its conceiveable that they will find a way to keep W in office. He fits the role so damn well.


well that idea is just plain stupid.w in office for 20 years?simple like a child.

[Marlboroman]

well that idea is just plain stupid.w in office for 20 years?simple like a child.

they have already violated the constitution man. why is this concept so far fetch for you to see?

and not for nothin but children are the most honest people on the planet.

thanks

[amsterdam]

garbage.

[Edgar]

30 million donations of under 5000$$$$.we are talking about the recount money.bush raised 13.5 million dollars in donations 5000$$ or less.check it out.study it.gore raised 5.6 million with more than half raised at two parties,one was a malibu beach party,the other was a new york party at the ritz.

uhh 13.5 million... What about the rest of the $90 million or so? Here, let me give u a few examples of the poor dirt farmin types that he got much of his campaign money from: Charles J. Wyly, Jr., $210,273; Dennis R. Berman, $175,000; Louis A. Beecherl, Jr., $154,000; Tom Loeffler, $141,000; and, Richard Heath, $124,449.

He got about $21.2 million from 212 individuals... Rich individuals...

[CletusVandam]

Very insightful Amsterdam. Havent heard from u yet and wasnt sure if u were still interested.

[Marlboroman]

you still dont answer any questions there Amsterdam. that is a fact home slice.

you call my views garbage while not offering any of your own. you are no longer worth my attention or the attention of the people on this board.

when you can have an adult conversation, that requires a back and forth rhetotic, we can speak again.

[CletusVandam]

Hi Amsterdam
Although we as Americans have not necessarily lost any rights, the security and freedom of movement enjoyed by most before 9-11 has certainly been altered.

[Hydrizzle]

who waged a war based on things that havent heppen yet? Republicans

This is the same old argument I'd rather not bring up, but here goes... How would you liek to wake up to a mushroom cloud where New York used to be? Because that's a possibility! I know your thinking, "but there were no WMD's!". Well, THEY DIDN'T KNOW THAT!!! Nuclear weapons are something you take chances with. Neither are the type of people that would actually use such a weapon.


who makes the tanks, airplanes, guns, ammo, body armor, munitions, for such a war? Republicans

Wow what an ignorant comment. The people that actually MAKE the weapons are manufacturing workers, with no set party lines. Its not like the factories only hire republicans. If you think it is bad to have a military, look up the fates of countries in the past which have had weak militaries. Most not good.


who makes the money from the spoils or war? Republicans

Actually, the US is losing massive amounts of money. There are not many spoils of war from an impoverished, 3rd world country. I know you are saying,"but we're stealing thier oil!". Well then, why are our gas prices so high if we have heisted the innocent Iraquis?


So.... we just had a really profittable war and on top of that secured millions of barrels of oil.

So who is holding the money smart guy?

Who is holding the money? The Iraqui people, who's country has had millions invested in it because the US got rid of thier tyrannical dictator who killed millions (4th biggest killer in history in case you didn't know)

Any other comepletly un-based "facts" for me to de-base?

[sensiskunk]

do yousay the things you hear from moveon.org?its the argument 17 year olds with dreadlocks make.good stuff.

i will promise you in 20 years George W. Bush will be regarded as one of the greatest presidents in history.mark my word.
LMFAOROFLLOL, THAT HAS TO BE THE FUNNIEST SHIT IVE EVER HEARD!

[Hydrizzle]

He rpobably won't because the ones doing the ranking will be in the media... and we all know how our media friends love Bush.... he will go down in history as the Ballsiest president, and the funniest.

[sensiskunk]

The funniest looking, or stupid funny? I think a lil bit of both, cause he looks like a hermit, and he says the dumbest shit that everyone laughs at! Btw, hydrizzle, you been posting up a grip, lol, jk!

[Marlboroman]

This is the same old argument I'd rather not bring up, but here goes... How would you liek to wake up to a mushroom cloud where New York used to be? Because that's a possibility! I know your thinking, "but there were no WMD's!". Well, THEY DIDN'T KNOW THAT!!! Nuclear weapons are something you take chances with. Neither are the type of people that would actually use such a weapon.

lol this is funny, you aregument is that we shouldnt take chances with people who would actually use such a weapon ..... the United States is the only country to ever use such a weapon. So who should the world be afraid of?

Wow what an ignorant comment. The people that actually MAKE the weapons are manufacturing workers, with no set party lines. Its not like the factories only hire republicans. If you think it is bad to have a military, look up the fates of countries in the past which have had weak militaries. Most not good.

Whats ignorant is to think that its the workers actually see the wealth from the sales of such weapons. more likely those factory workers you speak of hold another and possibly 2 other jobs to make ends meet. Also no I dont think its wise to have a weak military, i think its unwise to leave leave its direction in the current caretakers hands.



Actually, the US is losing massive amounts of money. There are not many spoils of war from an impoverished, 3rd world country. I know you are saying,"but we're stealing thier oil!". Well then, why are our gas prices so high if we have heisted the innocent Iraquis?

No, I am not saying we are stealing their Oil, matter of fact we are getting paid in oil to rebuil;d their country. with contracts held by world wide construction companies such as Haliburton. So while the US loses millions paying for the war those american companies make the money off the rebuilding. So you say thats fine its money comeing back to the US. And thats just BS because not much of that money will ever trickle down thru the economy. This only gives you another example of how the republicans are receiving even more money.

Who is holding the money? The Iraqui people, who's country has had millions invested in it because the US got rid of thier tyrannical dictator who killed millions (4th biggest killer in history in case you didn't know)

this was more of a sarcastic remark, and it refered to which political party held more money, and since it appears you took my comment to heart I'll go ahead and guess that you lost sight of what my posting has been about.

the secured millions of barrels of oil coment come form a previuos post that I stated reasons for the US to secure oil supplies for the future.


Any other comepletly un-based "facts" for me to de-base?

lol

[Marlboroman]

lol this is funny, your aregument is that we shouldnt take chances with people who would actually use such a weapon ..... the United States is the only country to ever use such a weapon. So who should the world be afraid of?



Whats ignorant is to think that its the workers actually see the wealth from the sales of such weapons. more likely those factory workers you speak of hold another and possibly 2 other jobs to make ends meet. Also no I dont think its wise to have a weak military, i think its unwise to leave leave its direction in the current caretakers hands.


No, I am not saying we are stealing their Oil, matter of fact we are getting paid in oil to rebuil;d their country. with contracts held by world wide construction companies such as Haliburton. So while the US loses millions paying for the war those american companies make the money off the rebuilding. So you say thats fine its money comeing back to the US. And thats just BS because not much of that money will ever trickle down thru the economy. This only gives you another example of how the republicans are receiving even more money.

this was more of a sarcastic remark, and it refered to which political party held more money, and since it appears you took my comment to heart I'll go ahead and guess that you lost sight of what my posting has been about.

the secured millions of barrels of oil coment come form a previuos post that I stated reasons for the US to secure oil supplies for the future



lol

[Hydrizzle]

Yes, we are the only on eto ever use a nuke, but I'd say we had a damn good reason. In case you don't remember 25,851 casualties just in Iwo Jima. Think of the number of dead on both sides if we would have invaded mainland Japan. Thier warrior mentality of no surrender, die with honor would have caused massive casualties. So the nukes, without a doubt, saved lives. Did you know that more civilians died in Japan as a result of firebombs than the nukes? Little known fact. So who should the world be afraid of? Let me tell you, a government with a dictator who hold ALL THE POWER! IF Kim-Jong says launch a nuke, then launch a nuke they shall. Not so simple for the US.

.... I don't quite get the second half of your post... perhaps u meant to quote me on something?

[Psycho4Bud]

This is hillarious! "The U.S. was the first to use nukes so can't trust them!" Lets actually look at WW2. The Japaneese were a few short weeks away from having nukes themselves with the targets being San Fran or the Panama Canal.....but I'm sure they wouldn't have done that...RIGHT! And as for the invasion to aquire land or wealth; look back into your own pasts sweethearts and thats where you'll find that crap. Did the Brits liberate the Falklands or just maintain their hold. The French and Spanish have their own issues from past atrosities for nothing more than gold. I'm sure South American Aztecs love the Spanish folk.
If the U.S. waged war in order to get "territory and wealth", why the hell isn't Europe considered to be a state? You know...like the Russians did during WW2. :D

[Hydrizzle]

Psycho, you can't sway these crazy conspiracy-theorists, no matter how hard you try. They have, after all, been brainwashed by the liberal hippie aliens, who are at war with the neo-con Klingons, who have a mind control-device in all politicians. This is, of course at the same time that Christians are staging a massive uprising in order to outlaw sex and fun for everyone.

[amsterdam]

hahahah,lol!!hitler was george bushs mentor and grandfather-in-law!!!


a police state!!!ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!new world order!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Hydrizzle]

No Amsterdam, you got it all wrong.... heres how it is: After WWII, hitler's body was frozen by Stalin, and he gave it as a gift to the US.... well you see, the neo-cons got a hold of it, and transferred his brain into a microchip.... I think you know where it goes from here.... cyborg Hitler Bush, yep! That explains those strange ridges on his back..... and how Bush is so evil.

[XTC]

No Amsterdam, you got it all wrong.... heres how it is: After WWII, hitler's body was frozen by Stalin, and he gave it as a gift to the US.... well you see, the neo-cons got a hold of it, and transferred his brain into a microchip.... I think you know where it goes from here.... cyborg Hitler Bush, yep! That explains those strange ridges on his back..... and how Bush is so evil.


Of Course!!! Its so Obivious now

[sensiskunk]

These mf's are fucked up, lmao!

[Hydrizzle]

You don't even want to know what happened to Stalin's brain after he died....

[amsterdam]

it was used in the missle that brought down building 7.

[Hydrizzle]

What about Pol Pot?

[amsterdam]

dont you mean "uncle" Pot?

[Hydrizzle]

Why would I call a man who sent millions to torture camps "uncle"??

[Hydrizzle]

Ohh LOL i get it amsterdam, ur saying all the liberals call him that, good one, lol.