Curious situation, testing for the third time!!

[un1bomber]

Hi, so here's my situation. I have a DOT pre-employment test.
I tested the first time, 20 days clean and apparently the sample showed up to the lab with the container not sealed, causing the test to be canceled.

After I had given the first test, I smoked. Bad choice. But the second test was a week later, I used canadian QuickFix 5.7-1 to be sure I'd pass. The test showed up as having 'Immunoassay interference' and had a result of 'canceled'.

Currently my future employer is talking to the MRO to get more details and after personally speaking with the MRO she said I'll likely be asked to test again. It has been a week again since I smoked and I plan on using a detox drink, assuming I'm asked to test again and don't just get denied the job.

Here's some information about me: I'm 5'6'' 150lbs, and I have a moderate metabolism. My smoking history is, I was 20 days clean, smoked once, one week clean, smoked once, and now I am one week clean again.

My questions are:
Has anyone ever had that problem with QuickFix on a DOT test before? What happened if you did?

Do you think I'll pass this third time? I know it's impossible to tell really for sure, just looking for some reassurance in either direction. given DOT testing, is it likely it'll come up dilute if I take a detox drink? I'm unsure how that affects creatinine content of my urine.

Any suggestions as to a course of action? or any other information you'd like to better tell? I don't personally have a copy of the result, I only spoke with the MRO over the phone.


I really appreciate any insight you may have!!

un1bomber Reviewed by un1bomber on 09-10-2013. Curious situation, testing for the third time!! Hi, so here's my situation. I have a DOT pre-employment test. I tested the first time, 20 days clean and apparently the sample showed up to the lab with the container not sealed, causing the test to be canceled. After I had given the first test, I smoked. Bad choice. But the second test was a week later, I used canadian QuickFix 5.7-1 to be sure I'd pass. The test showed up as having 'Immunoassay interference' and had a result of 'canceled'. Currently my future employer is talking to Rating: 5

[Burnt Toast]

By doing a Forum Search with the terms "detox products scam dilution", you'll discover that all detox products are a big scam to separate the credulous from their cash.

Plus, theres lots of posts from those who had success using synthetics (as well as real human urine) for a DOT-regulated test. The Search button is your friend. :thumbsup:

[un1bomber]

Thank you very much for your response Burnt.

I do understand that detox products are essentially just multi-vitamins plus water. In an effort to weight up someones diluted urine. My real question would then be, do we know of any methods to raise your creatinine content in order to dilute safely?

Also, I know there has been a LOT of success with substitution. Which is why I'm so confused as to the invalid result received when using a well respected synthetic. Hence my question of asking if anyone has had a similar situation happen when using that particular synthetic.

As a final note, The QuickFix was purchased from a well respected vendor, the vendor which spectrum labs actually recommend. It seems unlikely that this was a fake sample of the synthetic.

Regardless, thank you very much for the information Burnt.

[Burnt Toast]

My real question would then be, do we know of any methods to raise your creatinine content in order to dilute safely?

The Dilution "sticky" thread addresses the use of creatine in order to maintain satisfactory creatinine levels. And more posts about creatine-loading and creatinine testing are found by utilizing the Search button.

[un1bomber]

My apologies for not searching more first. The information in the stickie is wonderful. Thank you for pointing me there.

[un1bomber]

I have a question for anyone who might have the answer, also I don't think it's worth starting a new thread for it. After extensive web and board searching, I haven't found anything that I think answers my question.

What sort of tests would a lab do to determine urine validity other than specific gravity, creatinine levels, and pH?

The reason I ask, is since I had a problem with using QuickFix 5.7-1, that it didn't immediately come back with a negative result, do I have a chance of them performing more extensive tests and finding out that it was substituted?

A canceled or generally invalid result due to unknown interference is WAY better than having a substituted result. Such that the former would likely grant me a retest, and the latter simply will not.

I'm not sure what more tests they could perform though, beyond smelling it, but it's the canadian version of quickfix and thereby even contains uric acid. Also after reading the DOT guidelines, it never 'limits' the maximum amount of testing that can be done, it only sets the minimum for the tests that must be performed.

[Burnt Toast]

With DOT-regulated tests, the labs have to abide by the regulations outlined under 49 CFR Part 40.

With that being pointed out, the labs must perform the validity tests outlined under Section 40.91 of the regulations, and must apply the criteria for a "substituted" urine sample under Section 40.93 of the regulations. Theres no minimum or maximum of what they can adhere to - they have to follow the regulations and protocols outlined.
DOT Rule 49 CFR Part 40 Section 40.91 | Department of Transportation

and

DOT Rule 49 CFR Part 40 Section 40.93 | Department of Transportation

As you can see, uric acid is NOT part of the validity tests being ordered to perform, nor there is no standards established for uric acid as there are for creatinine, specific gravity, pH, nitrites, etc.

[un1bomber]

With DOT-regulated tests, the labs have to abide by the regulations outlined under 49 CFR Part 40.

With that being pointed out, the labs must perform the validity tests outlined under Section 40.91 of the regulations, and must apply the criteria for a "substituted" urine sample under Section 40.93 of the regulations. Theres no minimum or maximum of what they can adhere to - they have to follow the regulations and protocols outlined.
DOT Rule 49 CFR Part 40 Section 40.91 | Department of Transportation

and

DOT Rule 49 CFR Part 40 Section 40.93 | Department of Transportation

As you can see, uric acid is NOT part of the validity tests being ordered to perform, nor there is no standards established for uric acid as there are for creatinine, specific gravity, pH, nitrites, etc.

First, Burnt, you're an absolute wealth of information and I wish I had a better way to thank you. Thank you for all your help and information.

But here's a question about DOT Rule 49 CFR Part 40 Section 40.91, when it says "(d) You must perform additional validity tests on the primary specimen when the following conditions are observed:"

Given the MRO's answer to me, I have reason to believe they found a "(3) Possible unidentified interfering substance or adulterant." Do we have any idea what the additional tests may include?

All in all, I suppose this just doesn't matter, if I fail, I fail.

[Burnt Toast]

They'll perform the additional validity checks if any of the following are observed:

- Abnormal physical characteristics - Meaning any unusual color (blue, orange, black, purple), any unusual odor (smell of bleach, household chemicals, gasoline, etc) and/or excessive foaming when sample is shaken ( due to use of some adulterants, or if heated Mountain Dew was used as a urine sub)

- Possible unidentified interfering substance or adulterant. The QF and other synthetics dont contain any interfering substances or adulterants so that eliminates synthetics as a suspect.

And when they do perform the additional validity tests, they have to report exactly what substance/adulterant was found and its quantitative value. Vauge reports such as "some stuff was found in the urine" and or the like will not cut it. They have to be complete and most importantly, truthful in what was found; otherwise they can be held liable for medical malpractice.

[un1bomber]

Thank you so much Burnt Toast. You've put my mind at ease for the moment. I'll report my result once I get it.