HID Time factor manipulation

[scott9116]

I've been following the UV-B thread for a while. Cool stuff. Makes me want to get back into growing. But, what really gets me going is the Martian stuff and the light time factors for increasing tric production. I seems to me that, unless you've got a ton of cash for LED's or have alot invested in HPS setups already, it's really hard to get down to the magic 1.8 and decent yield. However, I have some ideas to get closer:

Fluorescent Supplemental Lighting: http://kinoflow.com has HO tubes in specific ranges. 625nm 420nm 450nm etc.

Desisti (couldn't get the site to work) available here:bh photo - Google Search
Also makes tubes in red and blue in both HO and regular flavors.

Buy two cheap walmart shoplights. Remove ballast from one and add it to the other one ballast per bulb should let you run the HO lights without spending a fortune. There are a lot of possible ways to do this. I've built fixtures like this in the past. I don't want to get too technical right now about the wiring. MIght post pics later.

If you have an overkill HID set up. Anodized reflectors. Use red or blue reflectors to help filter out the excess spectrum. I think using filters would cost too much light but having the reflective output modified couldn't hurt. I've run two 400w hps and two 4'shoplights with 2700k&3200k bulbs along with 6500k&10,000k cfls in a 2'x5' grow with staggered timing to control heat and to change angle of penetration (exercise program) with good results.

Just a couple things running through my head. Thoughts?

scott9116 Reviewed by scott9116 on 01-15-2010. HID Time factor manipulation I've been following the UV-B thread for a while. Cool stuff. Makes me want to get back into growing. But, what really gets me going is the Martian stuff and the light time factors for increasing tric production. I seems to me that, unless you've got a ton of cash for LED's or have alot invested in HPS setups already, it's really hard to get down to the magic 1.8 and decent yield. However, I have some ideas to get closer: Fluorescent Supplemental Lighting: http://kinoflow.com has HO Rating: 5

[scott9116]

Well this is what we've got. 2 $10shoplights ballast removed from one and added to the other. Didn't get pics of the wiring but I'm gonna make another soon. It's pretty straight forward red to red black to black etc. 2 kinoflo 450nm tubes. Bright!! Reeeaally bright!:thumbsup:

[Rusty Trichome]

I've been following the UV-B thread for a while. Cool stuff. Makes me want to get back into growing.

Evidently so. Looks like you bought the equipment already, lol.

Just a couple things running through my head. Thoughts?

Magic 1.8?

Not slamming someone's desire to experiment and spend, but, if making shit more complicated and more expensive is worth the added possibilities of "experimentational failure", I'd say go for it. Are those bulbs expensive and readily available? Are the bulbs safe to be around when operational? Do you recommend someone without electricians experience dick with the ballasts which hold a charge that can knock you on your ass if improperly handled? Do you really think these techniques and associated equipment increases trichs or quality, or quantity, or tastes...to the point of cost-effectiveness? By the sounds of it, you can get the same thing with a UV bulb, 'normal' growroom lighting, and some patience.

Anyway, in keeping things simple and being patient...you can grow one hit cannabis that would get the neighbors high at thirty paces. To me...mostly all of these specialized items and grow goops are marketing hype geared twords you opening your checkbook. Were the UV lamp expensive, likely I wouldn't have tried it. (but I did, and it worked for me...mostly)

Same goes for the LED's. Until someone with the big bucks can decipher the LED conundrums, I'll pass. Was using 2 400w HPS's, but I recently upgraded to a 1000 watter. I'm not at all disappointed with the purchase, as it kicks-ass. No filters, no bells, no whistles. To me...HPS at any wattage is proven, reliable, and worry-free. Same with the CFL's I use for vegging. Available at any WalMart.

I guess it's what you want out of your plants. I just want a consistent supply of the best smoke I've ever smoked and I get that without breaking the bank. You'd be hard-pressed convincing me that mine needs to be better or more expensive.

Don't get me wrong...I'm not saying the stuff you got doesn't work as advertised...just doubtful if it's worth the additional cash, in an attempt to make my primo buds..."magic".

[Dogznova]

It's not HID's time factor that I try to manipulate...HID has a time factor of 3.6 and it's a very strong 3.6, hence the (high intensity). Trying to get HID's time factor down to 1.8 (wile the light is on) is not cost effective at all...This is kind of hard to explain, but it's the plants 24 hour time factor I'm trying to manipulate. By properly using individual spectrums of light we can (indoors) create aprox a 1.8 time factor, But it requires 24 hours of light. Sun light has a time factor of 1.7 so you can see the reason for the 1.8 time factor. Sorry if I confused you..


Anyway.... Yes at the end of the UV-b tread I did start to talk to MAC about the PAD stuff. I wanted to show him were to read it..But what I originally started talking about was Clear Inc's for ripening and trich production....

As I stated in that tread.. I get better results using supplemental clear inc's. The cost if you buy a Halogen is about $4.95 for 100 watts and a regular clear inc cost about $1 each. In my garden i've gotten much better trich results with these type of clear inc's then a uv-b bulb.. Clear inc's have alot of 660/730 in them.......

Plus 660/730 is also PAD lighting and that just happens to be the light that pumps up the trics...NOT uv-b... Also 660/730 PAD lighting cycled properly has 99% synthesis potential, again the sun has 99.8% synthesis potential and HID has 69%.. So running PAD lighting 660/730 for 17 + hours can get some crazy results..For one it's equaled to 12 hours of Standard Indoor Darkness (SID) and 5 hours of Day Light.. That in it's self is a nice trick don't you think..

Not sure what your plans are with the shop lights... Are you going to add the blue to your HPS on time? If that's the plan it will take alot of them IMO to get HID's time factor down to 1.8.. If running HID... Look into Rauber's substitution method in the PAD manual, chapter 10... Hope this helps.:thumbsup:

[Rusty Trichome]

Are some strains more suceptable to the positive results, or is it like UV...hit-n-miss?

I'll watch and enjoy, but am just as comfortable doing what I've been doing. I imagine it's more important to some than other's, but I produce killer shit without having to research for hours a day...sorting the facts from bullshit, wracking your brain finding a hypothesis that supports your outcome, financing a potential...I just haven't got that kind of time or money any more.

The UV IMHO is a great way to imporve some strains production of aroma's and effects, but I gave-up on trying to increase trichomes when it was pointed-out to me about the genetically pre-set structure of leaves. I do appreciates what UV does for/to the trichomes though. Perhaps stunting the leaves gives the appearance of increased trichs, but the best effect of UV in my garden was the psychoactive results over non UV use. Bummer my wife is so sensitive about UV causing cancer, but that's the way it goes.

Simply put...changing my schedules, equipment and mindset isn't in the cards, but I do try and keep-up on things. :thumbsup:

[Dogznova]

Rusty... Very good points...I mean 660nm LED's are not cheap.. HID is a very proven lighting setup.

Most strains I've tried uv-b on has increased trich's but it's too hazardous for me and my uncle.. Then we seen clear inc's do a better job.. Finding out that clear inc's are mostly 660/730 explains our findings.. Until I smoked PAD med's I thought just like you HID was doing just fine... But after comparing PAD med's to a standard 12/12 HID med's, I can say there is quite a difference.. BUT yes is it worth the extra money/setup... I think for some it will be and for some it won't be.. For LED growers it will be a must..:thumbsup:

[Dogznova]

Are some strains more suceptable to the positive results, or is it like UV...hit-n-miss?:

No... PAD lighting can double the THC content in most strains and in some cases like bag seed it can almost triple it's content..

BTW clear inc's are NOT a PAD lighting...Just thought I would put that in there.

[jakester]

No... PAD lighting can double the THC content in most strains and in some cases like bag seed it can almost triple it's content..

Please....a link or something? That's a hefty claim.

[Dogznova]

The link to the PAD manual is one of the last post in the uv-b tread in the advanced section here started by oldmac.. The manual explains PAD lighting.. It dosen't explain THC though.. Sorry

[scott9116]

Wow, Dogz! Where do I start? I am a pretty experienced grower. I have been on a break for awhile. I have a pretty nice HPS/Flourescent setup. It has just been growin' other stuff. I' have a few amazing basil strains that I've bred. I'm a natural experimenter.
The premise here is to, of course grow the best that I can with what I can afford. The light pictured is my answer to LED. It cost me <$60 total. What kind of LED setup can you get for $60? I thought I posted a link. The manufacturers don't seem to have any warnings about exposure. I spent some time looking for a light source that is targeted at specific ranges similar to LED's but less expensive. I thought it would be nice to share my luck at finding these.
Yes, I had already ordered the bulbs to replace the tubes in my current setup that needed replacing. I use flouros to supplement the HPS. My thinking is blue and red is more useable light than the 2700k and 3200k. I'll keep the 10000k CFL's.
I have used MV for UV in the past. It did seem to frost things up. My comment on not being able to see much, was kind of an inside joke. I have vision problems that are completely unrelated to any light exposure. I've got to lay down for a bit. I'll be back. Thanks for the input everyone. I love this forum.