Quote Originally Posted by maladroit
how did this turn into a discussion about me?
You attempted to call a straw man on me, when in fact i have yet to put one forth.

The United States, for better or worse is a mixed economy. Certain aspects of life such as police, fire rescue, national defense, and roads/ highways are more efficiently provided via government programs. I have yet to argue to the contrary, as i am not an anarcho-capitalist. Yet i do not believe health care should be funded by means of federal taxation to the populace. I also do not believe schooling should be controlled and regulated via Washington.

Therefore i am a pro marketed capitalist.

There is a new trend emerging throughout Europe where socialism is becoming increasingly accepted. Universal health care paved the way for such a possibility.

If the current crisis was not as severe as it currently is, i would in no way be calling for a bailout. But it is a potentially devastating situation, and as i have said numerous times, instant change will bring forth chaos, which will usher even stronger government strangleholds across the board. This has to be avoided, and because government intervention IMHO caused this mess, i do expect them to fix it.

Political psychology of the populace changes as situations and crisis emerge. Prior to the '29 crash, government was only beginning to manipulate markets, and such occurrences faced backlash when they would show their head. Once a crisis such as that erupted on the scene, neo socialists (FDR) used government as a means of fear reduction. This in itself played a serious role, as citizens of this time period became heavily reliant on government. They had children (baby boomers), and to a point these ideals were passed on. As we speak, the baby boom generation is losing power daily; their idea's and actions have serious consequences which we are seeing today. Ron Paul and his ideals are very much so represented by todayâ??s youth; who will be tomorrow's leaders. Obama is the flip side of Dr. Paul, in that he is trying to offer equity by which Americans will be forced to give up personal freedoms to achieve such goals.

I believe Obama will win the election. I also believe his administration will spark a fire under the asses of the sons and daughters of liberty. Just as all aspects in life naturally attempt to balance out, a new leader will emerge to answer the call against neo socialists. Who this leader will be is still in question, but i do believe it is very close.

Under the right administration, the deficit can begin to fall. It will take a major decrease in spending, which will need to be accompanied by an increase in worker productivity as well as a production possibilities shift to the right.

if you're so eager to label socialism, why aren't you labelling the US government which just nationalized some of the largest financial corporations in the world? the us government isn't just funding AIG, fannie, and freddie: YOU own them so if anyone is a socialist here, it's YOU
This has more to do with monetary policy, then it does with control. I have yet to make any excuses for what has happened, nor will i. Instead, you have made a handful of assumptions that are fatally flawed. While i do believe there are many faults with my government, we still possess the greatest piece of legislation ever to be written: The US Constitution.

If i was a socialist, i would have opinions much like the ones you possess.

You have failed to respond to some of my points:

Question for you. Has our massive deficit crippled our ability to provide these social services you deem necessary? I believe it has not, as we were able to pump the entire GDP of Canada into our economy as a "primer" in the span of 1 year. That really says something of the power and magnitude of the United States.
You failed to answer that above

You miss my point completely, and then go on a rant. If the US were to cut out its massive military infrastructure built throughout the world, other nations might just have to take more of an initiative in providing for there own defense. My original statement was based on a production possibility frontier, and nothing else.
You failed to address this point
---------------------------------------------------------------------

Its time to step up or step down :jointsmile: