Quote Originally Posted by Polymirize
I'd hate to speak for everyone, especially because when you throw that wide a net out (and hook people like gs) the issue becomes a little more mirky...

So let me explain a basic perspective on the matter instead. It's a common neo-con myth that liberals hate the US. This is false. Most liberals love the US. We think it's an amazing example of what is possible with respect to insuring human rights and freedoms. Perhaps even the best example in the world today. However, simply being the best example isn't a reason to stop progress. And in the spirit of our constitutional values that all men (and women we should think) are created equal, with certain intrinsic rights and priviledges, these values should extend beyond our prejudges and even beyond our borders to the way that we as a nation interact with the rest of the world.
If slavery was wrong, then why isn't it wrong to make economic slaves out of factory working children in indonesia? Simply because we don't think of it that way?

One example. I've got more if you like.
Bong may not agree with me Poly, but I don't throw you in the same group as GS, and Pissy. You may be a bit farther left of the middle than I am, but you don't seem to suffer from the delusions that some of ther others do. Unfortunately, it's folks like GS and Pissy who give the liberals a bad name. As in most groups, the most outspoken members of the group tend to be the most extreme. So, it's no wonder someone like Bong would simply group anyone that is left leaning with them. Just as anyone left leaning would assume all conservatives are like Bong. My personal belief is to walk with one foot on each side of the line and let common sense dictate which direction you should take for any given issue. Most people's insistance on staying on one side or the other causes way too many problems.


Your example of children working in places like Indonesia is a perfect example. My personal belief is that folks on the far left are actually making the situation worse for the children. I didn't just pull this out of my ass, this comes from having degrees in both International Business and East Asian studies. It is also an opinion held by many very knowledgable people. It's been over 10 years since I got out of school so I honestly don't remember the names of any specific references, but if you go to any college library and hunt around a bit you'll find some.

You see, the sad fact is that in some countries children must work. Yes, it would be wonderful if this wasn't the reality, and that they could all go to school and eventually become Harvard scholars, but that is just a dream. The families need the children to work so they will. It is not a situation where if the factory didn't exist they'd be in cute little uniforms at the local school. If the factory didn't exist they'd be working out in the fields with the heat, sun, and poisonous snakes(lots of them). Or in many cases prostituting themselves on the street. This is not an exageration, this is reality.

So, "how is the situation made worse by the folks on the far left?", you may ask. Because they are delusional and can't see reality. A big company like Nike, for eaxample, could set up a program where kids work in a factory for part of the day and go to a factory school part of the day. They could manage it in a way that would meet all of the families needs. Instead, the folks on the far left have demonized child labor to the point where no major company will touch it. Even though something like that would be extremely beneficial, if Nike were to set something like that up it woould be a public relations disaster. So, instead of working in a factory where things could be controlled they work in factories run by unscrupulous people who don't give a damn about the kids.

Of course, big corporations could just decide to feed and cloth all the worlds poor. A solution usually favored by my neighbors up in Berzerkely But let's face it, there's a better chance Santa Claus will solve the problem.
Fengzi Reviewed by Fengzi on . UCLA Police Taser Student For Not Showing ID This video is just plain sickening. It is clear Amerikan torture. To no surprise, he had an Arabic name. I bet Bong and Psycho will have a field day with this one! The Land of the Free huh....what a joke! AMERIKA IS A BIG FUCKING JOKE! AMERIKA...THE WHORE OF BABYLON!!!! Wheres an American flag when you need to burn one??!! :thumbsup: Somebody buy me a ticket to Canada or France PLEASE!!!!!! I can't stand the infidel stench of Amerikans. Rating: 5