300w LED Array?

[bigsby]

That top level sticky on LEDs is crazy long. I've read through some of it but by no means all. I'm moving this over from a thread on venting that has veered into an LED discussion. I thought I should post it somewhere more relevant so everyone interested in LED applications can benefit. This needs tutorial which I will commit to working if I go the LED route.

Here it is:

Background. I'm considering my lighting options. $$ is a consideration but I have a decent budget. I'd rather spend a few $$ more for lighting system that works well than find out after the fact that my setup needs supplemental lighting to work properly. I am / was looking at a 400w HPS to light a 3'6 x 3'6 area. I can change the area size and dimensions as it has not yet been constructed. I'm looking to grow 3 - 4 good yield plants per grow.

So I am now considering the LED option and trying to scope out best product and costs for my setup. I found this 300w array:

Sell led hydroponic light(300W) (http://www.tradekey.com/selloffer_view/id/2413317.htm)

Would this work for my needs? I'm guessing yes. It claims to be equivalent of a 600w HID. I can't find a distributor in the US or price info. I'm still getting up to speed on LED setups so please feel free to educate me on wavelength options for best flowering. Any help appreciated.

[bigsby]

I'm seeing a few listed at $800 - $1,000 in the US. Is this the best I can do? If so, that's pretty well out of my price range.

[stra8outtaWeed]

ok Bigs~i am overseas in China right now and can't open many attachments..i feel lucky i can still view the forum and play a little..it is helping the time go by...you don'e want a single unit...you want either 2 or 3 sepaerate units because with LED's you want the light come in at the plant from many angles...so don't be fooled by more wattage in a single panel is better than a lower wattage panel. most panels have the LEDs packed tightly together which in my opinion defeats the purpose of being able to put them lower on to your plant canopy....with 2 lights you can have better coverage and have a lower light canopy!

my lights go for $450/150 watt bar and they use 3w LEDs which is what gets me the results and having good penetration of light...i could see what international; freight is if you cannot find anything similar or you can instant message me on skype or yahoo and i will share with you what i can :thumbsup:

[khyberkitsune]

For your 3.5x3.5 room, a single 120w unit is well more than enough but if you are worried about penetration, get three or four 50w units and spread them around. And make sure your walls are highly reflective (white material of any sort will NOT cut it, you want some metallic reflective material, foil, mylar, something.)

[bigsby]

China eh? Wish I were in China. I'd find a two or three ways to make the time go by. On a boat? Oh, that doesn't sound so good unless it's a yacht of some descriptions... My travel days are done. 15 years living in the Middle East. It sure was a blast but not so good with small children.

I'm in the US so I should be able to find what I need if I decide to go with the LEDs. I'm getting closer to being sold on the LED setup. Now for cost and configuration. That will be the determinant. I'm convinced that the technology can do the job.

So now I'm thinking 4 ~50w arrays. 3w diodes, wide spaced if I can find them. This is all very new to me. I'm reading up but it is hard to find trustworthy info. I'm assuming that I'll be looking for a mix of warm / cold wave spread. I'm thinking that I'm going to augment with a couple of CFLs. Extremely low cost so why not.

If anyone else has thoughts or pointers please chime in. I love that it diminishes the heat issue. I can now think about scrubbing right in the grow room. Suddenly my set up is much easier. I hope I can make the economics work!

[stra8outtaWeed]

Well that changeseverything...i thought you were on the other side of the pond....you can look in my albums and hit my email and between khyb or i we can point you in the right direction to get you going :thumbsup:

[khyberkitsune]

In a 3.5x3.5 foot box, you don't need 3w LEDs unless you're planning on growing a plant to massive size. How tall is your box?

[bigsby]

I haven't built my box yet. The area is 12' wide x 6' deep x 6.5' tall. I can frame whatever shape makes the most sense. I'd like to grow 4 big healthy plants at a time and if I decide I need more out comes the hammer and I re-frame it in a few hours. I was going with a square shape b/c I thought that was best practice with the HPS I was considering. Thoughts on layout much appreciated. Also appreciate the mentoring. I'll repay with documentation...

[bigsby]

str8 I sent you a yahoo friend add request. Hope we can connect.

Actually no I didn't. It gives me an error - invalid user name...

[khyberkitsune]

Okay, when you say 4 big healthy plants - how tall, how wide?

[bigsby]

You're asking all of the hard questions! I'm looking at whatever I can fit in my space. My thinking is constantly evolving here. Originally I sent of 3.5 square and figured on 3 - 4 plants at 4' - 5' tall. I've done a few out door grows with mix results and that was years ago. I'm pulling this together with decent resources, a willingness to learn, and passion for mastering whatever it is I turn my attention to. The LEDs are looking better and better.

So I guess I'd veg. to 12" - 18" inches and flower 4 - 5.5 feet assuming I can light it properly and strain dependent (obviously) along with all the other variables. If I go LED I guess I need to consider ScrOG too. I'm guessing that each plant will want more than 1' diameter.

[stra8outtaWeed]

what..invalid..damn technology:wtf:
go to my led grow album and hit my email and we can exchange info there and i will get you the right yahoo! :thumbsup::thumbsup:

i know the skype works:jointsmile:

[bigsby]

I'm not seeing your email on the album page. I'm missing something. My yahoo ID is bigsbybigs

[khyberkitsune]

You're asking all of the hard questions! I'm looking at whatever I can fit in my space. My thinking is constantly evolving here. Originally I sent of 3.5 square and figured on 3 - 4 plants at 4' - 5' tall. I've done a few out door grows with mix results and that was years ago. I'm pulling this together with decent resources, a willingness to learn, and passion for mastering whatever it is I turn my attention to. The LEDs are looking better and better.

So I guess I'd veg. to 12" - 18" inches and flower 4 - 5.5 feet assuming I can light it properly and strain dependent (obviously) along with all the other variables. If I go LED I guess I need to consider ScrOG too. I'm guessing that each plant will want more than 1' diameter.

Well, if you veg to 12-18 inches, don't expect your plants to get much taller than thirty-six to forty inches. For that, 3w diodes are pretty unnecessary. You want 3w diodes when you want have MASSIVE plants that take up a large wide area - with 3.5x3.5 feet.

I'm still thinking with your plan either 5 50w units (one over each plant and one a little lower in the center to catch the undercanopy) or 3 90w units.

Don't let it evolve constantly - settle on a room and plant size, and amount, grow, then expand after you're done with the grow. I tried the always-adjustable setup, way too much work and hassle, and I'm one that prefers manual labor. Easier to set it, forget it, and focus on the plants. The only thing that should change is the light height as the plant grows, and of course fresh water/nutes.

You can catch me on yahoo and skype as well - my name here is my name on those.

[bigsby]

I go back and forth on the LEDs. I have a 6 - 8 week window before I can build my room so I have plenty of time to read. What I'm missing in my research are LED grow logs from more than just a few people. I'd love to go this route as it would ease numerous issues but they are hard to commit to given the scant success stories.

One resource that might interest others is this little calculator that compares electricity savings using an LED vs. 600w HPS. Pretty impressive numbers. Now this thing is calibrated for tomatoes etc. so I'm not saying this is the product to use. Far from it. And before anyone flames me, I'm not saying that this could replace a 600w HPS with the same results. Please. But it is a nice little tool to gauge cost savings.

Growrevolution.com - Savings Calculator (http://www.growrevolution.com/calculator.php)

[stra8outtaWeed]

if they flame you it is from lack of knowledge or talking to somebody who used inferior product and saying LED's don't work.

some folks have built there own panels such as Weezard..he has great photo album...Dreaded Hermie...Khyberkitsune has great scientific knowledge of how they work...and obviously look at mine:D

but i am saving approx $200/month in energy by cutting out the AC and 2 1000w HPS and 1 600w MH then i also have no bulbs to replace for ten years and with bulb replacement cost and energy i will save approx(on todays rates) $29,000 over a 10 year span so i am basically getting a new truck for growing with LED's:jointsmile:

[khyberkitsune]

"What I'm missing in my research are LED grow logs from more than just a few people."

ICMag - 22w LED - 38g harvest. Pinstripe's 2nd try: PC case + 22W LED - International Cannagraphic Magazine Forums (http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=146324) - my personal favorite grow. Second try and almost hitting 2g/w; that will beat almost every non-vertical HPS user all day every day.

"I'm not saying that this could replace a 600w HPS with the same results."

120w LED would grow the same-size plant as a 600w HPS, but you wouldn't yield like the 600w HPS simply because the 600w HPS offers its usable wavelengths in much higher photon flux densities than the LED unit. Now, bear in mind that most LED units are running 120-160 degree diodes (even mine are 120 degrees as I grow short plants.) However, narrowing the beam angle will create the necessary higher photon flux density. 120 degrees is good for up to about 2 feet maximum if the canopy isn't too thick. REALLY thick canopies won't get further than a foot or so. Bump to 90 degrees, you get up to three feet. Sixty degrees will go even further, almost five feet. Thirty degrees requires tightly-packed diodes but SWEET MOTHER it's almost like shining a laser in your eyes when you look at it, and it can grow some mighty-fine plants. Of course, with such high-focus panels, unless they are massive they're usually only good for one or two plants, LARGE ones yes, but only one or two.