Meet Your Meat

[Ousted]

Now would you kindly answer my question? What do you base your beliefs on? Or is just your "instinct".

I could ask you the same question. You have your "feelings" and I have mine.

Ousted Reviewed by Ousted on 10-04-2005. Meet Your Meat I know vegetarians want people who eat meet to stop, and we're sick of it.. i know meat eats want vegetarians to stop telln us to eat meat.. i always thought i knew how badly animals were treated, but i still didnt stop eatin meat.. until i saw this.. many of you will probably ignore this, but please, go to this site, download the video, watch it, and make your own opinion... i just watched it and it made me physically sick, im not eatin meat anymore, fuck that.. peace Rating: 5

[Ganja Cat]

good job ghost i had a chicken sandwich today and almost puked, b/c i thought of the video

[tylerkane]

I had a steak, thought of the video for a minute, then continued to eat that $15 sun of a bitch and it was god damned tasty.

[beachguy in thongs]

I had a sub with cheese.

And turkey. And salomi, And Balogna. And Ham. And Mustard (French's)

[Edgar]

I could ask you the same question. You have your "feelings" and I have mine.

Ah, but i have more than just feelings.

Animals arn't aliens or robots, I dont see what reason you have to assume they wouldn't have emotions. It's their

very similarity to us that makes animals so valuable in medical research. Every animal we've tested so far has

large portions of it's dna that are identical to our own DNA. We test our drugs on them first. And speaking of

drugs, drugs have an effect on animals that is very much like their effects on us. They make them feel good and

because many pathways in animal brains have synonymous function to pathways in human brains, there is no reason to

assume that they dont feel emotions in a similar way to how we feel emotions. For example, Cocaine is a stimulant

and it causes dopamine reuptake inhibition in rats, humans, apes, and just about any other animal. By increasing

dopamine in the synaptic cleft between neurons, more is absorbed at once, resulting in strong stimulation of the

reward areas of the brain. That happens to all the animals i mentioned, when they are given cocaine. For most drugs

the tactile component is only a small part of it's charm, so what would keep the animals coming back for more unto

death? Emotional bliss, that's what. I think you assume that emotions are more complex than they really are. Sure

humans and animals arive at various emotions for different reasons, but that's no reason to devalue animal

emotions. Animals need emotions to survive, just like we needed and still need them to some degree. Emotions, give

us our drive, they drive us away from danger. Emotions drive us to seek food shelter and companionship. This

behavior is demonstrated by pretty much all animals, it's certainly not just a human trait, some animals will even

find companionship in animals of a different species, take Koko (the gorilla) and her kittens for example. So if

you deprive an animal of it's emotional needs or its other needs, it's a pretty sure bet that it is suffering.

That has been demonstrated repeatedly. Chimps and other animals that live in cages their whole life are depressed,

withdrawn and sometimes crazy, this is evidenced by the fact that they no longer show interest in many normal

activities and by the fact that they show many other abnormal behaviors. (

http://www.brown.edu/Research/Primate/lpn30-2.html http://www.psychology4all.com/enviro...psychology.htm

http://www.awionline.org/Lab_animals/biblio/variab.html ) Chickens that are stressed are shown to have decreased

function of their immune system. ( http://www.upc-online.org/980616salm..._comments.html ) It's actually rather

common knowledge that an animal's drive can diminished by caging them in a non stimulating environment. I can't

prove without a doubt that they have emotions, only because i can't prove without a doubt that any1 but myself has

emotions, (and i can only prove that to myself) that includes people. I can never know what others are feeling, no

one can, but that isn't much of a reason to assume they don't feel emotions. Emotions can be directly stimulated

with intra-cranial self-stimulation in rat brains. This is confirmed by a study done in the 50's by a man named

James Olds. Here is link that details his studies: http://www.nap.edu/books/0309066441/html/251.html - and if you

keep paging through it, it becomes quite clear than animals can experience emotions, or just as clear as any test

could be. Here are a couple more links which clearly show an animals emotional drive.

http://www.hedweb.com/wirehead/hypermotivation.html http://www.hedweb.com/wirehead/index.html

Here are some links which highlight some similarities between human brains and chimp brains: http://brainmuseum.org/specimens/pri...imp/index.html
http://www.news-medical.net/?id=6691


Aside from all that research, I think it's pretty clear that most if not all animals feel fear.

Oh I've got more, but i think that's enough for now...

[Ousted]

So, do you believe all animals experience emotion then? What about insects? Bacteria, single-cell organisms? But not plants...right?

Are you for freeing all living creatures of harm done to them because of humans, or just the cute, people-like creatures? Where is the line drawn? And what reasons do you have for drawing the line where you've drawn the line, and why would you expect anyone to follow your arbitrary guideline of which creatures have emotion and are worth fighting for, and which are not?

I dont believe animals are smart enough to have emotion. Maybe elephants and chimps...maybe... You dont really see us eating the more intelligent animals anyway... And if you say chickens are intelligent, I swear to god...

I think you need a base intelligence in order to have emotions, or to be affected by them the way that we are. Babies aren't emotional, they become emotional beings later, when their brain has developed enough.

Look, its unfortunate for chickens and cows and lamb and pig that they are as tasty as they are. Maybe these animals should put their distraught emotion (over the fact that their whole purpose is to become my lunch) to good use and work harder to get their way up the food chain. Until that time comes, they will continue to be part of my diet.

And thanks for taking the time to site links, many people dont take the time to research what they're fighting for, its refreshing to see you do, even if I dont agree with you, I respect your position more.

[Edgar]

I dont believe animals are smart enough to have emotion.

Why?

So, do you believe all animals experience emotion then? What about insects? Bacteria, single-cell organisms? But not plants...right?

Are you for freeing all living creatures of harm done to them because of humans, or just the cute, people-like creatures? Where is the line drawn? And what reasons do you have for drawing the line where you've drawn the line, and why would you expect anyone to follow your arbitrary guideline of which creatures have emotion and are worth fighting for, and which are not?

I'm not trying to enforce anything, when are you gonna get that? I'm making moral decisions for myself and myself alone. I've only been explaining why i believe what i believe, now, I ask again, why do you believe what you believe?

I draw the line as best i can with the information that is currently available to me, that's really all any1 can do. Insects feel something, but I'd be willing to bet that what they feel is far more primitive than anything the more advanced animals feel. Plants, well i have no idea about what if anything plants could feel and as for single-celled organisms, they can react, but they can never react with purpose in mind (because they dont have a mind) and they can't feel, because they dont have a nervous system. And like i said b4, if i need to eat life forms to survive, well, that is an unfortunate necessity, but it is a necessity. Besides I already told you that my goal was to reduce suffering and i have already accomplished that goal and will continue to accomplish that goal in the future.

Maybe these animals should put their distraught emotion (over the fact that their whole purpose is to become my lunch) to good use and work harder to get their way up the food chain. Until that time comes, they will continue to be part of my diet.

Well that's a funny thing for you to say... according to your logic, and with this part i agree, they dont know why they are in that situation and they certainly don't know how to work towards getting out of that situation, but i realize that you were prolly saying that more in jest than anything.

I think you need a base intelligence in order to have emotions, or to be affected by them the way that we are. Babies aren't emotional, they become emotional beings later, when their brain has developed enough.

They certainly cry a lot for beings that arn't emotional. And what of my earlier example? What about the severely retarded people that don't develop into fully functional human beings? Would it be ok, in your view, to eat them?

[death of sXe]

Emotion is seperate from higher concious thought. They occur in different parts of the brain.

Your neocortex is responsible for intellectual thought. "lower" animals do not have such a developed neocortex as we do. Thats why they cant drive cars, do complicated math (animals can do some math) or read novels.

Deeper down is the part of the brain that processes such things as emotion. We share this with all mammals. Reptiles and birds have not developed this too much. (though they still understand suffering as well as you)
Finally we reach the reptilian core. This part of the brain controls basic instinct. Sex and aggresion. We share this reptilian core with birds.

Do some research. Read a fucking book. Think about what youre doing. You will pay for your actions later on. Once your clogged arteries and cancerous insides collapse and your soul is free..imagine the guilt you will live with for all eternity due to your laziness and ignorance..

[Anousenka]

Emotion is seperate from higher concious thought. They occur in different parts of the brain.

Your neocortex is responsible for intellectual thought. "lower" animals do not have such a developed neocortex as we do. Thats why they cant drive cars, do complicated math (animals can do some math) or read novels.

Deeper down is the part of the brain that processes such things as emotion. We share this with all mammals. Reptiles and birds have not developed this too much. (though they still understand suffering as well as you)
Finally we reach the reptilian core. This part of the brain controls basic instinct. Sex and aggresion. We share this reptilian core with birds.

Do some research. Read a fucking book. Think about what youre doing. You will pay for your actions later on. Once your clogged arteries and cancerous insides collapse and your soul is free..imagine the guilt you will live with for all eternity due to your laziness and ignorance..

YEAH!!! meat is murder, folks

[andy704]

ive always wanted to stop eating meat.i have the softest spot in me heart for animals. im a guy and even still, watching anything or anyone abuse or treat animals wrongly just makes me cry for them and go crazy. i bitched at my mom for hours because she found a bunny in her garden yesterday and she was trying to put it in a box. she grabbed it by the ears and picked it up and the bunny started yelling and crying and i was there to see and hear it all. she said youre supposed to do that.

i hate everyone who treats animals wrongly.

but heres the problem, ive seen movies of cows, pigs, (you name it) being slaughtered and wanted to be a vegetarian sooo bad. but when i tell my mom she says that im really stupid. she tells me to be a man and let it be. our family serves meat everyday. and if i refused to eat then they will just let me starve because they know i will come out and eat sooner or later. so i just have to eat meat (i have no money whatsoever to buy my own food).

one thing that i do is when i go somewhere (a farm) where i can see or hear a duck or chicken get killed to be eaten, i dont eat it. i dont talk to anyone there for the rest of the week. i would starve myself if i had seen it. it just makes me feel soo bad.

dogs and puppies have the biggest soft spot in my heart. i would do anything for my dog. if need be, i would kill for my dog, if someone was harming her. shes a little shihtzu/maltese puppy. i have fought for someones puppy (that i didnt even know). i almost took a bat to an old man's head because he was about the throw a rope around a little dog's neck and drag it behind his truck.

i hate those ppl soo bad.