Shortages

[thatguyjrod]

1st You asked if I had thought about growing my own meds, not had I thought of being a producer so I listed equiptment accordingly. 2nd exactly my point, it's a business, if others want to pay high prices to help their local lnpp pay for their start up costs fine but I'm not. It's rediculous, I see a need for patients who can't grow their own to have producers, but again I give you the example of the producer in cruces $15 a gram x 30 days=$450! At only 1 gram a day, very little for most patients, $450 x 12= $5,400 per year! How much money from patients will it take before prices drop? Btw you haven't explained the "illegal" legal prices...

[thatguyjrod]

Also, saying id have a hard time getting 4 oz off a plant with that equipment is telling me something I already know. You have no basis for your part of the discussion, I'd rather end my part here. Ive shown the figures and costs roughly to show why patients shouldn't go to a grower/producer if they have their ppl, how inflated the price of meds are, and as you've said it's a business with an obvious profit margin patients shouldn't toss their money into. There's my .02, good thing I don't charge like producers or it'd be my $20.02...truth hurts

[alfonso2002]

thatguyjrod The only thing I can tell you about growing your oun med.s is that in the last 4 years have not had to BUY one bud from anyone.So I have been doing my part in helping with the shorages.I agree that If you have a ppl you should be able to supply yourself.The differance of legal and Illegal is I think mandatory minimum of 10 years.

[CFO]

Well let's see
$100 grow tent
$188 cool tube both bulbs, ballast,
$80 for 4 clones
$20 fan
$110 or so for nutes
$400 household electricity for 3 months
So $900 or so, let's say the grow is medium in yield so an ounce a plant
4 x $400(average cost of medical grade ounce) =$1,600
I'm no rocket scientist but investing $900 or so, ten minutes a day to the garden to get even
An ounce a plant is a savings of $500 compared to buying from a grower/producer/dispensary
So again, why the high prices?

Now, multiply your numbers by at least 30 to arive at what it costs the producers to manage 150 plants in various stages. Also, don't forget to add security, payroll, rent, insurance, and the relicensing fee (and no, the fee did NOT exist when all of the current LNPs applied and were accepted; it was added in the rule changes in December 2010), charcoal filters, and a/c units just to name a few expenses the LNPs have that the patients with PPLs don't have. You listed clones, I assume you purchased those from one of the producers, but some of the producers are purchasing feminized seeds at a hefty price in order to produce the strains that have been bred for medicinal purposes. And there is a difference. There have also been crop failures and mite infestations. Individual patients do not have to worry about mites or growing organically, but the producers do and these issues create additional costs.

Just like organic produce at the market being more expensive than traditionally grown produce, so it goes for the NM LNPs. Your local producer charges $13.95/gr (the other $1.05 is sales tax imposed by the state) and only sells the best of the buds to the patients.

At post #34 you state the "growers are getting their meds...plenty of meds....ailments are minimal." Such a stupid assumption! I don't know about the patient board members of all the producers, but the patient board members of YOUR local producer have Cancer, Multiple Schlerosis, Eplilepsy, PTSD, Painful Peripheral Neuropathy, and chronic pain. Are these minimal ailments to you????Additionally, FYI, the patient board members receive what is left prior to making edibles and hash and sometimes go without so other patients can have the best of what is available. So, the "salad" available at other producers is not available in Las Cruces so that the patient board members have something rather than nothing.

Your statement is similar to another I read indicating that all the producers were driving brand new vehicles. People should take the time to have a discussion with their producer rather than make assumptions. You do know what they say about assuming, don't you?

Any patient who can grow their own, should do so.

[Nmnewbgrower]

My original question which has still been left unanswered, maybe if I ask more directly. Why does legal medicine cost the same as illegal? You can put all the figures out there on dues, equipment, whatever you wish but still doesn't add up to a real answer. If you wanted to say because that's the market price I could understand, disappointed but understandable. It was just a simple question. Never intended it to be such an issue.
As for post #34 I was referring to the point that the llnp growers get their meds at a much cheaper cost and that their ailments were being treated. I in no way meant that to disregard or downplay anyone's ailments. You took that wrong like many of my posts. I did try several times to talk to the llnp here but the individual who works the front office was always in a hurry. Once I even talked to a woman there and she laughingly said "yea he's always rushing, the more ppl he sees the more money he makes." Again not judging the ppl, I don't know them. How am I to feel as a patient/customer after that? Not to mention I spent a good amount of money there. I even offered to help free of charge several times.
In the end they banned me just like you said they would. No bad mouthing of the staff nor naming of names was done on my part. I had/have no intent on harming the name of the producer, grower or anyone. I guess I expected different practices concerning this medicine. I didn't expect business to be the driving factor. I expected a low cost highly effective alternative to pills but all in all it is what it is.

[CFO]

My original question which has still been left unanswered, maybe if I ask more directly. Why does legal medicine cost the same as illegal? You can put all the figures out there on dues, equipment, whatever you wish but still doesn't add up to a real answer. If you wanted to say because that's the market price I could understand, disappointed but understandable. It was just a simple question. Never intended it to be such an issue.
As for post #34 I was referring to the point that the llnp growers get their meds at a much cheaper cost and that their ailments were being treated. I in no way meant that to disregard or downplay anyone's ailments. You took that wrong like many of my posts. I did try several times to talk to the llnp here but the individual who works the front office was always in a hurry. Once I even talked to a woman there and she laughingly said "yea he's always rushing, the more ppl he sees the more money he makes." Again not judging the ppl, I don't know them. How am I to feel as a patient/customer after that? Not to mention I spent a good amount of money there. I even offered to help free of charge several times.
In the end they banned me just like you said they would. No bad mouthing of the staff nor naming of names was done on my part. I had/have no intent on harming the name of the producer, grower or anyone. I guess I expected different practices concerning this medicine. I didn't expect business to be the driving factor. I expected a low cost highly effective alternative to pills but all in all it is what it is.

Apparently you are "thatguyjrod"?

I can answer your question with another question....what did you expect to pay for organically grown, safe medicine accessed in a safe place? Or better yet...knowing all the costs involved, why would you "expect" a lower price for legal medicine as opposed to illegal medicine? Street dealers do not have the overhead and other costs that the legal producers have. They don't have to hire lawyers, accountants, patient consultants, etc., etc. They only have to buy their product from someone else (or grow it) and then sell it. The better question would be, why is illegal cannabis selling for more than legal cannabis. Why are their prices so high? I have been told that medical grade is selling for $20 on the streets of Las Cruces. Does that mean the patients are paying $15 and re-selling it for $20?

If you go back and look at some of the posts that have been critical of the LNPs, you will understand why some of us feel the need to defend their position.

You come back and say that your post at #34 means something other than what you wrote. Really? Even in your explanation you still make assumptions. Where do you get your information? Again, I will clarify...At your local producer, the board members pay the same price for their meds as you do. And if there isn't enough meds for the patients, the board members don't get their meds either. They have to purchase from other producers just like you do. Additionally, some of the patient board members have their own PPL and don't have to access the meds from the producer. What did I tell you before about assumptions?

And, your quote of what "a woman there" said to you ....really? Could be she made an assumption as well. The patient consultant at your local producer is NOT compensated based on the number of patients he sees. Appointments are made every 30 minutes, sometimes more, sometimes less. But as the patient numbers grow, the busier he will be. This is another reason patients must make appointments (which you criticized in one of your earlier posts). He is only one person and can see only so many people per day. People who show up without an appointment cannot be seen. There are only a few of the LNPs who submitted their proposals as "dispensaries", your LNP was not one of them.

Many patients have offered to volunteer with the LNPs. Think about the risk. What happens when someone gets pissed? How quickly do you think a disgruntled volunteer would go to the DEA or other federal entity if they felt slighted for some reason? Same for any patient. There is more risk for the producers than there is for any other entity. Their plant numbers are cummulative, not just at the time of a bust. The feds can seize their records and based on those records determine how many plants have been grown and how much medicine has been distributed by the producers. The greater number of plants, the higher the penalty. The people who run the LNPs are now all felons. I am sure they will be relieved to read that your intentions were not to harm them.

Your expectations obviously are not going to be met....at least not in the near future. When costs level out, I expect the prices will come down. You stated that you didn't think the patients should pay the start-up costs....why not? Are the producers supposed to be doing this out of the goodness of their hearts? I am sure many would IF they won the lottery or were otherwise independently wealthy. This is a business and needs to be conducted as such. A non-profit entity does not mean there is no profit, it means the State can have access to information that they would otherwise not be able to access. None of the LNPs are tax exempt (can you imagine the feds issuing tax exempt status to a federally illegal operation?). If there wasn't sales tax, the prices could come down at least a small amount. If there weren't these huge license renewal fees the prices could come down. What we, the patients, need to do is petition DOH to reduce the fees assessed to the LNPs and treat cannabis as other prescription medicine...tax exempt. After all, we are the ones actually paying for everything.

Perhaps if you contact the local producer and ask for an appointment you might be able to persuade them to reinstate you if you have been banned. I don't think you can have your cake and eat it too, however. If there is something that you feel you need to criticize, you should do so directly to them. If you were dissatisfied with your purchase, you should not have accepted it. You always have the right of refusal just as they have the right to refuse service.

Hope this helps.

[CFO]

With legalization now in WA and CO, check out this article on MSN.
9 problems pot dealers face- MSN Money
This one operation in Denver spends nearly $60,000 per MONTH to provide medicine to about 600 patients.

[alfonso2002]

Looks like I'm back to this site. Had moved to the nmmcpa site and all was fine till they decided to "update" the site now it just don't work the way it used to so here I am.I see this site has been a little slow but at least postable.

[GATXBUCK]

I was gonna check it out but any site that requires you to register before you can look through the forum or anything else almost always proves to be a waste of time in my experience.So what does the situation currently look like,is there still a problem with shortages or have things picked up a bit?

[alfonso2002]

There are still shortages the producers have gotten better at producing flower bud but the number of patients is still growing but the number of producers are not.Have heard that that DOH is saying that there is no need for more producers because there so many ppls that are producing there own flower. That is not true yes there are a lot of ppls out there but I think if it is checked out that only a 1/4 of those ppls are really able to produce enough flower for themselves.What happens is that patients get the license thinking that they will grow there own meds but things go wrong which is not hard to do and then get discouraged and don't continue to try. I tell any one that asks that if they have never grown it will take at least 1 and 1/2 years to get the hang of it.