America The Great

[flyingimam]

Its a very great freedom indeed... the choice of conform with it or to fight against it and be imprisioned, or even killed... cause we know the system doesnt like the ones who are against it and makes everything to destroy them...
As nobody wants to be imprisioned or killed, the so-called "choice" is not a true choice, but only a fallacy... and so the freedom is only illusory.

conformism is not the way to go, it wont get u what u want at the end.
however rebellion without a plan and without organization is not any better.

what i was trying to point out was that we as a group of people who are opposing some of government's policies that directly affect us, need to learn the system rather than conforming to it and do our rebellion through available legal channels, and especially the most effective ones

voting wont work, unless voters are organized, that organization needs lots of knowledge and money... many ballots have failed just for this matter. and as for letters, well they are not "the most effective ways" u just get a response and if the governor or official disagrees with u, be sure your message goes down into the trash can or shredder.... dont even doubt it, unless they are opne minded and there are OTHER organized activities other than mass mailings as well. we as citizens will never be able to know the number of related mails an official receives from fellow citizens, public and clear pressure is what works, something that can be measured and told to the general public, like polls like ballots, signatures etc... letters are the lowest level of participation the minimum u can do, and it sure will take more than minimum to get some unwilling politician to agree with u or be forced to do so

[MIDNIGHTspecial]

We dont have to flaunt our marijuana usage.

yeah, I definitely agree, and am also kinda off-put by the people who smoke weed just to seem cool. They give the rest of us a bad name

[Coelho]

(no matter how half-assed it may be to u, its still better than living in a 3rd world country isnt it?)

For your information, not all "3rd world" countries are the shit you "1st world" inhabitants thinks they are. If it were so, there wouldnt be so many foreign people (from the wonderful 1st world) living (and loving) here... learn first, talk after.

what i was trying to point out was that we as a group of people who are opposing some of government's policies that directly affect us, need to learn the system rather than conforming to it and do our rebellion through available legal channels, and especially the most effective ones

It wouldnt work... the system wouldnt provide any legal means that enabled people to fight against it in any effective way... so any legal means provided by the system are only a way to distract people, to make them think they will arrive at something, but in fact they will keep being under the systems control.

[veggii]

for the most part I aggree with you, while I would rather marijuana was legal, it is much easier to just follow the law and do what your suposed to.
I dont understand kids that smoke pot and immediatly because its against the law, they hate cops and hate the government and all these other things. Ive been smoking for close to 4 years now and admit I have had my run ins with the law, but when you have a family member die of OD, youll appreciate the police that arrest these god damned pill dealers.

I dont have a big problem with any drug really. I understand most of them, but herroin and pills are retarted. I sy smok em da herb and find peace within. :rastasmoke:

How can you blame the pill dealers did they come into your house and hold your moms throte open and force her to swallow those pills. I doubt it.
you just want your escape goat so you can have someone to blame.
what about that scientist who created the pills?
or the pharma company that paid for it
or your state senator that approved the Trails to make the drug
US government for letting them on the US market
the FDA for approval
the list goes on and on
you could be on the list cause you did nothing to stop her
srry don't mean to so harsh but com'on

"IGNORANCE IS BLISS"

[flyingimam]

For your information, not all "3rd world" countries are the shit you "1st world" inhabitants thinks they are. If it were so, there wouldnt be so many foreign people (from the wonderful 1st world) living (and loving) here... learn first, talk after.

true, i didnt meant to offend 3rd world countries, just used the term as it carries some connotation for general 1st world or even same 3rd world public.

I'm in fact a green card holder in America coming from a 3rd world country.
what i meant by a 3rd world country shouldnt be viewed as all 3rd world countries are bad or anything close to that. only that some offer less quality of life in means of material and freedom. perhaps i should have used the word "some" before 3rd world countries, i really didnt mean all are in that way. plus some countries are considered developing nations which i personally do not count as 3rd world. If I offended you, I apologize, I didn't mean to.

It wouldnt work... the system wouldnt provide any legal means that enabled people to fight against it in any effective way... so any legal means provided by the system are only a way to distract people, to make them think they will arrive at something, but in fact they will keep being under the systems control.

perhaps i didnt make myself clear enough, what i said by utilizing the system is the same way those against the people have used it. here in America, interest groups play a key role and will continue to do so on influencing the government. marijuana for example has a lobby a rather weak and poor one, called NORML, compare that to NRA, AIPAC and energy lobbies play very large roles in keeping their interests on lock. Votes and letters to representatives of people DO play a role, not nearly as powerful as lobbies. now on feasibility of having such a lobby for a cause like MMJ or marijuana itself, it will take people to be educated on the matter of how politics works and on the matter of which lobby or group actually represents their opinions. If people want to change things in a quick and effective manner, it takes money and dedication to lobby the legislative branches of government to change laws, but 1st people must know what NORML or any other group exactly stands for, then contribute to it if they believe in it or if such cause helps them.

most importantly, it takes wealthier people to help this process, because general contributions are not gonna be able to compete with those of industrial lobbies. they are using their profits to keep the laws that benefit them the same.

and i dont know by rebellion what u mean, but any other but using legal ways available in the system is kind of a revolt and revolution, at best a civil disobedience which requires even more unity and spirit of sacrifice among the people, something which i simply dont find especially among many stoners here. people rather live it the way it is and dodge the fed's fishing net, they will be happy with their own fate being "survivin it" and will at best sympathize with those who do get caught.

I strongly believe the way American government is setup the best way and most effective way to influence the government is to have a strong lobbying organization for the cause

check this
cannabisnews.com: NORML Heads Work To Ignite The Troops
"He said that .1 percent of marijuana smokers get involved with decriminalization efforts and challenged the crowd to imagine what would happen if a whole percent of marijuana smokers got involved."

I just hope u r not suggesting the only way to fix this is to take out to streets and riot? if legal channels wont work, then what is the alternative u r suggesting--i assume u have enough knowledge of American system since post is about america...

[Coelho]

true, i didnt meant to offend 3rd world countries, just used the term as it carries some connotation for general 1st world or even same 3rd world public.

I'm in fact a green card holder in America coming from a 3rd world country.
what i meant by a 3rd world country shouldnt be viewed as all 3rd world countries are bad or anything close to that. only that some offer less quality of life in means of material and freedom. perhaps i should have used the word "some" before 3rd world countries, i really didnt mean all are in that way. plus some countries are considered developing nations which i personally do not count as 3rd world. If I offended you, I apologize, I didn't mean to.

Well... if youre from a "3rd world" country, then you have all the right to talk about them whatever way you please... even criticise them... cause you will be talking about what you actually know, and not about what you only heard about (as many "1st world" inhabitants do).

perhaps i didnt make myself clear enough, what i said by utilizing the system is the same way those against the people have used it. here in America, interest groups play a key role and will continue to do so on influencing the government. marijuana for example has a lobby a rather weak and poor one, called NORML, compare that to NRA, AIPAC and energy lobbies play very large roles in keeping their interests on lock. Votes and letters to representatives of people DO play a role, not nearly as powerful as lobbies. now on feasibility of having such a lobby for a cause like MMJ or marijuana itself, it will take people to be educated on the matter of how politics works and on the matter of which lobby or group actually represents their opinions. If people want to change things in a quick and effective manner, it takes money and dedication to lobby the legislative branches of government to change laws, but 1st people must know what NORML or any other group exactly stands for, then contribute to it if they believe in it or if such cause helps them.

most importantly, it takes wealthier people to help this process, because general contributions are not gonna be able to compete with those of industrial lobbies. they are using their profits to keep the laws that benefit them the same.

and i dont know by rebellion what u mean, but any other but using legal ways available in the system is kind of a revolt and revolution, at best a civil disobedience which requires even more unity and spirit of sacrifice among the people, something which i simply dont find especially among many stoners here. people rather live it the way it is and dodge the fed's fishing net, they will be happy with their own fate being "survivin it" and will at best sympathize with those who do get caught.

I strongly believe the way American government is setup the best way and most effective way to influence the government is to have a strong lobbying organization for the cause

check this
cannabisnews.com: NORML Heads Work To Ignite The Troops
"He said that .1 percent of marijuana smokers get involved with decriminalization efforts and challenged the crowd to imagine what would happen if a whole percent of marijuana smokers got involved."

I just hope u r not suggesting the only way to fix this is to take out to streets and riot? if legal channels wont work, then what is the alternative u r suggesting--i assume u have enough knowledge of American system since post is about america...

Well... i understand what you mean. But i think the system only will change if there were any way for it profit with the change. If some day cannabis become legalized, it wont be for the happiness of the stoners or the health of the medical users, but for the profit of anyone who profit with it. Probably its why cannabis itself (the herb) wont even be legalized, cause people would be able to grow it by themselves and so wouldnt give any profit for the system. Im pretty sure the most that can happen is some artificial or manufactured form of it (like marinol for example) be legalized, cause then the pharmaceutical industries would profit with it.

I do support a complete revolution against the system. But as i know its impossible, i do only what i can, that is to refuse to help it in any way i can. I used to plan to be a scientist (im a physicist), but since i made my mind about the system i decided i wont be a scientist anymore, or at least i wont publish any findings i do, cause they would help the system. I do not watch tv, read papers, whatever, so i dont comply with the media. I only buy the things i really need to survive, and so my contribution for the system is the smallest possible. I do not work. And i plan to leave the society as soon as possible, and live from the land, isolated from the society. I cant destroy the system, but i can refuse to help it, and thats what i do.

Cause, as i said, sooner or later the system will turn to a Brave New World, and i think its worse than anything that would happen.

[Reefer Rogue]

yeah, I definitely agree, and am also kinda off-put by the people who smoke weed just to seem cool. They give the rest of us a bad name

No one gives us bad names but ourselves, or perhaps our parents.

[NextLineIsMine]

SFGuerilla that was wonderful to hear. Im entirely the opposite of your patriotic red state flag waving kind of man, but I am so tired of hear college freshman and looking-for-an-identity anarchists telling me im one of the sheeple and I think im free. Nobody holds free reign over my life thats not in check or has the risk of being checked, no monarchs or clerics dictate the terms but which I should live, we are incredibly free in comparison to almost all societys of the past.

Im just tired of wannabe rebels looking for a man to fight, creating imaginary authorites like the illuminati and masons

[SFGurrilla]

I mean. You can conform and still be completely reblious. It some what allows you to get away with more.

Its like the statement, "Survival Of The Fittest"

Absorb whats around you and live it like the rest do but you dont really have the be the rest.

Its complicated.

When I was growing up it was another story.

Things change when you grow up I guess.

No reason to be emo about what has been created.




Nice posts.

[Hollywierdtoker]

SFGuerilla that was wonderful to hear. Im entirely the opposite of your patriotic red state flag waving kind of man, but I am so tired of hear college freshman and looking-for-an-identity anarchists telling me im one of the sheeple and I think im free. Nobody holds free reign over my life thats not in check or has the risk of being checked, no monarchs or clerics dictate the terms but which I should live, we are incredibly free in comparison to almost all societys of the past.

Im just tired of wannabe rebels looking for a man to fight, creating imaginary authorites like the illuminati and masons

We keep strong our animalistic roots and oppressive powers. People want freedom, and will continue to fight for it. You can base your freedom on other people, or you can base it on what it is. Your choice, but i'll choose the latter...haha...Too many laws are just crazy and make no sense. I don't need a government to babysit me forcibly just because I don't agree with them.