Help a guy out please...

[devilcowboy3]

So, I thought i mentioned all important info... guess i forgot a couple things. damn potheads :jointsmile:. SO, I had flushed them, two and a half weeks of straight water 1.5 gallons each watering and watered when they needed it probably 4 or 5 times. Then i went to the store, added my CRAZY (bat) shit and magpro. Thats where we are now. The temps shouldnt be a problem. Until they get nice looking i am keeping them vegging in my 4x4x7 tent 24 hours of light. the room stays between 78 and 84, just within the last week or so, it has creeped above to 87, 88 with the freaky weather we have.
I did notice that the bat poo i bought might have been mis-labeled? Ill post a pic... The top sticker said bat poo, high in nitrogen 10-6-2... Then i wondered why there was a sticker, pulled it off.... Lo and behold, Its the High phos bat poo... lower nitrogen content at 6-10-2... Maybe thats not helping?

Also, Myself and a buddy have had one of the strains for a little while. Its Purple Thunder... The other i got from a contact up here and i cant get a history or anything but its supposed to be a Orange Kush

[jakester]

So, I thought i mentioned all important info... guess i forgot a couple things. damn potheads :jointsmile:. SO, I had flushed them, two and a half weeks of straight water 1.5 gallons each watering and watered when they needed it probably 4 or 5 times.

Just to be clear, you "flushed" them with 1.5 gallons of plain water at a time or you flushed them, with say 10 gallons or more a and then gave them water in 1.5 gal amounts?

Flushing is a lot more than just giving them plain water, it's a complete rinse of double (or more) the pot size in water.

If you flush with 1.5 gal you just wet the salt crystals until the next time they dry out again and again. Then you add something else to the mix and things are going to get wacky in that soil.

[aquanaut]

Looks like Cal-Mag deficiency I was combating for a while. I flushed and then watered with CalMag+ as per label and my plants started to green up in a day.

:twocents:

[devilcowboy3]

I dont have a whole lot of room to work with. I water first with 2 gallons of water ( about 2 to 3 times what i usually use to water them) then wait for 10 15 mins and water them with 5 gallons of water ( I hate filling up a 5 gallon bucket and lugging it from the tub to the bedroom twice and it seems like more would just hold too much water in the soil to me)... That is my flush, then for 2 more weeks ( it took about a 5 or 6 days for the soil to dry out from the flush ) i water with plain water 1.5 gallons ( .5 gals to wet the soil and the other gallon to push any little thing out). I ended the flush 3.5 weeks or so ago and then the plain water cycle i ended a week or so ago. Then (about a week ago) I added my poop and magpro. Now we are here... at the pics and previous post... Keep em coming guys, my girls lifes depend on you... No pressure :yeahright:

[Rusty Trichome]

Well, from what I understand, if the salts are built up to the point that the plants roots are not able to get what they need from the soil you would have all sorts of deficiencies.

Yup. Since most nutrients are salts, they tend to build-up. This causes ph swings and lockout. (yellowing, stunted growth...underperforming in general)

I usually recommend starting with a flush because it's the least likely thing to add to the problem. Most people who use nutrients in soil don't flush adequately fearing overwatering.

I use Fox Farms 3-pack, and since it's notorious for salt build-up, I do preventative flushes monthly, on a schedule. About one gallon of properly ph'd water per gallon of pot size.

Do not overflush on a consistent basis. (every week is way too much...)
Overflushing will also flush-away the buffers (limestone, quartz, (silicates) lime...) in the soil, which will also cause wild ph swings.

I am starting to agree with you. I have been doing organic gardening for years but it's not something I recommend to people indoors with little gardening experience.

Tends to be a tad 'hot' and harder to dial-in.

Keep it simple. Organic is more than just a style of garden product that you can purchase. 95% of growers would have better luck with a simple bag of MG.

Yup.

So, I thought i mentioned all important info... guess i forgot a couple things.

Tiz why someone went through all the trouble of making a troubleshooting form. So some mambers have a guide to follow, and perhaps, save their plants.

SO, I had flushed them, two and a half weeks of straight water 1.5 gallons each watering and watered when they needed it probably 4 or 5 times. Then i went to the store, added my CRAZY (bat) shit and magpro.

Where did you get that crazy schedule? A flush should be a one-time event, not something spread-out over days or weeks. Get yourself on a permanent schedule pronto. No more hit-n-miss, no guesswork. Before adding any other technique or additive...ask folks here.

Check again for the bat shit N-P-K. Bat guano shouldn't have much, if any, nitrogen. Both of your numbers sound wrong, unless it's a fertilizer instead of a ammendment. Also, it says it's a high phosphorous guano, right? The PO4 (phosphorous) lowers ph. very effectively. (can lower it enough to lock-out nutrients)

[devilcowboy3]

I dont know where i got my flush schedule from... i kinda just put together one from a few different methods and added a little time... bad recipe i guess:hippy:
As for my poop, I put up a pic of them i thought... but as i read the numbers they are: from the original box (under the sticker) N6...P10...K1... From the sticker N10...P6....K2..
Its from the Down to Earth Distributors brand...
Maybe I should do a real flush? Is that what the consensus is?

[devilcowboy3]

So i was wondering what Rusty meant by filling out a form... Apparently my bloodshot eyes skipped right over the form... so here it is...

Indoor Crop
Soil
Black gold (mixed three bags: Natural & Organic Potting soil, Garden compost Amendment, and the
soil conditioner (again, all from black gold)
Using Humboldt Naturals (grow currently, not inthe blooming yet) and within the last 2 weeks have
added a small amount of MAGPRO
I think i need to get a new ph meter...
Water from the tap, let sit with a bubbler for 2 days before anything is done to it. Last time i read
it, was 6.8 but i think my meter is whacked, as i tested all sorts of stuff, from my spit to bleach and it all read 6. something....
My problems spread across two strains, some seeds some clones. Ages vary between 3 weeks ( 1 week in my cloner
and 2 weeks in the soil) all the way to 2 months... they are all having the problem, but the
seed girls have bounced back green wise since the addition of the MAGPRO, but they still havent made any side
branches...
Humbold Naturals Grow (and bloom later but not now)
Usually water with 5ML HNG solution in 1 gallon of water once a week with a .5 gallon of plain water sometime
during the same week when she needs it.
400W MH light hanging horizontally about 20 inches off the top of teh canopy.
The temp used to hover in the 80s but two days ago i re-rigged my cooling system and now we stay at a cool 72. Lights are
24 hours currently
humidity is about 30-35%
Venting- I have ducting from my bedroom window to a 4x4 grow tent. I have a 4 inch fan sucking all that air through a carbon
filter (homemade) then venting that through more ducts into another room in the house to be dispersed as
my heating element

[Rusty Trichome]

I'd ease-up on throwing everything under the sun at your plants. You can kill them with kindness. Any Dr. Q's Filthy Rich potting soil available where you get the Black Gold from?

Potting soil and garden compost are two different animals, and are buffered differently. Potting mixes are usually buffered to around 7.0 and compost is buffered at 6.0 ish. Over time, both mixes will lost their buffering, and ph will start to plummet.

Did you add perlite to the mix? Black Gold has some excellent perlite. (I use it)

There is no reason to bubble your water before adding to the soil. When you water, the suction it creates in the soil draws-down the air anyway.

Careful using MagPro. Excessive magnesium (also called mag. sulphate - epsom salt) can and will lock-out the other nutrients.

In the 80's is fine. I don't recommend this to newby's, but during the summer my ambient flower shed temps can easily reach 100.

If possible, lower your 400 watter to around 16 or so inches.

[devilcowboy3]

I'd ease-up on throwing everything under the sun at your plants. You can kill them with kindness. Any Dr. Q's Filthy Rich potting soil available where you get the Black Gold from?

Potting soil and garden compost are two different animals, and are buffered differently. Potting mixes are usually buffered to around 7.0 and compost is buffered at 6.0 ish. Over time, both mixes will lost their buffering, and ph will start to plummet.

Did you add perlite to the mix? Black Gold has some excellent perlite. (I use it)

There is no reason to bubble your water before adding to the soil. When you water, the suction it creates in the soil draws-down the air anyway.

Careful using MagPro. Excessive magnesium (also called mag. sulphate - epsom salt) can and will lock-out the other nutrients.

In the 80's is fine. I don't recommend this to newby's, but during the summer my ambient flower shed temps can easily reach 100.

If possible, lower your 400 watter to around 16 or so inches.

No Dr. Q's in my area that i can find.
I did not add perlite, but it does have its own in it. I toss a little bit of coco coir in there too (just because i have extra from an old hydro grow, i didnt really measure and it probably wasnt enough to mention...)
I have always read to at least let your air set out for a day or so to let the chlorine vapor off. I use the bubbler to help this out. Do i not need to be doing this?
I lowered my temps too. They are down to 72-76 now.
When i get the girls back to being healthy i will lower the light down :thumbsup:
I cant figure out the damn multi quote either

[Rusty Trichome]

No Dr. Q's in my area that i can find.

If there's a Star Nursery near you, it's their brand. They also carry the Black Gold line, which is why I was curious...

I did not add perlite, but it does have its own in it. I toss a little bit of coco coir in there too (just because i have extra from an old hydro grow, i didnt really measure and it probably wasnt enough to mention...)

Ok...what does this do to your soil chemistry and ph? Doesn't Coco require frequent flushing?

I have always read to at least let your air set out for a day or so to let the chlorine vapor off. I use the bubbler to help this out. Do i not need to be doing this?

A lot of municipalities (cities) are using a solid form of chlorine, and no ammount of sitting or bubbling will remove it. Google water quality in your area. You should be able to find-out with a little bit of detective work. If your water company uses the solids, R/O or carbon filtering is the cheapest way to remove it. Unless your water (snow) has been sitting around for a few weeks in a bucket, no need to aerate. It's an unnecessary step.

I cant figure out the damn multi quote either

ahhh...the old milti-quote dementia...
Easiest way, is to go to someone's multi-quote post, hit the quote button, and see what was done and how. All the tags will be there for you to see. (It's just a cut-n-paste project)