The real Enemy

[Zimzum]

BC while I don't feel all the same about corporations as you, allot of good has come out of many(not saying all). Microsoft has opened technology high schools all over the world in low income areas. One was near my old Boston University dorm. FedEx flew over 230 tons of medical equipment to the victims of that 2005 tsunami. Coke and Pepsi donated tons of fresh bottled water to the area as well. And top corporate donor for 9/11 goes to ExxonMoble

There is still good that comes out of some.

[Fengzi]

My examples may be a micro view but they are just representations of the macro view. I do not believe that big corporations are doing more harm than good to humanity. Big corporations:

-Employ millions of people.
-Big corporations have needs that must be met by outside sources. These outside sources employ millions of people.
-Big corporations can take advantage of economies of scale, which smaller corporations cannot. The result is more efficient production and lower prices for all.
-Big corporations can afford the R&D costs that smaller companies cannot. Despite the fact that the pharmaceutical industry may be one of the closest thing to the "big bad wolf" in the corporate world, they do come up with new medicines, which save peoples lives. These medications, advances in artificial organs, prostheses, etc, are not cheap to develop, perfect, and get to market. The average guy working in his garage, no matter how well intentioned, just can't do it.
-Big corporations can absorb blows to their business much better than smaller companies do. A setback that would destroy a small company, and put its workers out of a job, is just a small hiccup for a large corporation.

I do agree that large corporations should be held to the same laws that everyone else is, and that the loopholes to get around these laws should be closed. We’re already seeing that happening after Enron. In fact, corporate America is now paying millions of $ to comply with the new laws that have resulted from the whole mess. And rightly so! You see, I’m not saying that we should give free reign to big corporations, I’m simply saying that big corporations, and capitalism, work.


What I've failed to see from the left is any realistic solution to this "problem". There is a lot of whining about it but nobody offers any alternatives. At least not any that will work. “Rebuild the railroad”??. Please, wtf for? While were at it, why don’t we just go back to horses and stagecoaches? You accuse me of not thinking outside the box. Well, when what lies on the other side is Never Never Land, then yeah, I guess I’m guilty. I kick myself for saying this, and I think a monkey could handle Iraq better than Bush, but G Dubya has a point when he says something like " My opponents criticize my Iraq plan but they don't have any alternative".

It may surprise you Blue, but I used to be a tree hugging, longhaired, protesting hippy myself. Then I started hanging out with these folks from Berkeley who loved to bitch about and protest the cause of the week but none really had any in depth knowledge of what they were bitching about or could offer any solution. There was just the standard knee jerk reaction to anything they thought should be bad. It just put a really bad taste in my mouth when it comes to the far left. They’re full of dreams of peace, love, and happiness for all, but that’s all they are- dreams. The reality is (except maybe for a few days a year out in the Nevada desert) good wishes, veggie burritos, hugs, and patchuli oil just isn’t a viable solution to the worlds problems.

[Fengzi]

Here's a hypothetical question BlueCat: You and 'Fred' are working together at a certain company. Your boss pulls you aside and says "Blue, your work is incredible. You could be the best ever at this line of work and have the potential to revolutionize the industry and be wildly successful. Only one problem. You are so good that we don't need Fred anymore. So, I give you a choice. You either need to cut down your productivity, become complacent and remain where you are forever. Or, accept the fact that for you to succeed, Fred has to lose his job". So Blue, what's your choice?

My choice would be to speak with my bosses boss because if I am that good and the best my boss can do is the Rumsfeld solution, drop productivity or down size its not my co worker that needs firing.

.

LOL, Why didn't I see this coming. Shit, even a blind man could have seen this response coming from a mile away. I was hoping for a specific response but should have figured you would find a way to wiggle out of it.

The question itself was a simplification of the fact that, in the real world, in order to be successful there are hard choices to be made, and very often it comes down to the lesser of two evils. I'm not talling about questions such as choosing the legal, or illegal, path or between clearly immoral and moral decisions. I'm talking about the simple fact that many times in business, for someone to succeed someone else must be hurt.

So, let's go back to my question. Fred is clearly not productive. The boss has given him additional training, and tried him out in several positions, but he just isn't cutting it. But the boss has a good heart and doesn't want to fire Fred. But to keep Fred you can not advance. It's a simple question of distributing the resources. So, once again, what do you choose?

You see, businesses face these questions every day. While it would be nice if the boss had a magic solution and such awesome management skill that Fred could keep his job, most people do not. And, if they did have such awesome skills, they'd grow their organization into a huge corporation and the left would still bitch.

[BlueCat]

Well you have changed the scenario but okay lets see...he is a non productive worker.. THE BOSS should let him go and maybe he will find the niche he belongs in. It still would not be my choice it is the responsibility of the boss to choose who is doing the better job. If he chooses wrong it reflects on him. I'd fire that freeloading dude and take the smart one to dinner

SO explain to me what that ^ has to do with this?

THE TOP 100 CORPORATE CRIMINALS OF THE 1990's

1) F. Hoffmann-La Roche Ltd.
Type of Crime: Antitrust
Criminal Fine: $500 million
12 Corporate Crime Reporter 21(1), May 24, 1999

2) Daiwa Bank Ltd.
Type of Crime: Financial
Criminal Fine: $340 million
10 Corporate Crime Reporter 9(3), March 4, 1996

3) BASF Aktiengesellschaft
Type of Crime: Antitrust
Criminal Fine: $225 million
12 Corporate Crime Reporter 21(1), May 24, 1999

4) SGL Carbon Aktiengesellschaft (SGL AG)
Type of Crime: Antitrust
Criminal Fine: $135 million
12 Corporate Crime Reporter 19(4), May 10, 1999

5) Exxon Corporation and Exxon Shipping
Type of Crime: Environmental
Criminal Fine: $125 million
5 Corporate Crime Reporter 11(3), March 18, 1991

6) UCAR International, Inc.
Type of Crime: Antitrust
Criminal Fine: $110 million
12 Corporate Crime Reporter 15(6), April 13, 1998

7) Archer Daniels Midland
Type of Crime: Antitrust
Criminal Fine: $100 million
10 Corporate Crime Reporter 40(1), October 21, 1996

8)(tie) Banker's Trust
Type of Crime: Financial
Criminal Fine: $60 million
12 Corporate Crime Reporter 11(1), March 15, 1999

8)(tie) Sears Bankruptcy Recovery Management Services
Type of Crime: Fraud
Criminal Fine: $60 million
13 Corporate Crime Reporter 7(1), February 15, 1999

10) Haarman & Reimer Corp.
Type of Crime: Antitrust
Criminal fine: $50 million
11 Corporate Crime Reporter 5(4), February 3, 1997

and on and on and on I just listed a mere 10...

http://www.corporatecrimereporter.com/top100.html

May this will slow it down a little...

http://www.cleanupwashington.org/blo...m?BE_ID=100274

[psychocat]

The biggest enemy of the American people is the complacencey that allows this kind of stupidity to flourish : http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?...3A%22stupid%22

Big business is very dirty, generosity of business to charity is BS (it's all about tax breaks which they get for donating) and it's all about cheap goods and cheap labour for maximum profit, they don't care about you or the sweat shop labour that supplies most of thier goods.

I have never had problems with money and I don't suppose I ever will but the difference between me and the boys who work for corporations is that I refuse to be dishonest, they thrive on it.

[BlueCat]

BC while I don't feel all the same about corporations as you, allot of good has come out of many(not saying all). Microsoft has opened technology high schools all over the world in low income areas. One was near my old Boston University dorm. FedEx flew over 230 tons of medical equipment to the victims of that 2005 tsunami. Coke and Pepsi donated tons of fresh bottled water to the area as well. And top corporate donor for 9/11 goes to ExxonMoble

There is still good that comes out of some.

Hi Zimzum...SO how do YOU feel toward Exxon or Coke? Do you watch what they do or just accept that they follow the law?

I said there are SOME good corporations exxon or coke are not...my beef is with the top 100 corporate crooks...you can name this good business and that good business but that is not the issue and it does not justify what the real crooks are doing..

I'm suppose to feel better about exxon because they donated the most money during 9/11? I don't follow that type of reasoning sorry.

Exxon Corporation and Exxon Shipping
Type of Crime: Environmental
Criminal Fine: $125 million

Exxon Corporation and Exxon Shipping pled guilty to federal criminal charges in connection with the March 24, 1989 Exxon Valdez oil spill.


The company was assessed a $125 million criminal fine.
Attorney General Dick Thornburgh called the fine "the largest single environmental criminal recovery ever enacted."
The companies pled guilty to misdemeanor violations of federal environmental laws.
Approximately 11 million gallons of crude oil spilled from the Valdez, fouling 700 miles of Alaska shoreline, killing birds and fish, and destroying the way of life of thousands of Native Americans.

ANOTHER: Exxon Corporation pled guilty to federal charges in connection with a spill last year of 567,000 gallons of home heating oil into Arthur Kill, a narrow waterway which separates New York from New Jersey. Exxon entered the plea as part of a $15 million settlement with local, state and federal governments.

Exxon was fined $200,000 the maximum allowed by law, but paid an additional $4.8 million in restitution as part of a $15 million package global settlement.



They just plead guilty and pay the fines they can afford to do it over and over again raping the earth and paying the fines..


This was interesting..


The mock trial of ExxonMobil, held at the University of Texas in Dallas, found the company guilty of crimes against humanity for its oil production and exploration in the developing world, including the African nations of Chad and Cameroon.


http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewBusiness....20020529a.html



You might find this interesting too

http://www.killercoke.org/

PEACE

Cat

[BlueCat]

The biggest enemy of the American people is the complacencey that allows this kind of stupidity to flourish : http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?...3A%22stupid%22

Big business is very dirty, generosity of business to charity is BS (it's all about tax breaks which they get for donating) and it's all about cheap goods and cheap labour for maximum profit, they don't care about you or the sweat shop labour that supplies most of thier goods.

I have never had problems with money and I don't suppose I ever will but the difference between me and the boys who work for corporations is that I refuse to be dishonest, they thrive on it.

AMEN :clap:
I just wanted to say...I love you,man. :stoned:
HAHAHAHAHAHA thanks for the laugh psychocat...damn I hope those North Korean Aussies don't invade!

Great video