Some facts about Ron Paul you may not have known

[Markass]

While I'm a big Ron Paul supporter myself (don't agree with everything he advocates though), I'd only preferre his governance at the federal level, not the state/provincial level. I'm on disability right now, and Paul's answer to that is "the community will pull together and take care of you". Well, maybe that worked in the 1920's, but it's a rediculous notion today. Hell, I don't even know anybody in this town; I would be out on the streets with no hope for survival if the government didn't provide disability benefits. But that's also why I support Ron Paul, because he wants to cut the out-of-control spending at the federal level, and leave the states to how they want to take care of their people. I guess you could say I'm a libertarian with mild socialist inclinations (yes, Americans, I know "socialist" is a dirty word in your country. People love to bash the philosophy by pointing to the faullies of it when taken to extremes).



Also I don't agree with his stance on Iraq and Afghanistan. Yes, being over there has caused most of the aggression problems, but if we pull out of Afghanistan now, the Taliban and AlQaeda aren't going to suddenly forgive us and stop attacking. Whether or not America can be faulted to whatever degree, there's no excuse for slaughtering innocent civilians (9/11). If that isn't pretext for war, I don't know what is. Frankly I'm amazed Bush was so lenient as to give the Taliban the chance to step down from power before getting their asses handed to them.

Iraq, they never should have gotten themselves into. But America did make a mistake, they did blow apart Iraqi infrastructure, destabalize a country, and kill hundreds of thousands of people. They owe it to the Iraqi people now to fix their mistake and not leave a weakened, barely stablized nation, to the mercy criminals, gangs, terrorists, extremists, Iran, and those who would impose Sharia law. That would be like handing over your country to the fanatical Christian fundamentalists in America; except a few times worse.

You're also forgetting his stance that they attacked us because we've been on their soil for years and years past...Which I strongly agree with.

Before the war started they wanted to attack us, after the war started they wanted to attack us, while the war continues, they still want to attack us. Do you think that they're going to want to attack us more if we leave them alone?? I sure don't think they're going to attack another building with an airliner..What does that leave?? Let's see...they could have meetings here in America where we let them in..and discuss how to do it? Right, they're probably already doing that anyhow..

"Wars are poor chisels for carving out peaceful tomorrows."

[Gandalf_The_Grey]

You're also forgetting his stance that they attacked us because we've been on their soil for years and years past...Which I strongly agree with.

I didn't forget, I specifically mentioned this; and agree.

Before the war started they wanted to attack us, after the war started they wanted to attack us, while the war continues, they still want to attack us. Do you think that they're going to want to attack us more if we leave them alone?? I sure don't think they're going to attack another building with an airliner..What does that leave?? Let's see...they could have meetings here in America where we let them in..and discuss how to do it? Right, they're probably already doing that anyhow..

"Wars are poor chisels for carving out peaceful tomorrows."

No they won't want to attack us more, they'll want to attack us as much as they always do. While I shudder at the notion of employing a George Bush quote; I'd rather fight them over there than over here. Again, they directly attacked the US (and attempted some at Canada), and slaughtered over 3,000 civilians. How is that not pretext for war? The shit has been stirred, the mistakes made, now we have a very real threat to deal with. America should smarten up and stop creating new threats, but the current one isn't going to go away by letting the Taliban re-establish it's disgusting abuse of human rights they call a government.

Only in a far-lefty dreamworld will AlQaeda forgive and forget; and lets not forget that they offered the US a ceasefire about a year ago, which seems to indicate to me that they're not exactly on the path to victory.

[flyingimam]

i remember seeing a footage a few years back of taliban people on an official tour to the united states!!!!!!

im just sayin, that these are the people we aided earlier for our short term goals, but we forgot they are not piece of napkin to be flushed down once we are done with them!!! sure we were once allied with stallin, we had to be ,then we werent once common enemy was gone, but lettin stallin be part of the victory led to the cold war

here are a few links & quotes for your info:

"Foreign powers, including the United States, were at first supportive of the Taliban in hopes it would serve as a force to restore order in Afghanistan after years of division into corrupt, lawless warlord fiefdoms. The U.S. government, for example, made no comment when the Taliban captured Herat in 1995 and expelled thousands of girls from schools.[65] These hopes faded as it began to be engaged in warlord practices of rocketing unarmed civilians, targeting ethnic groups (primarily Hazaras) and restricting the rights of women.[66] In late 1997, American Secretary of State Madeleine Albright began to distance the U.S. from the Taliban and the next year the American-based Unocal oil company withdrew from a major deal with the Taliban regime concerning an oil pipeline."

Taliban - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

"The 1982 Lebanon War (Hebrew: מלחמת לבנון‎, Milhemet Levanon), (Arabic: الإجتياح‎, Al-Ijtiah, "the invasion"), called by Israel the Operation Peace of the Galilee (Hebrew: מבצע שלום הגליל, or מבצע של"ג Mivtsa Shlom HaGalil or Mivtsa Sheleg‎), and later colloquially also known in Israel as the First Lebanon War, began on 6 June 1982, when the Israel Defense Forces invaded southern Lebanon. The Government of Israel ordered the invasion as a response to the assassination attempt against Israel's ambassador to the United Kingdom, Shlomo Argov, by the Abu Nidal Organization.

After attacking the PLO, as well as Syrian and Muslim Lebanese forces, Israel occupied southern Lebanon. Surrounded and subjected West Beirut to heavy bombardment, the PLO and the Syrian forces negotiated passage from Lebanon with the aid of international peacekeepers."

1982 Lebanon War - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

According to the tapes, bin Laden claimed he was inspired to destroy the World Trade Center after watching the destruction of towers in Lebanon by Israel during the 1982 Lebanon War.

Osama bin Laden - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

our unconditional support for state of Israel is the old dragging issue here, which Ron Paul's non-intervention foreign policy would have perhaps prevented if it was implemented after WWII

if we would have in fact "helped" solving this old crisis in mideast instead of helping the Israeli side only all the time, and if this was solved decades ago, perhaps we wouldnt have to deal with any of this worldwide terrorism, inclduing Iran's current nuclear issue.

However, had we stayed out of Israel's creation and the following events, there would be no reason for them ragheads to hate us... they would have hated other countries supportive of israel, and we would be excluded

but we just couldnt stop the temptation to play our world power role... here are the consequences we are facing now

and dont tell me we have not been dreaming of such power at all
we brokered the treaty of Versailles, which our very own congress did not ratify ironically
we pushed for UN once again after WWII and created NATO later on. we made ourselves allies and basically said we will be up for wars if u touch these ppl... whats that to u? isnt it asking for problems? sure we did a lot of good for europeans in WWII, but we became their defense dog after wards against soviets and then we were the ones paying the price for a few wars with communists from south america to asia!


we meshed this whole thing together so we just couldnt drop out anymore... we were in, too deep!

sure, osama killed innocent people, i hate him for that... but it wasnt all that unprovoked that most people think... it just had a very complicated and long history going back to 1940s that most massmedia-informed individuals fail(ed) to understand. i bet any unbiased history teacher will tell u that we were not all that much of a victim-only entity in this game... we had our own part to play

at least, osama would have had far smaller support base among muslims and even the extremists, if we had not meddled with Arab and muslim affairs years ago...

looking at it from the position that what are US interests, I simply do not see any interests for the US to push for creation of Israel and the pursuing unconditional support... if we were looking after "our interests" we kinda should have sided with Arabs since they got the oil...

just do a lil research on why OPEC exists
and how much we have had OUR interests hurt or endangered by this organization... oil embargo of 1973 was one reason and potential power of opec for controlling supplies still remains a viable threat imo

just check this out and see our most important interest's historical trend that was caused partly by our own actions...
Image:Oil Prices 1861 2007.svg - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

unless ofcourse this is something like the type of awkward marijuana policy we have @ home... something that contradicts our real interests in a capitalist and free country: Money & Freedom. and i mean money of the people (taxes), not money being made from those policies. our freedom has been directly hit by our governments involvment of other countries affairs... now we have to give up our most essential freedoms given to us by the constitution for sake of security... an insecure situation caused partly by our own government's past & present (continuation of the past policies) actions


* im just a neutral observer and an analyst, trying to verify facts and analyze the causes and symptoms of current world affairs. sympathetic for the US since this is the land i have chosen to live in so far. I'm not siding nor with nor supporting any of the mentioned entities above except for Ron Paul* i just think when ron paul says we did something that we are getting this hatred for, he is right, we did do something that made those ppl pissed off. Now are their extremists (re)actions justified? "certainly no" is my personal opinion!

but this is where the two extremes meet each other, and i for one see it in a way that we kinda were involved in starting this... but we got the response many years later... some ppl have long term hatred memory and goals

[Markass]

I didn't forget, I specifically mentioned this; and agree.




No they won't want to attack us more, they'll want to attack us as much as they always do. While I shudder at the notion of employing a George Bush quote; I'd rather fight them over there than over here. Again, they directly attacked the US (and attempted some at Canada), and slaughtered over 3,000 civilians. How is that not pretext for war? The shit has been stirred, the mistakes made, now we have a very real threat to deal with. America should smarten up and stop creating new threats, but the current one isn't going to go away by letting the Taliban re-establish it's disgusting abuse of human rights they call a government.

Only in a far-lefty dreamworld will AlQaeda forgive and forget; and lets not forget that they offered the US a ceasefire about a year ago, which seems to indicate to me that they're not exactly on the path to victory.

My point being, how are they going to even fight us over here in means other than getting into our country...They're not going to invade us, they have no organized military, navy, or air force.. and if anything they're already having meetings planning how to attack us..because we're letting them into our country, and the more they get into our country the more of an excuse the government has to shit on our freedoms and spy on us.

[Smudgeyboy]

Some more facts:
Ron Paul, like most famous American politicians, is a Freemason.
Ron Paul is the Micheal Moore of American politics. Small section of the true story.

If you make your own competition you'll never have to come up against anyone who really means business.

Why did Michael Moore make it to the cinema? Cos he was making people feel the knew the truth. Same story as Jesse Jackson (another Freemason).

Why has Ron Paul made it so far? He knows he'll never be elected, he's there so you can follow him. God forbid any of us become leaders ourselves.

[Gandalf_The_Grey]

My point being, how are they going to even fight us over here in means other than getting into our country...They're not going to invade us, they have no organized military, navy, or air force.. and if anything they're already having meetings planning how to attack us..because we're letting them into our country, and the more they get into our country the more of an excuse the government has to shit on our freedoms and spy on us.

If the Taliban is allowed to re-establish itself (with all the human atrocities guaranteed therein), AlQaeda then (once again) has a whole government and a nation's resources to back them.

When I say "fight over here", I mean as in more terrorists launching attacks as terrorists do. You can bet having the resources and finance of a national government helps a great deal in that.

[flyingimam]

Some more facts:
Ron Paul, like most famous American politicians, is a Freemason.
Ron Paul is the Micheal Moore of American politics. Small section of the true story.

If you make your own competition you'll never have to come up against anyone who really means business.

Why did Michael Moore make it to the cinema? Cos he was making people feel the knew the truth. Same story as Jesse Jackson (another Freemason).

Why has Ron Paul made it so far? He knows he'll never be elected, he's there so you can follow him. God forbid any of us become leaders ourselves.

this is flat out pessimistic! i know where u r coming from, but if im to think like this about the world, i rather let myself go with 1 single shot... so even if it is truly this way i rather have distorted perception and live n enjoy the weed.