abortion

[Fengzi]

My wife and I have been through an abortion, a miscarriage, and the birth of our daughter. In that order. Going through all these experiences has really taught me a few things and shaped my current views on abortion. Below is our story and my views. Sorry if it's a bit long winded but it was hard to shorten it down.

The Abortion- Shortly after we were married we learned that my wife had gotten pregnant. We were usually very careful but somehow it happened. At that time were were both unemployed. My wife was not a U.S. citizen and at that time she was only in the U.S. temporarily, and her ultimate immigration status was in question. We knew she had to leave the country in a few months and didn't know when she would be back. Even without a pregnancy it was a very traumatic time for us. It was a bad time to have a baby so we decided that my wife would get an abortion. It was the most difficult decision that we ever had to make. The deciding factor was not based on our selfishness (as many pro-lifers would have you to believe) but on the fact that we did not feel that we could provide a decent life for a child at that time.

The Miscarriage- Six years later my wife and I both had very good jobs in the high tech industry, we were about to purchase our own house in a good neighborhood, and the time was right. We wanted a baby. Within a few weeks my wife was pregnant and we were so happy. Our parents were all ecstatic at the news they would be grandparents. Everything was good. At 10 weeks we were scheduled to go into see the docs and get the first ultrasound. Ironically, it was the morning of the appointment that my wife started to have a little bleeding which was a bad thing. When the doc did the ultrasound he told us there was no heartbeat. My wife was bleeding because she was having a miscarriage. It crushed us.

Our Daughter- After the miscarriage we were pretty shooken up. Although neither of us mentioned it then we both wondered if it wasn't some karmic payback for the abortion. We waited a year or so and then decided to to try again. At my wifes 10 week appointment we were incredibly nervous. And then, one of the greatest moments of my life, when the doc did the ultrasound we heard my daughter's heartbeat for the very first time. Four months later our daughter was born. She was 7 weeks early but strong as an ox. She just turned two in July.

One thing we learned when my wife had a miscarriage is that a staggering percentage of pregnancies actually end in a miscarriage during the first trimester. Estimates are anywhere from 30%-70%. No one is really sure exactly since many times it happens before the woman even knows she's pregnant and she just thinks it is a heavy period because she was a bit late. It seems that the first 10 weeks of fetus development are incredibly complex and a lot can go wrong. When it does, a misscarriage is essentially natures way of aborting the fetus. The docs even call it a spontanious abortion. There is really nothing anyone can do to prevent it. It isn't even until the end of the first trimester that the fetus is really developed enough to even see if it is going to be ok.

So..



1. Too many children are born into poverty to parents that can not, or will not, provide a good life for them. Or to parents that will possibly resent them and not love them. It is far better to end a pregnacy than to force a child to be born into these condidtions.

2. No matter what anyone might say, getting an abortion is an incredibly difficult choice for the woman, and in many cases the man, to make.

3. Abortion should be a last resort for a one-time mistake. While I don't propose any legal limits on how many abortions a person can have, it is not a form of birth control. I work with a girl whose had three abortions. This is just irresponsible. I mean come on folks, everyone can make a mistake, just learn from it.

4. There should be no restrictions on getting an abortion during the first trimester. During this early stage of development there is no way in hell a fetus could survive outside of the mother and a good percentage of them don't survive in the mother. This is the time when nature will end a pregnacy if it has made a mistake so it is not unreasonable that humans use this time for that purpose as well.

5. I would not be against some restrictions on early 2nd trimester abortions. Two or three months is ample time to make the decision so after that you have to start wondering "why now". I haven't really thought out exactly how it should be restricted. Possibly a review and approval by a social worker and/ or psychologist. Something like that.

6. Late 2nd/3rd trimester abortions should be limited to cases where there is risk to the mother and/or where there is evidence that the fetus has some kind of disorder such as down's syndrome, etc.

7. Fuck any Bible thumper who wants to tell other people they can't get an abortion based on their own religous views. And for their sake, if they ever call me or especially my wife a "baby killer" they better damn well hope their really is a God to save their sorry ass.

That's what I think.

[stonerpoet]

for the most part yes it ultimatly impacts the mother but i went through a time last year where a girl i had been seeing(she was a rebound, baad mistake) had gotten pregnant and i think that it had a larger physcological impact on me then her.

Trust me the physcological impact was much more difficult on her then it was on you. As for my view of abortion, I think it's a womans right. No man has the right to tell a woman when and where to make a baby. Personaly I would only have one if I concived in a rape, other then that I couldnt.
By week 3 of your pregancy that baby has a heart beat. I couldnt kill my baby if it had a heart beat.
I know in the state of MI there making women see an ultra sound pic the night before the abortion and sending them home with the pic so they can be sure there sure.

[BobBong]

Hey this is a great subject for a cannabis forum... not.

but i'll give my opinion anyway.

Abortion to me.. is in reality completely up to the mother of the child. If she chooses NOT to have the child.. then she will not have the child. Abortion isn't something new. Medical advancements have just made it possible to kill the child before it's actually born.. or fully developed for that matter. People for thousands of years have been doing it. abandoning children, drowning them on birth...etc. cold? of course.
morbid? you bet! but shit.. it's your body so it's YOUR decision. just like Cannabis.. it comes down to the issue of YOUR body, YOUR choices.

You abort a birth, you still have to live with the knowledge that you did it. Personally i know a few people that have had them.. and will not have them again.

Also, views on abortion change dramatically when the woman actually starts to go through the hormonal changes.. alot of "Pro abortion" women.. change thier minds about thier decision and decide against an abortion and look into other options.

There is also, the issue of abortion of deformed or misdeveloped fetus. what if it's not safe to the mother? would you still opt. against abortion?

I think it basically comes down to the personal choice...The REAL issue.. is wether or not we are given that option to choose.

[GHoSToKeR]

Well said, BobBong. Everybody should be allowed their own opinion on abortion, but just because some think it's right and some think it's wrong should in no way mean that it should be illegal. Each woman should be allowed to make the choice for herself, based on her own opinions and feelings towards the subject. It should be that simple.

The government should not legislate morality. Unfortunately they try.

[colton]

Hey this is a great subject for a cannabis forum... not.

but i'll give my opinion anyway.

Abortion to me.. is in reality completely up to the mother of the child. If she chooses NOT to have the child.. then she will not have the child. Abortion isn't something new. Medical advancements have just made it possible to kill the child before it's actually born.. or fully developed for that matter. People for thousands of years have been doing it. abandoning children, drowning them on birth...etc. cold? of course.
morbid? you bet! but shit.. it's your body so it's YOUR decision. just like Cannabis.. it comes down to the issue of YOUR body, YOUR choices.

You abort a birth, you still have to live with the knowledge that you did it. Personally i know a few people that have had them.. and will not have them again.

Also, views on abortion change dramatically when the woman actually starts to go through the hormonal changes.. alot of "Pro abortion" women.. change thier minds about thier decision and decide against an abortion and look into other options.

There is also, the issue of abortion of deformed or misdeveloped fetus. what if it's not safe to the mother? would you still opt. against abortion?

I think it basically comes down to the personal choice...The REAL issue.. is wether or not we are given that option to choose.

Like those people in London that chose to get blown up on the way to work aye mate?

[GHoSToKeR]

Goddam.

[colton]

im sorry but there is so much hipocritical shit on here

[BobBong]

Like those people in London that chose to get blown up on the way to work aye mate?

What? do you realize how stupid you sound? Those people didn't chose to be killed.. that's the most ridiculous statement ever, and it's not what i said either. You obviously missed the point of my bringing that up.



like Jimi says..

[powair]

I am definately pro-choice. I have never been pregnant, and I dont think I would have an abortion if I was. I do believe that each individual has a complete right to choose for herself on that issue.

I do not believe it is murder. It seems sadder to wait like 6-7 months into the pregnancy, and more ethical to do it earlier but really, its the same. The fetus does not have an remnant of a personality because it has had no experiences. Therefore, I do not believe it is murder.

[stonerpoet]

Let me rephraze what I said the only way I would chose to have an abortion is if the child was concived from rape; but even then I dont know, there's always adoption. Or if there was a sever medical complation that could be hazordious to myself and child.

Abortion is one of thouse things for a woman, she can say she's for sure about it, but when push comes to shove it's a whole 'nother matter. Personaly, I hope I never have to face that decisition. But the day may come when I have to, and when that day does come it's up to me; not me and my husband, just me. It's no one else's busness but the woman who has to go thru with it.