Tancredo moves within 4 points of Hickenlooper

[wkhey4]

Given those options, the thinking man holds his nose and votes socialist. :twocents:

On issue after issue, the modern right lines up on the wrong side of civil liberty: torture, marriage equality, human migration, privacy, women's reproductive freedom, capital punishment, drug law reform, prisoners' rights... the list is endless. If the Reps were running a libertarian-leaning candidate, I would vote for him or her. They are not - the current slate of Tea Party "libertarians" are anything but lovers of liberty.

When the Republicans kick out the authoritarians and the Christian ideologues, I will return to the fold. Until then, this thinking man will vote for Democrats.

I second your emotions. Well said !:thumbsup:

[senorx12562]

Given those options, the thinking man holds his nose and votes socialist. :twocents:

On issue after issue, the modern right lines up on the wrong side of civil liberty: torture, marriage equality, human migration, privacy, women's reproductive freedom, capital punishment, drug law reform, prisoners' rights... the list is endless. If the Reps were running a libertarian-leaning candidate, I would vote for him or her. They are not - the current slate of Tea Party "libertarians" are anything but lovers of liberty.

When the Republicans kick out the authoritarians and the Christian ideologues, I will return to the fold. Until then, this thinking man will vote for Democrats.

My point was that one must vote one's conscience, and since I cannot vote for any of the above in good conscience, libertarian it is.

[wkhey4]

My point was that one must vote one's conscience, and since I cannot vote for any of the above in good conscience, libertarian it is.

Make a statement and waste a vote. Sad.

[donniedorko]

Um, Hickenlooper is bad because he's in a group called Mayors Against Illegal Guns? Isn't everyone against illegal guns? I'm pro-gun, but I think most sane people recognize there need to be people who don't have them. It's surprising to me to find anyone who is pro-illegal gun.

[mustangwomyn]

Um, Hickenlooper is bad because he's in a group called Mayors Against Illegal Guns? Isn't everyone against illegal guns? I'm pro-gun, but I think most sane people recognize there need to be people who don't have them. It's surprising to me to find anyone who is pro-illegal gun.

Excellent Point, yes the illegal guns are the problem

[Zedleppelin]

All illegal guns were legal at one point. :twocents:

[ds0110]

Id like to add that all illegal drugs were legal at one point as well. And gun laws only effect law abiding citizens, while having ZERO effect on criminals (who dont care about the laws). Prohibition does not work. not even on guns.

Socialism is not american.

Authoriatarians are present in both democrat and republican parties. Religeon is just a diversion issue used to split the people and really does not matter.

A law maker is a right taker.

[donniedorko]

Id like to add that all illegal drugs were legal at one point as well. And gun laws only effect law abiding citizens, while having ZERO effect on criminals (who dont care about the laws). Prohibition does not work. not even on guns.

Socialism is not american.

Authoriatarians are present in both democrat and republican parties. Religeon is just a diversion issue used to split the people and really does not matter.

A law maker is a right taker.

That's kind of looney tunes. The whole "gubmint is evil" thing just isn't true in many cases. Laws provide the basis for our rights oftentimes. If we had no government or laws it would be every man for himself, whoever has the strength has the right. Not a world I'd like to live in.

The limitations of libertarian philosophy become readily apparent when you look at things like civil rights and the ADA (as Rand Paul found out).

No one's talking about socialism. The whole socialism thing is a giant scare tactic. There is exactly one socialist in American government with any sort of power (Bernie Sanders, VT senator). And he generally gets ignored and ends up caucusing with/voting with the Dems, who are largely a party of the center left.

Sorry, I don't buy that all guns should be legal all the time. No one needs an RPG launcher or a machine gun nest. Especially not anyone who is a lunatic with a history of mental health problems.

I do agree with you on religion though. Which is why I haven't voted with Republicans for ~2 decades, since they were taken over by the Bible beaters.

[ds0110]

That's kind of looney tunes. The whole "gubmint is evil" thing just isn't true in many cases. Laws provide the basis for our rights oftentimes. If we had no government or laws it would be every man for himself, whoever has the strength has the right. Not a world I'd like to live in.

No one's talking about socialism. The whole socialism thing is a giant scare tactic. There is exactly one socialist in American government with any sort of power (Bernie Sanders, VT senator). And he generally gets ignored and ends up caucusing with/voting with the Dems, who are largely a party of the center left.

Sorry, I don't buy that all guns should be legal all the time. No one needs an RPG launcher or a machine gun nest. Especially not anyone who is a lunatic with a history of mental health problems.

I do agree with you on religion though. Which is why I haven't voted with Republicans for ~2 decades, since they were taken over by the Bible beaters.

100 years ago it was not "every man for himself" or whatever thunderdome scenario you were imagining. Life went on without so much govt in peoples lives. Economy flourished, people were fine. Civil rights was going to happen regardless of what economic policies we adopted. We do not need all these unnecessary laws regulating our everyday life so that a politician or LEO can keep a job they shouldnt have in the first place.

Its our right as americans to own these things. Especially if we ship 50$ billion of them to pakistan, saudi arabia, (EACH - this week) and elsewhere around the world we are one of the biggest arms exporters. If the other countries can have them, so should we. Americans should be able to buy everything foreign armies can buy, plus more...not the other way around.

The situation of our military sending arms that are prohibited to US citizens, to foreign countries that later on illegally resale them to US citizens at a huge markup...is wrong. That major source of funding for foreign organized crime is only present bc of current gun laws.

It doesnt matter what you think people need or dont need. Thats freedom. If you dont want to buy something, then dont, but dont try to tell other people what they have the right to buy, its not going to stop anyone from buying what they want, when the supply is clearly never going away. Guns are here to stay. Forget legislating them out of existence, that wont happen. This includes all "illegal" guns. Someone will profit. The question is do you want the mexican/russian cartels to profit from it, or an american in a gunstore? One will sell to felons, one wont.

And to your RPG concern...the cost would be prohibitive, much like if you want to buy a .50 cal sniper rifle today youre going to pay as much as you would for some cars new, then $10+ per shot.

Again, regardless of the laws, if I want a fully auto ak or m16, or even hand grenades or suppressors....Its not hard at all for me to buy them...and it doesnt come from a gun show/store or private purchase where there are checks to see if im a felon. It comes from a "guy" just like any illegal drug would. That stuff is actually easier for me to buy than it is to get a semi-auto .22 from a "legit" channel such as a gun show. (no bg check, no ffl, no fingerprint records, dont even give him a license) So the gun laws didnt make it harder for me to buy "illegal" weapons, they made it easier. (bc now theres big profit in learning basic gunsmithing or importing foreign military surplus) The laws provide a new way for criminals to make money.

The socialists in govt. know its not the right thing to do, and that socialism is not popular. This does not stop them from passing socialist policies to benefit their foreign lobby (bribery) interests while they hide behind their democrat or republican title. Corruption is what happens when you have big govt.

The limitations of libertarian philosophy become readily apparent when you look at things like civil rights and the ADA (as Rand Paul found out).

No they dont. The American Dental Association?? You can have both civil rights and libertarian policies. One does not somehow cancel the other.

[bikeTripper]

The American Dental Association??

Uh, I'm pretty sure he means the Americans with Disabilities Act, which Rand Paul has said he would abolish, as he does not believe government should have the power to regulate such things.