NEW SETUP QUESTIONS

[celtsbos34]

finally i moved into my new house. i got a huge basement and i wanna do this up right. i went to canada got myself like 100 high quality seeds(thanks ontario seed bank) and now its time to set up the room i;m thinkin 6 600w MH during veg and 6 600 HPS during flowring my room is 15ft wide 28ft long and 7.5ft tall... i am gonna throw a 10,000BTU ac down there and i wanna set up some sort of ventilation. let me know any advice or input on the lighting and if u think the room is large enough for this operation.. ANY INPUT WOULD BE AWESOME... THANKS

[SpaceNeedle]

Well, you won't need but maybe 2 600W MH, and you should be able to have the other 10 600W HPS for flowering. When plants are vegging, you won't need as much space. Your veg room should be about 1/4 the size of your flowering room. I would suggest you start off a lot smaller to begin if you've never done this before. 12 600w lights going at the same time will throw off 24,000 BTUs of heat. If you have a 10K BTU a/c, it is gonna be pretty toasty in there on a hot summer day. In other words it will take 24,000 BTU air conditioner to keep the same temperature inside your grow room as it is in the rest of the basement.
I really feel you need to get your feet wet before you get into this. What are you gonna do with 100 seeds? There's no way I would start off with that many! I'd start off with a little light and max 20 seeds, let them grow and find out which ones are male and female. Then cull the males and make clones of the females.
You're going way too fast.

SN

[khronik]

You don't need nearly as much light for vegging as you do for flowering, and you should perhaps look into getting some T5 fluorescent lights, at least for vegging. They're more efficient and better for young plants than MH lights. If you live anywhere near canada, your basement will lose a lot of heat to the ground, pretty much all year, so you're not too bad off as far as temperatures. Plus, in the winter you'll have nice warm floors. :D

Do you have any natural gas or propane appliances in your basement by any chance? If so, these can help boost your CO2. For instance, you can get a gas hot water heater to vent directly into the basement. A furnace, though, would use way too much oxygen to be able to vent that straight into your basement.

[celtsbos34]

im in the north east so its gonna be good when i get all those lights pumping in in 2 months...Ive done a couple plants before but now i am doing it for business purposes. its time for me to do it right. i wanna get HID so i can use conversion bulbs...im thinkin like 6 lamps with realistically after germination and shit about 6 or 7 groups of 10 so pretty much 600w for 10 plants
i think i have a grasp on this i just hope i'm not going over board

[khronik]

If you set up for a continuous cycle, ie, you have batches of plants in several stages of grow at any given time, you won't need conversion bulbs, since you'll always have the same types of lights going. And really, that's the way most professionals do it. It maximizes your space usage.

If you get digital ballasts, you can use regular MH or HPS bulbs in them, and you won't have to bother with expensive, short-lived conversion bulbs. Plus you'll be more energy efficient and you'll have less noise.

[smokinbuds21]

i also agree khronik trust me take the advice that is alot of light!!!

wait till you get your first light bill maintain a 100 plants i hope you have alot of people me and my friend have a couple plants as his house and we do alot for them little bastards were talkin startin with 7 or 8 and get the most females and do clones trust me you dont want to start with all that light all that money and dont know how many females you have it could turn out really bad start out with a quarter of that light and 30 seeds hope for 15 females maybee more if growing conditions are intact!! just tellin u what i think but what do i know? newby also!

[bongerstonerd00d]

Gezus d00d. Running 12 600 watters at once ? First of all I'd go with 1000 watters. 600 watters are a tad more efficent (lumens/watt), but when it comes to intensity, you cannot beat the 1000 watt lights.

I'd be nervous as a whore in church drawing that amount of juice, but to each their own. I have no idea what you pay per kwh, but it will not be cheap running that many lights.

Deff go with seperate veg/flower rooms. Also have you an area set up with 2-4 C.F.L.'s or a T-5 4 tube 4 footer where you can root clones, get seedlings going, etc.

That way move rooted clones to veg room, start new clones, once vegged to flower, start cycle over. Beautiful setup. Never any down time. Thats exactly how I do it when I am growing.

Will take ya a few grows to get timing down, but then you OWN it. KEEP EXCELLENT DETAILED NOTES!!!!!!!!!!! They are invaluable for the next grow, and next grow, and on and on and on.

Best of luck with your grow,

b0nger

[celtsbos34]

only 6 600w not 12 and i have a 8 month lease so i am doing 1 big project than to the next house...im just wondering is a 600w hid light enough for like 10 plants?

[stinkyattic]

You want 3 rooms ideally:
Veg
Flower
Propagation- you will eventually keep your prop setup in here, either an EZ Cloner (the one the size of a football field) or the simple rapidrooter -n- dome setups.

Actually nevermind, I just noticed that Bonger told you the exact same thing. Listen to the d00d.

Go SOX!

[celtsbos34]

guys what dont u understand i dont wnana do cycles...i wanna do 1 big grow than move outta the house. no 3 rooms no 3 cycles...1 big cycle than i move...i just wanna know how many lights i should buy to mount on the cieling of the basement and what kinda venting and stuff like that. i dont wanna use floro's i'm trying to grow a big yield of killer shit...i want HID's i wanna do this BIG

[keeko]

thats putting a lot of risk on one chance

[celtsbos34]

i have a generator to power everything...someone please tell me how much lighting i should use for this humongous room , 15ft wide 28ft long and 7.5ft tall i know ive read some equation for wattage per sq ft..someone please help

[khronik]

you should have 400 - 600 watts of HID lighting per square meter. one square meter is about 10 square feet.

[celtsbos34]

i was reading that its better to have more lights such as 3 (400w) than 1 (1000w) so i feel like every sq meter i am gonna do 600w
whats the deal with digital ballast? can they use both MH and HPS?

what kind of reflectors should i do to keep the light balanced???

[bejay]

some digital will do both mh and hps and some wont suggest you find out from the manfacturer first, or if your going with 600 guess it really doesnt matter as your stuck with conversion bulbs from what ive seen, and if your planing to use that entire 15 by 28 space you need about 21000 watts of hid lighting hope that generators a big one.
the 1000 watt light is your best light for intensity and if you was going to grow large plants for max yield would pobably use 1000 watt lights.
it is a big investment and big risk for one grow but if you have decent luck with germination you could easily have 50 females from 100 seeds and could veg for 2-3 months and put 4 large female plants under each light obviosly you will not have enough plants or lights to even come close to using the entire space.

[jamstigator]

At one 600 watt light per square meter, if you used that entire space up for flowering, you'd need 42 600-watt lights, and a ginormous generator. Or a majority share in your nearest nuclear plant. ;)

[PharmaCan]

Do you have any natural gas or propane appliances in your basement by any chance? If so, these can help boost your CO2. For instance, you can get a gas hot water heater to vent directly into the basement. A furnace, though, would use way too much oxygen to be able to vent that straight into your basement.

This is idiotic advice!!!

Do not ever vent any gas appliance anywhere other than to outside. Carbon Monoxice is a by product of combustion and it will kill you!

Venting gas appliances to the inside of your house will kill you!!!

Jeez, Khronic, get your head out of your ass and think before you post something like this. Bad grow advice can only ruin someone's crop. This kind of shit will get someone dead! :mad:

PC :pimp:

[the image reaper]

This is idiotic advice!!!

Do not ever vent any gas appliance anywhere other than to outside. Carbon Monoxice is a by product of combustion and it will kill you!

Venting gas appliances to the inside of your house will kill you!!!

Jeez, Khronic, get your head out of your ass and think before you post something like this. Bad grow advice can only ruin someone's crop. This kind of shit will get someone dead! :mad:

PC :pimp:

agreed ... VERY dangerous advice

[twoguysupnorth]

ive only seen the switchable ballast in 400 and 1000 w lights but i havnt shoped around too much. i originally wanted to do 600s too but decided on a 400 switchable first then when i can afford it get a couple of 600s hps(ive seen a ballast that can run 2 600s) and use the 400 for veg. obviously you are thinking much larger. good luck but as some one said all of those lights will be hotter than your ac can handle. and to vent that large of an area you will need some very powerfull fans.(noise) obviously you wont be covering every square foot of floor with lighting either. best i can think of is to do some figuring and section off an area that will handle the space for your lights. then cool that area and keep your ballast and heat generating appliances out of the grow area and vent into that part of the basement. a plus lol you might heat your house with your lights.

[stinkyattic]

Natural gas/LP is used to produce CO2 in GREENHOUSES.
NEVER EVER attempt to do this in an occupied building.

Furthermore, this thread is getting weirder than weird-
You are trying to run a giant cash-crop cycle and then move?
Honestly the questions you are asking are making me think you don'thave anywhere near the expertise or experience to pull off something like this.
Start small.
Remember the parable about the greedy crow who gets his head stuck in the urn because he refuses to drop the GIANT mouthful of grapes?
You're biting off more than I think you are prepared to chew.

[bongerstonerd00d]

28'x15'= 420 sq. ft. Since you wanna do that massive killer crop (we'll figure 50 watts per sq. ft), you only need ~ 20 (1000 watt H.P.S.) for flowering, or 35 600 watt H.P.S.

Yeah, you NEED a generator. Drawing 20 kw's/hour x 12 hours= 240 kwh's a day= 7200 kwh's per month. You WILL get someones attention.

GIve each plant 3'x3', thats only ~45 plants. You'll be busy as a one armed paper hanger with crotch itch come trim time.

Better know an electrican, HVAC guy, or be both, seriously. And that 10,000 BTU AC you have you can smash. It will be just as effective when running that kind of light.

Who said weird:D:D


b0nger


P.S. Post pictures when you have it all set up. I will eagerly await them.

[celtsbos34]

i feel like i am gonna get 6-600w HPS and some conversion bulbs with horizontal and vertical reflectors for diff part of the room and possibly some light movers, and grab dual digital ballast so i have as little heat making devices around. . the landlord is inspecting tommroow. and then our friend whos a construction worker is gonna come in and set everything up for us (lights ,ballast,ventilation) and pics will be in soon... guys be prepared the king is back

[PharmaCan]

i feel like i am gonna get 6-600w HPS and some conversion bulbs with horizontal and vertical reflectors for diff part of the room and possibly some light movers, and grab dual digital ballast so i have as little heat making devices around. . the landlord is inspecting tommroow. and then our friend whos a construction worker is gonna come in and set everything up for us (lights ,ballast,ventilation) and pics will be in soon... guys be prepared the king is back

:S2:

Uhhhh - you are talking about getting enough light for 72 square feet of growing area.

The court jester needed 200 sq.ft. just to apply for the job.

PC :rastasmoke:

[khronik]

This is idiotic advice!!!

Do not ever vent any gas appliance anywhere other than to outside. Carbon Monoxice is a by product of combustion and it will kill you!

Venting gas appliances to the inside of your house will kill you!!!

Jeez, Khronic, get your head out of your ass and think before you post something like this. Bad grow advice can only ruin someone's crop. This kind of shit will get someone dead! :mad:

PC :pimp:
First of all, many natural gas hot water heaters do not have vents, and just vent straight to the basement anyway! They don't burn enough gas that there is a danger of CO poisoning, but they do produce CO2. Gas ovens also vent directly to the air and probably use more fuel than a hot water heater. Your furnace, on the other had burns LOTS of gas, and to my credit I did say not to vent that into your basement. However, there is such a thing as a ventless heater, that is meant for heating indoor areas. These are designed to vent directly into the indoor air, and before you ask, no, they will not kill you.

Second of all, anything that burns gas will ONLY produce CO if there isn't enough ambient oxygen. If you have 50 plants in the basement, there will be, if they have any size to them.

Third of all, most new gas-burning appliances, furnaces included, will have an oxygen sensor that shuts off the gas if the oxygen drops to around 18%. This is nowhere near low enough to cause hypoxia or produce carbon monoxide. Admittedly, I probably should have mentioned that you should check and see if your appliances have these sensors if you want to be on the safe side.

[twoguysupnorth]

stinky i do remember a couple of stories like that, slightly different though. one of those were a lesson in rehab no less. how many pebbles can you get out of the jar in one try? so you would reach in and grab a handfull, then you couldnt get your hand out because you had a fistfull of pebbles.(you might get a couple out if you were carefull and grabbed them with your fingertips) the other was a couple of crows on a picnic table with pitchers of water on them, since the water was too low for them to stick their heads in and get a drink one of the crows decided to wait till it rained then he could surely get a drink, the other started picking up small pebbles and dropping them in his pitcher. eventually he had put in enough pebbles to raise the water level to the top of his pitcher and he could drink from it.
that garden will still be a humongus amount of work, but i am glad you found somebody to help you.

[PharmaCan]

First of all, many natural gas hot water heaters do not have vents, and just vent straight to the basement anyway!

This is absolute nonsense! :mad:

Look Khronic, I don't want to get in a big argument with you. But, really, gas appliances need to be vented to the outside. (40 years of construction experience here on my side.)

PC :pimp:

[khronik]

This is absolute nonsense! :mad:

Look Khronic, I don't want to get in a big argument with you. But, really, gas appliances need to be vented to the outside. (40 years of construction experience here on my side.)

PC :pimp:

well to be fair, the only gas water heater without a vent that I know of was at my last apartment. Maybe they don't make them like that anymore. But still, not all gas appliances (for example stoves and ventless heaters) have vents. These days oxygen sensors are mandatory and carbon monoxide detectors are cheap, so this is something I would do myself in such a situation.

However, I will admit that telling OTHER people that it's possible is probably a mistake, and thus take back what I said. It's far too easy to do it wrong and put people in danger.

[celtsbos34]

if i germinate 100 seeds and sex them i will prob get like 50-70 females... i wish i could get 100fems from 100seeds having the luck that all the seeds germinate and grow nicely. wow i wish i was god

[PharmaCan]

well to be fair, the only gas water heater without a vent that I know of was at my last apartment. Maybe they don't make them like that anymore. But still, not all gas appliances (for example stoves and ventless heaters) have vents. These days oxygen sensors are mandatory and carbon monoxide detectors are cheap, so this is something I would do myself in such a situation.


ROFLMAO - Man, where the fuck are you living, Dogpatch? You are talking about some really antiquated building practices.

Long ago, they used to let you vent the water heater cabinet, instead of the water heater. Perhaps that is what you had. :wtf:

I haven't seen an unvented heater since crap that was built in the 1930's & 40's - you know, before they cared too much about building codes.

Anyway, I'm just raggin on ya cuz really, I haven't seen the kind of construction you are talking about for a very long time. Nowadays, every precaution is taken to make sure that all the by-products of combustion are vented outside the occupied area. Even my gas oven has a vent through the roof and my gas range has a vented hood over it.

PeaCe :jointsmile:

[blackdomina]

anything said in this post is completely made up, i know nothing about marijuana i just pretend for fun Ok i have a few things to say, first off if your doing thin for business purposes .. use 1000 watters, they are practically the same price as 600s, and for economical reasons ..( bud density etc.) in my opinion 600 w are for clostet hobby growers or for veg lights. If your trying to flower for profit .. u need 1000 watters
K now comes the second part, how u plan on growing in the future should dictate what type of setup you buy .. for example say you decide to do a sea of green room with 6 1000 watters , at 25 plants per light .. you could have a veg room that consists of 1 1000 watt light for a few mother plants , and a few 6 footer fluorescents to veg clones under .. and that should be all you need for a veg setup to supply 6 1000 watters in flower.(if you were to do a sea of green setup). So in short to answer your qeustion what should you buy .. well ... it all depends on what type of flower setup you were hoping to have. If your doing commercial in my opinion sea of green is the way to go .it requires less lights for veg , and in my opinion if you do it old school method u need more veg lights , and in my opinion your better off using all that extra wattaga you would be throwing at veg lights into flower lights = more bud every cycle. Ill be more than happy to answer a question if u have one :rastasmoke: