Problem mechanical timers (not shutting off) & lighting on seedlings Q?

[PlainJane]

I've now had two timers "go bad" on me. This is a problem because obviously I can't be constantly worrying if my shit is working.

I got a mechanical electric timer (you know, the push the little knobby bits up or down on a dial kind) and it worked for a day but then decided it didn't want to go off when it was in the off section. Nothing would override that. Now I have a second one (different brand) which is doing the same thing, except if you push the override button it does shut off. WTF? Anyone else have this? Am I really just that unlucky to get two different duds? I thought maybe it just didn't like somewhat short increments of being turned off and on but that's dumb, that's its job!

What an annoying and stupid problem to have.

So, I just got a digital timer one in hopes there is something inherently wrong with mechanical ones or me or 3rd time's the charm or something. Bloody hell!


See, I was using it to keep my seedlings warm in this british "summer" by having my HPS turn on every couple hours for a half hour. (they were well protected under a dark coloured water catchment tray and a towel around the edges to keep light leaks out) It worked brilliantly for keeping it warm in there (have a thermometer/humidity probe in there) but then yet again the POS timer failed and the light was on for over an hour and it got to 33.4ºc (92ºf). I hope they're OK. They're just babies, in that white/yellow sprout cotyledon stage (thread with a photo but I need to update that since I've got 3 sprouted now) just waiting for them to be ready for light. I'm sort of confused on when they should be put under light. (?) Now, or do I wait for tiny little green leaves? I keep thinking that if this was in nature and not an indoor grow that they'd already be exposed to light so maybe they should, but I've read otherwise too. Anyone have any insight to give to the newbie?

Thanks, if you made it this far. :hippy:

PlainJane Reviewed by PlainJane on 09-10-2008. Problem mechanical timers (not shutting off) & lighting on seedlings Q? I've now had two timers "go bad" on me. This is a problem because obviously I can't be constantly worrying if my shit is working. :mad: I got a mechanical electric timer (you know, the push the little knobby bits up or down on a dial kind) and it worked for a day but then decided it didn't want to go off when it was in the off section. Nothing would override that. Now I have a second one (different brand) which is doing the same thing, except if you push the override button it does shut Rating: 5

[Chronic Chrissy]

It sounds like the first true set of leaves hasn't even come in yet. Keep them under the flouros. I usually wait till they have about 4 sets of leaves and a nice little root system, sometimes 2-3 weeks. I've always had more problems than good things come from rushing mother nature. In the mean time you might want to get a cheap heating pad instead so you can set the dail and keep it constant since you are throwing your money away on hydro costs using your hps, in the long run the heating pad would save you money. As for the temp spike just ride it out and make sure it doesn't happen again, that's all you can do.

[PlainJane]

It sounds like the first true set of leaves hasn't even come in yet. Keep them under the flouros. I usually wait till they have about 4 sets of leaves and a nice little root system, sometimes 2-3 weeks. I've always had more problems than good things come from rushing mother nature. In the mean time you might want to get a cheap heating pad instead so you can set the dail and keep it constant since you are throwing your money away on hydro costs using your hps, in the long run the heating pad would save you money. As for the temp spike just ride it out and make sure it doesn't happen again, that's all you can do.

I only have an HPS. I know it's not the ideal and that I should have more of the blueish spectrum via Metal Halide or CFLs but I had to budget a bit and am under the impression this is acceptable enough.

Maybe should I put them by the window? Sort of ease them into the light? I have a discreet place to do that.
Is it the norm to put them under the light at this stage? I couldn't quite work out if I should wait for leaves to appear or if they appear once they are under light.

It's not costing me much in power ("hydro", I had to think what you meant and then I saw you were from Canada and realised) to have the HPS turn on for a short time. My costs will run about 20p per day when I'm on 18/6 and I don't think I'll find a heating pad for that little. It's just an additional cost and I'd like to avoid that when possible.

Thanks for your response.

[Weedhound]

Dont keep changing your lighting patterns around.....nature doesn't turn the lights on and off so you shouldn't either.

you CAN leave the light on 24/0 for seedlings if you're not worried about the cost of electrical but constrantly going back and forth is bad for your plants. Give them a night and a daytime......one each in a 24 hour period.

[Chronic Chrissy]

So you have only the hsp turning on every few hours for half an hour, and no flouros? this is your only light source? Just to let you know my power in Can is a whole lot cheaper than the US. Also the power up phase of a light is when it draws the most power and puts a load on the ballast and bulb. That means alot of wear and tear on your system.

If you can keep the temp right I would just put them in the window for now, that's what I do. If you don't I would get a cheap socket and put an incandesent bulb for heat, and a cfl for light. Save you HSP because you're wasting it right now and the plants are barely using the light it's providing.

:hippy:

[Weedhound]

I completely agree with Chrissy....you need to use the right tool for the right job. You may think you have good reasons for your methods.....but I seriously doubt your plants will see it the same and you are already lining up for some problems.

Good luck.....hope you work it out.

[PlainJane]

The timer thing is a sort of a separate problem, by the way. I just seem to get duds and wondered if I was alone there. That's an annoying problem but not my biggest question.

Dont keep changing your lighting patterns around.....nature doesn't turn the lights on and off so you shouldn't either.

you CAN leave the light on 24/0 for seedlings if you're not worried about the cost of electrical but constrantly going back and forth is bad for your plants. Give them a night and a daytime......one each in a 24 hour period.

I am only using the HPS for its HEAT, the seedlings are in total darkness underneath a dark coloured catchment tray. I suppose I might not have made that very clear with my questions.
I am just unsure when I am supposed to expose them to light.

So you have only the hsp turning on every few hours for half an hour, and no flouros? this is your only light source? Just to let you know my power in Can is a whole lot cheaper than the US. Also the power up phase of a light is when it draws the most power and puts a load on the ballast and bulb. That means alot of wear and tear on your system.

If you can keep the temp right I would just put them in the window for now, that's what I do. If you don't I would get a cheap socket and put an incandesent bulb for heat, and a cfl for light. Save you HSP because you're wasting it right now and the plants are barely using the light it's providing.

:hippy:

I'm in the UK, as with everything here our power is horribly overpriced, but even still to run my HPS is only 20p per day, so I chose that as my heating option instead of a heating pad. (that's a good idea about just using an incandescent for heat though, can't believe I didn't think of it) They are in the dark 100% of the time right now, the HPS is only being used for its heat to maintain a temp for the seedings, which are under a dark tray seeing NONE of that light.

Yes, the HPS is my only light source for the plants. It would have cost me considerably more to buy a ballast which could switch to Metal Halide and then the additional cost of the MH bulb. I thought of fluorescents on a separate thing but ended up deciding the HPS was enough, perhaps this was a mistake but I am trying to keep costs down where I can. This is just where I am at currently.

I'll take a photo of them and post it. I am just trying to work out if they should be in any light at this stage. The wording I keep finding about it is unclear.
Will leaves form in total darkness or do I need to expose them to light in order to get green leaves and begin photosynthesis?

Sorry for the dumb question, it sucks being a n00b.

[Weedhound]

I stick mine under lighting when they crack and you can see that the seed is going to hatch. You can leave light on them even when you first germinate.....just don't get it too close or the heat of the hps will fry your new opening leaves. A couple of feet (like 3) is good.....closer and its too much for young seedlings whiich I have discovered firsthand.

[Weedhound]

Ps.....I DO use flouros.....but start my hydro babies right off under mh 250w.......they do fine......just watch the heat issue.

edit: I HAVE discovered that using HID lighting vs flouros for seedlings may slow your geminating down a bit.......that's a lot of light for a youngster.....but be patient and don't get the light too close.

[PlainJane]

Oh good, thank you! I can give them about 3 feet of space between the HPS (250w) no problem.

here is that photo:

[attachment=o200404] <- click me!

So you think they are OK for light at this stage? Like a simulated day-night cycle? Seemed logical since if they were outdoors they would be getting light but I keep second-guessing everything since this is all new to me and I don't want to screw it up.

If they're better off being eased into it by a window or something I can do that too.