Charles Manson....

[turtle420]

I'm still smiling

[latewood]

yeah, ACID and kannebanol...is how he brainwashed them all...OK...Manson was a pshyco fuck-up that got all bent out of shape after Brian Wilson(Beachboys) dismissed him as drivel. He hung out with them for awhile...wrote some songs, convinced himself the songs were great! Then when he got the same shaft (or as my best friend put's it; Another bite of Life's 'SHIT' sandwich!), as the "Rest of Us"
OH yeah...and there was something else about Roman Polanski that set him off...That is why Sharon Tate and her Party were murdered; and she was Pregnant! Real Fucking Cool Revolutionary, Huh? Fuck that!!!

Manson should have been 'FRIED' when he was scheduled to be 'FRIED'!!! What an Asshole
He thought he was the Messiah...for Christ's Sake.

later, I gotta go. lw

[BobBong]

In Ontario there was a similar case involving college girls and a sister.. Paul Bernardo convinced his girlfriend/wife to help rape and kill her own sister...although personally, i think it was her idea.. they then went on to do the same thing to 2 more girls..

Revolutionary? I think not.

Burn in Hell Paul... Charles will be waiting for you...

[friendowl]

id like to have a conversation with this guy.
he aint all that crazy but i think he had lots of fun

[infidel818]

Didn't you read anything I wrote? I don't believe murdering innocent people is going to overthrow the establishment. Nor do I believe that Charles Manson is a revolutionary or anything close to it.

All I said in that post was that violence is necessary in political revolutions. If you want to debate that fact, well, provide me with an example of a bloodless political revolution. It doesn't happen, because the oppressors really want to hold on to what they have, and sometimes you have to behead the king.

You are saying that in order to have a revolution there needs to be blood shed because thats how its been in the past. One significant thing history tells us is to not repeat its tragedies. Guns do not do anything but kill people. Now you tell me, if you wanted to start a revolution with guns galore...how long would you last? Especially against the government? The civilians are extremely underpowered. Dont you see what is happening? People think war is the answer to getting what they want, but there are other ways. If you start a war and shoot the enemy, they will just come shoot back, and it will keep going untill everyone is dead. Its sad to think that people need to kill another in order to gain something. If you have that state of mind, you are only supporting the wars that have been fought, and the war thats being fought right now. Nowadays, we can not afford to FIGHT, we need to focus on surviving! Because this whole fucking planet is going to shit! and if we keep having a fighting mentality, sooner or later there will be nothing left, and we'll be fighting with sticks and stones.

[BobBong]

everyone has a choice. if they didnt wanna go through with it perhaps they woulda been knocked off but they still had a choice.

and what of the people in the sights of those guns? did they have a choice? those guards had a choice.. sure...do it, or die.

all you need to have is an understanding of emotion...how can you call this man a genius or a revolutionary when people have been doing what he did for hundreds of years... horrible.. ruthless people. when all he did was manipulate people into doing shit they wouldn't do under normal circumstances. Kill or be killed comes into mind... and until you've been there.. you'll never understand it

[BobBong]

when in a kill or be killed situation, the human natural instinct of self preservation plays a big role in decision making. will, sometimes can overpower this instinct.. but not often. what put charles manson in that situation? probably, nothing.. i mean.. he wasn't even there when those people were killed.. but he manipulated someone into doing it. the choice to take a life without just cause is pretty inhuman if you ask me... and no, someone stealing your stash isn't just cause. what about the victims? what choice did they make? non... what if was your uncle that was murdered by manson? i'm sure that person had family and all that. so yea.. i don't see ANY thing revolutionary about this man... infact.. if anything he's pretty unoriginal...

"According to many former members of the group, Manson implied to his followers that he was Jesus, saying he had died before, some 2,000 years ago. When asked directly in court he said, "I may have implied to several different people on several different occasions that I may be Jesus Christ, but I haven't yet decided who or what I am.""

Nut. Fucking. Case.

end of story.

[Oneironaut]

You are saying that in order to have a revolution there needs to be blood shed because thats how its been in the past. One significant thing history tells us is to not repeat its tragedies. Guns do not do anything but kill people.

Well, sorry to tell you, but guns are here for good. There's no getting rid of them. And as long as there are governments with organized militaries they will be used in brutal wars for money, power and conquest. The only way to stop the cycle of war is to get rid of the social conditions which allow for war.

Now you tell me, if you wanted to start a revolution with guns galore...how long would you last? Especially against the government? The civilians are extremely underpowered.

Quite the contrary. The civilians are all that is keeping the government in place. Where would the government be without the consent of ordinary people like taxpayers, manual laborers and soldiers? If enough of these people decide they no longer want to support the government, the government will be powerless. The point is not to get a few people together to go on a shootout with the military—it is to convince the masses to take their lives into their own hands. It's not all about "guns galore", but the revolution does have to be able to defend itself.

Dont you see what is happening? People think war is the answer to getting what they want, but there are other ways. If you start a war and shoot the enemy, they will just come shoot back, and it will keep going untill everyone is dead. Its sad to think that people need to kill another in order to gain something. If you have that state of mind, you are only supporting the wars that have been fought, and the war thats being fought right now. Nowadays, we can not afford to FIGHT, we need to focus on surviving! Because this whole fucking planet is going to shit! and if we keep having a fighting mentality, sooner or later there will be nothing left, and we'll be fighting with sticks and stones.

I'm not saying violence is desirable. I'm just saying it's inevitable. Non-violence just doesn't work against tyrants. The revolution is not about destruction, it is about the restructuring of social relationships. We want people to be equal, but to abolish inequality we realize we may have to fight some people who wish to retain their power over others and are willing to die for that. Alexander Berkman put it better than I ever could:

Most people have very confused notions about revolution. To them it means just fighting, smashing things, destroying. It is the same as if rolling up your sleeves for work should be considered as the work itself that you have to do. The fighting part of revolution is merely the rolling up of your sleeves. The real, actual task is ahead.

What is that task?

"The destruction of the existing conditions," you reply.

True. But conditions are not destroyed by breaking and smashing things. You can't destroy wage slavery by wrecking the machinery in mills and factories, can you? You won't destroy government by setting fire to the White House.

To think of revolution in terms of violence and destruction is to misinterpret and falsify the whole idea of it. In practical application such a conception is bound to lead to disastrous results.

When a great thinker, like the famous Anarchist Bakunin, speaks of revolution as destruction, he has in mind the ideas of authority and obedience which are to be destroyed. It is for this reason that he said that destruction means construction, for to destroy a false belief is indeed most constructive work.

But the average man, and too often even the revolutionist, thoughtlessly talks of revolution as being exclusively destructive in the physical sense of the word. That is a wrong and dangerous view. The sooner we get rid of it the better.

Revolution, and particularly the social revolution, is not destruction but construction. This cannot be sufficiently emphasized, and unless we clearly realize it, revolution will remain only destructive and thereby always a failure. Naturally revolution is accompanied by violence, but you might as well say that building a new house in place of an old one is destructive because you have first to tear down the old one. Revolution is the culminating point of a certain evolutionary process: it begins with a violent upheaval. It is the rolling up of your sleeves preparatory to starting the actual work.

[Shelbay]

yeah, ACID and kannebanol...is how he brainwashed them all...OK...Manson was a pshyco fuck-up that got all bent out of shape after Brian Wilson(Beachboys) dismissed him as drivel. He hung out with them for awhile...wrote some songs, convinced himself the songs were great! Then when he got the same shaft (or as my best friend put's it; Another bite of Life's 'SHIT' sandwich!), as the "Rest of Us"
OH yeah...and there was something else about Roman Polanski that set him off...That is why Sharon Tate and her Party were murdered; and she was Pregnant! Real Fucking Cool Revolutionary, Huh? Fuck that!!!

Manson should have been 'FRIED' when he was scheduled to be 'FRIED'!!! What an Asshole
He thought he was the Messiah...for Christ's Sake.

later, I gotta go. lw

Wasn't Tex on that plant belladonna when he helped murder? It was a while back I read on Tex but I think that was the name of that plant he said made him do it..

[king kong bong]

and what of the people in the sights of those guns? did they have a choice? those guards had a choice.. sure...do it, or die.

all you need to have is an understanding of emotion...how can you call this man a genius or a revolutionary when people have been doing what he did for hundreds of years... horrible.. ruthless people. when all he did was manipulate people into doing shit they wouldn't do under normal circumstances. Kill or be killed comes into mind... and until you've been there.. you'll never understand it

i said his followers had a choice cuz everyone keeps labeling him as the mastermind. his followers could have chose not to do it. the people in the gun sights still had a choice too, they could just die or die fighting, a fucked up choice but still a choice, no?

as for the revolution/gun thing, i dont think you really need guns either, just take away what they value the most, their money. on second thought you will need those guns....