Buds are are jacked up. Please help. (Possible TMV)

[snowking]

This is my 2nd try with some White Rhino from the Green House Seed Co. The last batch I saved about half of it, and gave the rest to a friend to make some hash. My plants are screwed up and I'm at a loss to figure it out on my own. I've been lurking a half dozen forums for a year and I've never seen anyone talk about Tobacco Mosaic Virus until today. I've definitely seen some sideways leaf curl lately on a plant or two.

I don't know how TMV manifests itself in buds. My plants are ready to harvest right now, and they are looking sad. The tops of most of them are so soft and flexible that you can bend the top 2" down 90 degrees, and then rotate it around in a circle. The buds have morphed into an odd shape. Plants that were just about done, with red hairs on the top, have shot out new "flowers" with white hairs all over them. I've taken pictures but it still seems really hard to see what I'm trying to describe.

Last time I assumed it was some type of plant stress manifesting itself. (light burn, nute burn, or pot bound roots.) After reading a little bit about TMV I realized that I have seen some sideways twisted leafs for the first time on that last grow. I just haven't seen anyone really describe what the fully mature buds look like, when infected.

The last time I noticed the structure of the buds was dramatically morphed. Everything got all loose and flexible too.

On Pic2 you can kind of see how the top is done and has red hairs, but on the left side a new "flower" is exploding up and out and has new white hairs on it. I'm wondering if it might be more helpful if I take pictures from further out instead of close-up.

The 4th pic has just a mini explosion of new white flowers blowing out everywhere on the top. This doesn't look anything like a proper, healthy, mature bud.

I'm gonna grab my camera and go to work, see if I can get some pix that show more clearly what I'm talking about.

Any help would be appreciated. thanks

snowking Reviewed by snowking on 03-06-2010. Buds are are jacked up. Please help. (Possible TMV) This is my 2nd try with some White Rhino from the Green House Seed Co. The last batch I saved about half of it, and gave the rest to a friend to make some hash. My plants are screwed up and I'm at a loss to figure it out on my own. I've been lurking a half dozen forums for a year and I've never seen anyone talk about Tobacco Mosaic Virus until today. I've definitely seen some sideways leaf curl lately on a plant or two. I don't know how TMV manifests itself in buds. My plants are ready Rating: 5

[TurboALLWD]

This is my 2nd try with some White Rhino from the Green House Seed Co. The last batch I saved about half of it, and gave the rest to a friend to make some hash. My plants are screwed up and I'm at a loss to figure it out on my own. I've been lurking a half dozen forums for a year and I've never seen anyone talk about Tobacco Mosaic Virus until today. I've definitely seen some sideways leaf curl lately on a plant or two.

I don't know how TMV manifests itself in buds. My plants are ready to harvest right now, and they are looking sad. The tops of most of them are so soft and flexible that you can bend the top 2" down 90 degrees, and then rotate it around in a circle. The buds have morphed into an odd shape. Plants that were just about done, with red hairs on the top, have shot out new "flowers" with white hairs all over them. I've taken pictures but it still seems really hard to see what I'm trying to describe.

Last time I assumed it was some type of plant stress manifesting itself. (light burn, nute burn, or pot bound roots.) After reading a little bit about TMV I realized that I have seen some sideways twisted leafs for the first time on that last grow. I just haven't seen anyone really describe what the fully mature buds look like, when infected.

The last time I noticed the structure of the buds was dramatically morphed. Everything got all loose and flexible too.

On Pic2 you can kind of see how the top is done and has red hairs, but on the left side a new "flower" is exploding up and out and has new white hairs on it. I'm wondering if it might be more helpful if I take pictures from further out instead of close-up.

The 4th pic has just a mini explosion of new white flowers blowing out everywhere on the top. This doesn't look anything like a proper, healthy, mature bud.

I'm gonna grab my camera and go to work, see if I can get some pix that show more clearly what I'm talking about.

Any help would be appreciated. thanks

I just found a 2g sage bud that was in the shape of the 4th pic you posted, it appeared perfect though, no difference in the hairs or calyxes. It had grown out a lot more horizontal than vertical. Didn't check the trich's but I will the next time I see one like it. I bet theres not much thc in the new buds unless harvest is held off and there would be too much degradation of thc in the rest of the bud to make it worth holding off on harvesting. just my opinion after toking on some AK47 :stoned:

[snowking]

The first pic is a slightly better shot of the interior structure of the buds. Still hard to make out in all the green. The structure of the buds are long and slender with leaves that overlap like rose petals.

The second shot is just a demonstration of how soft the tops are. I pushed the top 2 inches of that plant over 90 degrees very easily. Also, about half way through flower it seemed to me like the trichome production was down. It still looks that way to me. I've grown other strains that were just sick with trikes. Even the last batch of White Rhino had more than these. Something is wrong.

[canni13is]

Tobacco mosaic virus only effects the solanaceae plant family which cannabis is not part of. im not sure if this is normal or not. it sure looks normal and healthy

[canni13is]

http://www.gardenscure.com/420/attac...10-sidebud.jpg


I think you just have a really unique growing plant. maybe some mutated inbreed strain or sumthin. This is what we get for fuckin with genetics. I think it will turn out wonderful. Let us know, its not like your scared to try it.... are you? :bonghit:

[bigtopsfinn]

Looks over-fertilized to me. Doesn't TMV "bleach" half of the leaf? I don't see that in your pics, just a lot of tip burn...

Fill out the troubleshooting form at the top of this forum, and copy and paste it here.

[WashougalWonder]

I agree with Finn

[snowking]

Indoor grow, coco coir, drain-to-waste, tap water @ 200ppms, nute Ph 6.0-6.3, nutes: GH 3part, Liquid Karma, CalMag+, GH Liquid KoolBloom, hand water every 3 days, 600W HPS lights @ about 16" (air cooled), room temps 68-79, ventilation: charcoal fan filter with can fan, air exchange @ 1 per minute.

Genetics: Green House Seed Co - White Rhino. Clones taken from mothers grown from WR seeds that I popped personally.

Are my plants over-fertilized? Yes. They are. Does over fertilization result in completely deformed buds with super soft flexible stems? I hope the answer is YES.

Two threads that sent me down the "possible TMV" path, only problem is that these only have pictures of problematic leaves. No one discusses how fully matured flowers are affected.

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=106396
Persistent leaf issue...A phenotype trait or other? - International Cannagraphic Magazine Forums


I believe this person has the same problem I do, and better pictures (and they are fully flowered). When you look at these pictures, notice that instead of a fan leaf with 5 blades at the top, there are leaves growing out that have only 1 leaf.
strange new growth at end of cycle - International Cannagraphic Magazine Forums


Assuming it's not an actual virus, can "plant stress" be responsible for completely deformed buds? Does it manifest itself that way? To re-iterate... here are the main problems/symptoms:

1. Flexible tops - Can easily bend the top 2" of my plants over 90 degrees.
2. Deformed buds - Buds go from typical compact, dense, round flowers with mini fan leaves
underneath to longer, light, looser, sort of funnel shaped, like rose petals.
3. New growth - Plants have been in flower for a full 9 weeks. Trichomes are perfect. 1 week
ago most hairs were healthy and red. Now, the tops are exploding with new deformed flowers
with new white hairs.

The last time this happened, after I was done trimming the plants and removing the buds from the stems, I noticed that the stems were nice and smooth up to the tops. Where the plants were "infected" the underlying stems were kinda gnarly and knotted. I set some of the bud aside and smoked it after it cured. It was kinda harsh and less potent (i.e. not very stoney).

Last grow I assumed plant stress due to lighting or nutes. This grow I lowered the nute dosage and kept the plants further from the lights. This grow the leaves are less burned, but all of the above symptoms have not changed.

Yes, it sounds encouraging that I'm using phrases like "tops are exploding" and "new growth". But these are unusually deformed buds, that are harsh to smoke and not very potent. Not at all something to aspire to.

On a typical good grow, my buds are like little baseball bats. The cola's are firm and thick all the way to the top of the plant. There is NO flexibility at the tops of the plants. NONE. ZERO. Healthy plants DO NOT BEND EASILY at the tops. And it's not just the tops. It's the tops of all the buds including the side growth.

As I start harvesting these I'm going to pull them apart and take more detailed photo's. Hopefully, that will help. I'm having a difficult time communicating my problem and the pictures are too hard to make out the details.

I really appreciate any help with this. thanks

[canni13is]

Like i said this is usually caused by using unstable strains and genetics. ALOT of cannabis strains do some funky shit. When people inbreed for years upon years, you get a mutant. Its no different in the plant world. There is some werid shit out there man, look at this strain for proof.Barney's - Seeds



and its not tmv. As i said before TMV only infects plants in the nightshade family.

[bigtopsfinn]

Sounds like underwatering. Coco needs to be watered every day, if not twice a day...