Quote Originally Posted by Ramulux
If our government was able to provide the basic necessities to anyone willing to work for them, their would be no need for socialism. The welfare state would not exist if the average American was able to provide for themselves and their family on a working wage. The socialistic policies which have been adapted by the American government over the years are there to address certain domestic failures within the federal government.
The government isn't responsible for providing financially for American families. We come back to personal responsibility. Anyone is capable of surviving on wages made form working the most menial job, they simply have to budget their money. If they are uneducated, unskilled, and unable to find a decent paying job they shouldn't have children. It is not the tax payers responsibility to pay for someone's kids.

The reality is that there are millions of Americans out there with no health insurance, no life insurance, and no savings. These are honest hard working people who are simply unable to make the money needed to take care of themselves. What are they supposed to do? How are they supposed to take care of their families? The government is not helping these people in any way. Yet they pay taxes. They pay money to the federal government in the hopes that they will use it to provide for the common people.
If they don't have health insurance they need to look for a job that will cover them and their family or buy a private plan. If health insurance is important to them they can sell their tv, downgrade their car, move into a cheaper apartment, eat less, etc. I don't have a fucking savings account, but I also don't think anyone else should provide me with one! If saving money were important to me I would not smoke weed, buy so many books, drink beer, and have an HDTV.

I also disagree with the current tax code, however, why should they get more from the government than the average citizen?

We also have charity hospitals in most major cities. Free health care is already being provided in the form of these free hospitals and clinics. No, they aren't great and the lines are ridiculous, but it is far better than nothing. If you can't afford to pay it on your own, you can't complain about the charity already being extended by the tax payer.

A lot of people forget why we pay taxes. We don't pay it for the privilege of simply living in this country, we pay it so that the government can make things better. We pay it so that the jobs we pay them to do get done. Its not just some gigantic bank account that the members of our government can use as they please. But nowadays that's what it seems like. Hundreds of billions of our dollars are spent on things that wont even effect us.
No, we pay taxes for protection in the form of a military, the postal service, interstate road's (which was only allowed under the constitution under the argument of military transport in the case of war) , police stations, fire departments, schools etc. These are the common good programs our taxes are meant to support. We don't pay taxes so a certain portion of the population can get special benefits. How do special benefits for some fit into the common good?

And yes, the federal government squanders a lot of our tax dollars, most of which is pumped into social programs that don't accomplish a goddamn thing.

Saying that things like the unemployment program, medicare, and section 8 housing, are a waste of money is just plain fucked up. Millions of people rely on that money to survive and that's a fact. These people have done nothing wrong, they have tried to do everything they could and because of failures within our government there is a wall they cannot climb.
Actually many of them have done things wrong. They pop out children like they are going out of style, many don't have jobs, a portion are illegal immigrants who have never paid taxes other than sales tax. Have you ever thought that if we pulled the funding slowly they would find a way to survive? Yes, some are good people who have simply gotten a few bad breaks, but to assume they are all good and deserving people is ludicrous.

In the end it all comes down to empathy. The ability to feel any sort of connection to your fellow man. If you can eat lobster every night while your neighbor starves, then I don't know what to tell you. Its all apart of this idea that the government is not responsible for the well being of the American citizens. Think about what this country would be like if everyone simply had the "chance" to live a peaceful life. Apparently that's what America used to be like.
"Empathy" is the reason people donate to charities. I don't think anyone opposes charitable contributions, however it should be up to the individual who they give their money to. I don't want to support some crackhead with 10 children and I should not have to, nobody should be required to do so.

Everyone does have a "chance" to live a peaceful life. I think you misunderstand what "chance" means. It doesn't mean everyone is entitled to a peaceful and easy life.

You say that is what America used to be like, but I get the impression history isn't your strong point. Our country used to be made up of small and hard working farmers and merchants whoworked hard on a daily basis for their necessities and lived simple lives. These people did not think they were entitled to things they were not able to afford. Today, many of the poor have cell phones, cars (with massive stereo systems and rims) and/or nice clothing etc. Do you really believe the poor of American past had luxuries?

The owner of the convenience store across the street is a Vietnamese immigrant who had to live with 20 other people in a 2 bedroom apartment when he first came over. He now owns two stores and is doing well and providing for himself, his children went to college, etc. The difference between him and the people you are speaking of is that he realized he had to work in order to achieve the "American Dream." He didn't believe the "American Dream" should be given to him gift wrapped in $100 bills!
JaggedEdge Reviewed by JaggedEdge on . are we to be free? with all the talk of socialism in america and the growing governmental control over our relatively free marketplace, i feel the need to ask those of you on these boards a rather basic question. is the individual an important component of american political philosophy or is the will of the people of paramount concern? this country has always led the world in its pursuit of the rights of the individual, understanding that the price we pay for those rights is a tumultuous life at best. as Rating: 5