first big grow by twitch

[twitch]

and what if i use the hps for veg and flower

[Joel]

Using the HPS for flower is not a "bad" thing just not preferrable. Everyone here would rather use MH over HPS for vegatation as someone stated above it gives off a blue spectrum wich the plant loves for vegatation. BUT you can get HPS bulbs with bluespectrum in them, now I havent tryed vegging with one yet but I can imagine it would be alright since HPS gives out more lumens then MH.

[Vancefish]

From what I've read(in the lighting section of this forum).

MH put out a higher blue spectrum and are best for Vegitative growth. There is also some belief that the UV put out by these produces more resins.

HPS put out a higher RED spectrum thus simulating the Fall sun. Which in turn is needed to flower.

It has been said running both the entire time is best. However next best is MH to grow and HPS to flower

This whole thread is a mess. What I said above and quoted myself on is what almost ALL of the lighting posts say. My only mistake was saying RED was NEEDED to flower. What I should have said was RED is useful to the plant during flower, not NEEDED.

MH to grow the plant. (uses blue spectrum for growth)

HPS to flower the plant. (uses RED spectrum for best flowering)

MH AND HPS for all stages (uses Blue to grow, uses red during flower and SOME PEOPLE SAY,... The UV in the MH CAN (supposedly) create more resins during flower, which is normally missing in a HPS. THUS this (RUNNING BOTH DURING FLOWER) is considered the best method.

what i was asking is what is the disadvantage of using an hps the whole way
through? i mean i ma getting an MH today anyway i was just curious as to why
i see these people with the monster grows that they use hps on there veg
stage too.... i was kinda hoping for a response from someone that uses the
hps for veg, no offence to the people that put their :twocents: in
oh and i dont think a MH can help with resin production since all the resin
production i have seen comes in the flower stage

And THIS is exactly the info I was trying to get across.

You can (and many people do) use HPS for ALL stages.

The reason HPS is not "prefered" during the growth stages is the plant uses/needs far more BLUE light to grow then RED. The only disadvantage to using MH to grow is the lack of RED during flower and the only disadvantage to HPS for growing is the shortage of blue during vegitative.

This plant produces RESINS to protect itself from UV (sunburn). Thus SOME PEOPLE SAY using the HPS to get your RED spectrum (for bigger flowers) AND a MH at the same time (for UV) will produce higher resin consentration. I personally DO NOT know that it's true. It does make sence to me if this really is the purpose of the resins.

This being re-stated I repeat,... The disadvantage to HPS for all stages is the LACK OF BLUE LIGHT in most HPS bulbs for great vegitative growth!

And YES Joel HPS IS considered best for flowering. MH is best for VEG because of the BLUE! I think you reversed it there.

Sorry this is getting so confusing. I said RED was NEEDED, and that seems to have been taken to say it wouldn't flower at all without RED. This is NOT what I meant. I just meant to say RED is advantagous during flower. However the increased BLUE from a MH is better for veg., when RED is not really needed at all.

[frostedwonder]

In my first log on here I used a 400w hortilux super hps bulb from begging to end. I did start them of course under cfl just till they could take the hps.

This current log I am doing I switched from a basic 400W MH and then to a Super Spectrum Enhanced Hps for my current flowering stage. I bought the Hortilux bulb that offers 25% more energy in Violet, Blue and Green spectrum than standard High Pressure Sodium.

So not sure as of yet if it has noticeable differences of growth compared with a normal hps. If it does then then a person wouldn't have to think as much about running both during flower.With a switchable ballast you can run mh just for veg then switch to the enhanced hps bulb or one bulb str8 thru.
There is also a Dual arc 1000w MH&HPS that puts out 110,000 lumens and does look cool. Anyone messed with those type of bulbs? :stoned:

[headshake]

Yes AND No!

Red spectrum is not NEEDED to make flowers. IT IS however a factor in the size and potency of those flowers.

ok, first off spectrum doesn't play hardly a part, if any, in flower size or potency for that matter. all spectrum is is the color temperature of the light that your bulb(s) put out.

genetics will be the biggest single factor. period. the type of light would be next, not spectrum. see your example below for more on this.

You could flower a plant under pure blue CFLs sure, but lets see you pull the same kind of weight per plant at a high red spectrum HPS.

ummmm no shit!? of course you are not gonna put on as much weight with CFLs as opposed to an HPS. not to mention wft is pure blue light. we are talking white light here, which is composed of red, orange, yellow, green, blue, indigo and violet. the blue you are referring to is COLOR SPECTRUM, or merely the temperature of white light that the bulb emits.

Are you actually saying RED has no benefit to flowering???:wtf:

i never stated such a claim. yes, the HPS will help you put on more weight during flower, HOWEVER the UV that the MH will pack on the trichs better and produce more terpins which will give you better smell/taste.

so next time before you want to try to lecture me or anyone else you might want to make sure that you have your shit straight or are prepared to take notes following the onslaught that ensues after your post. (got your pen and pad handy? well go fucking grab it!!!)

i don't need you and all of your 43 posts to cosign shit that i say. i think my rep around here speaks for itself.


-shake


vance, the red spectrum of an HPS is the natural spectrum it puts out, which is similar to the sun in the fall. the MH naturally puts out a more blue color temperature, similar to the summer days. that's all. PERIOD.

why do you suppose they sell HPS bulbs that push out more blue as FW stated? hmmmm, i wonder?


twitch, you can run a HPS the whole way. people normally due this because they can only get an HPS or MH ballast, the HPS puts on more weight in flower, so they pick that one. many get a MH conversion bulb to run in their HPS ballast for veg. (this isn't applicable for a digital or switchable ballast).

i hope that answered your question.

[twitch]

yes for fucks sakes thats all i wanted thats the exact answer i was looking for
sh!t talk about pulling teeth

i am getting a MH soon i didnt go today to lazy and its not needed yet

thanks again shake

[headshake]

yes for fucks sakes thats all i wanted thats the exact answer i was looking for
sh!t talk about pulling teeth

i am getting a MH soon i didnt go today to lazy and its not needed yet

thanks again shake

no sweat man. that's all i try to do around here is help out. there is an occasional rant thrown in for good measure. lol.


-shake

[cannamanibus]

That was funny. I got no where by the end of the thread. Red blue red blue, just grow some fukn plants. haha j/k.

[Vancefish]

ok, first off spectrum doesn't play hardly a part, if any, in flower size or potency for that matter. all spectrum is is the color temperature of the light that your bulb(s) put out.



genetics will be the biggest single factor. period. the type of light would be next, not spectrum. see your example below for more on this.



ummmm no shit!? of course you are not gonna put on as much weight with CFLs as opposed to an HPS. not to mention wft is pure blue light. we are talking white light here, which is composed of red, orange, yellow, green, blue, indigo and violet. the blue you are referring to is COLOR SPECTRUM, or merely the temperature of white light that the bulb emits.



i never stated such a claim. yes, the HPS will help you put on more weight during flower, HOWEVER the UV that the MH will pack on the trichs better and produce more terpins which will give you better smell/taste.

so next time before you want to try to lecture me or anyone else you might want to make sure that you have your shit straight or are prepared to take notes following the onslaught that ensues after your post. (got your pen and pad handy? well go fucking grab it!!!)

i don't need you and all of your 43 posts to cosign shit that i say. i think my rep around here speaks for itself.


-shake


vance, the red spectrum of an HPS is the natural spectrum it puts out, which is similar to the sun in the fall. the MH naturally puts out a more blue color temperature, similar to the summer days. that's all. PERIOD.

why do you suppose they sell HPS bulbs that push out more blue as FW stated? hmmmm, i wonder?


twitch, you can run a HPS the whole way. people normally due this because they can only get an HPS or MH ballast, the HPS puts on more weight in flower, so they pick that one. many get a MH conversion bulb to run in their HPS ballast for veg. (this isn't applicable for a digital or switchable ballast).

i hope that answered your question.

I never meant to start any fight. I just responded with what I'd learned from what I'd read.

ok, first off spectrum doesn't play hardly a part, if any, in flower size or potency for that matter. all spectrum is is the color temperature of the light that your bulb(s) put out.

Pulled from grow guide site:

Metal Halide - MH
Metal halide bulbs produce an abundance of light in the blue spectrum. This color of light promotes plant growth and is excellent for green leafy growth and keeping plants compact. It is the best type of light to be used as a primary light source (if no or little natural sunlight is available). The average lifespan is about 10,000 cumulative hours. The bulb will light up beyond this time but due to the gradual decline of light, it is not worth your while to wait for the bulb to finally burn out. If you compare their lumen (brightness) per unit of energy consumed, metal halides produce up to 125 lumens per watt compared to 39 lumens per watt with fluorescent lights and 18 lumens per watt for standard incandescent bulbs.


High Pressure Sodium - HPS
High pressure sodium bulbs emit an orange-red glow. This band of light triggers hormones in plants to increase flowering/budding in plants. They are the best lights available for secondary or supplemental lighting (used in conjunction with natural sunlight). This is ideal for greenhouse growing applications.

Not only is this a great flowering light, it has two features that make it a more economical choice. Their average lifespan is twice that of metal halides, but after 18,000 hours of use, they will start to draw more electricity than their rated watts while gradually producing less light. HPS bulbs are very efficient. They produce up to 140 lumens per watt. Their disadvantage is they are deficient in the blue spectrum. If a gardener were to start a young plant under a HPS bulb, she/he would see impressive vertical growth. In fact, probably too impressive. Most plants would grow up thin and lanky and in no time you will have to prune your plant back before it grows into the light fixture. The exception to this is using a HPS light in a greenhouse. Sunlight is high in the blue spectrum which would offset any stretching caused by HPS bulbs.

Here is a chart found on this site showing the plants do not use Yellow or Green spectrums for photosythesis. However it does support High Blue to Veg (MH)!

Cannabis Forums Message Boards - Medical Marijuana, Cannabis Club, Dispensary, News

vance, the red spectrum of an HPS is the natural spectrum it puts out, which is similar to the sun in the fall. the MH naturally puts out a more blue color temperature, similar to the summer days. that's all. PERIOD.

why do you suppose they sell HPS bulbs that push out more blue as FW stated? hmmmm, i wonder?

so next time before you want to try to lecture me or anyone else you might want to make sure that you have your shit straight or are prepared to take notes following the onslaught that ensues after your post. (got your pen and pad handy? well go fucking grab it!!!)

i don't need you and all of your 43 posts to cosign shit that i say. i think my rep around here speaks for itself.

I did not ATTACK anyone around here. ALL I did was post that MH is SAID to be better to GROW plants and RED was better to FLOWER!!

Just because I have only 50 posts DOESN'T mean I'm an idiot who deserves this bull!

â?¢Plants, in fact, do grow faster under certain colors of light. The reason for this is that chloroplasts can only absorb certain wavelengths of light because of the pigments they contain. There are 2 photosystems in plants called photosystem I and II. PS I absorbs light on the wavelength of 700nm while PS II absorbs 680nm because of their utilization of chlorophyll A and B. These two frequencies are are known as the peak absorption points because they are the wavelength at which light is most strongly absorbed. Different forms of chlorophyll and other photosynthetic pigments absorb other other frequencies of light but PS I and PS II are what is used for synthesizing ATP and reducing power which plants use to grow. The visible spectrum of light is between 380-750nm for humans. Therefore PS I and II require red light to perform photosynthesis. As stated before, however, there are other photosynthetic pigments present in plants and other phototrophic species such as bacteria and algae that absorb other pigments. An example of this is the carotenoid pigment that absorbs primarily blue light as do chlorophyll A and B. Blue light contains more energy than red light but for PS I and II and plant growth both are needed. Studies in the 50's showed that the rate of photosynthesis increased under far-red and red light compared to other frequencies.

I posted MY NOTES. I got my info HERE! What do you have to "Back up" your claims that Color plays NO ROLE! I NEVER said anything about your reputation. I didn't attack you. YOU attacked me for saying red was NEEDED! All I've done since was try to back up what I said. In THIS post I have pulled info PROVING what I said to be true! (or at least proving this site mainly supports what I posted). If the poster of this thread decides NOT to pay attention to what THIS site says about spectrum then OK. If YOU decide to ignore it. :thumbsup:

I found posting what I'd read about plants photosynthetic spectral ranges quite disheartening. I post what THIS SITE(and every other site) says about spectrum and I am suddanly some asshole who's trying to undermine some other person! I did NO SUCH THING! I only posted what the scientists are saying about spectrum and plant growth. I did not say that UV makes it more potent! I said "some people are claiming" that UV plays a role. This I have been unable to find any proof of being true. Therfore I posted it and said "SOME PEOPLE CLAIM!"

Why do they sell HPS with a higher BLUE range??

BECAUSE Blue is better for vegitative growth and HPS are usually short on this range of the spectrum. HENCE why MH is better for GROWING your plants then HPS.

[twitch]

OUT!!!!
u have tainted my thread i am going to have to start a new one becuase there
is to much bull shit on here about lights and the colors. i have done 3 grows in
the past, i am no pro but by this point i get the whole spectrum thing. i wasnt
asking about colors u made it about colors, Shake answered my questions now
drop it i dont want to see u on my next grow log unless its to say nice nugs
other then that u can keep ur 2 cents in your pocket.... i am not saying ur
wrong your just annoying....

and its doesn't seem like ur getting it or i just didnt read ur whole post....
ITS WHEN YOU PUT THEM IN TO 12/12 LIGHT THAT TRIGGERS THE FLOWERING!!
thats why u can do a (seed to bud) and get product in under 3 months
^^^lets not start an augment about that either guys

anyways if u have been watching this grow i am going to start a new log in
grow logs with out all this talk of light colors in the next day or 2 probably
today with new pics