Question about how to make a good mother

[Puffzter]

Yes genetics CAN degrade over time but nothing sais it will at a particular time. Its all in probability.
I have a genetic chart for every clone and plant that make it possible to follow it back to its original seed and I will never take clones to use for production that is more than 2 generations away from the original seed.

As it is now I took clones from all my seed bred plants. I put them in 12/12. 5th week of bloom I selected which one had the best traits and threw out the non corresponding clones and made mothers of the clones from that plant.
I have to be VERY unlucky to have a genetic degrade in fewer than 4-10 generations from seed purelly mathematically so if I stay at first to 2nd generation I will by all probability be in the safe from that problem. And, since a good kept mother can be kept for 5-10 years I'd say its unlikelly I will have to worry about my WW genetics for quite some time if I don't loose all my plants at the same time. Worst case I have to go to third generation cloning for some years before I do a new search for a superfemale from a seed grow.
Next step for me atm is to do a sative seed grow during the winter at some point and from there try to find a good mother as well so I have White Widow, Hindu Kush (already making a mother of that) and then a 3rd strain from a sativa I have not decided on yet. Strawberry Cough or Arjans Super Silver Haze #3 (very nice smoke and the lowest sativa in the world) as I think now. Time will tell.

Puffzter

[Chronic Chrissy]

Yes genetics CAN degrade over time but nothing sais it will at a particular time. Its all in probability.
I have a genetic chart for every clone and plant that make it possible to follow it back to its original seed and I will never take clones to use for production that is more than 2 generations away from the original seed.

As it is now I took clones from all my seed bred plants. I put them in 12/12. 5th week of bloom I selected which one had the best traits and threw out the non corresponding clones and made mothers of the clones from that plant.
I have to be VERY unlucky to have a genetic degrade in fewer than 4-10 generations from seed purelly mathematically so if I stay at first to 2nd generation I will by all probability be in the safe from that problem. And, since a good kept mother can be kept for 5-10 years I'd say its unlikelly I will have to worry about my WW genetics for quite some time if I don't loose all my plants at the same time. Worst case I have to go to third generation cloning for some years before I do a new search for a superfemale from a seed grow.
Next step for me atm is to do a sative seed grow during the winter at some point and from there try to find a good mother as well so I have White Widow, Hindu Kush (already making a mother of that) and then a 3rd strain from a sativa I have not decided on yet. Strawberry Cough or Arjans Super Silver Haze #3 (very nice smoke and the lowest sativa in the world) as I think now. Time will tell.

Puffzter

So long as you preserve and maitain the mother then the clone, then clone of clone, the clone of clone of clone, the DNA shouldn't degrade it is completely possible to clone only from your last crop and continue that way through the cycle for years and not need a mother. I know a few old timers who have been cloning this way for 5+ and 8+ years and they have the most potent stable strains around here. Their clones will cost you easily $200 each though.

[Puffzter]

Yes but the risk of degradation is bigger.
However it IS very small just as you say. The good thing is you don't have to keep a mother but the bad thing is that you need to keep clones for a long time while the last crop go through bloom to harvest so I think a mother is safer both from a genetic standpoint and for workload reasons.
Also you get a very uniform grow when all plants have exactly the same genetics.
Anyway, lets get back on topic (after a very interesting discussion I might add).

Any input is welcome on:
The best way of keeping a motherplant and to take clones from it to keep it a stable source of clones over time.

[Puffzter]

One thing I have been thinking about is what way it is actually best to take the clones from a motherplant.
I mean if I keep taking tops I will get two new tops from the node under that cut. If I take them lower I will loose one spot from which new ones can grow, right?
Either way will eventually cause problems.
I see these motherplant people keep for years and years without making them bigger and bigger.
What is it I havent grasped in the harvesting of clones while keeping a mother about same over all size over time?

To keep taking 20-30 clones from a plant a month for years while still keeping it growing all over and not have to move further and further up and out is what I would want.
Like this:
http://www.cannabase.com/cl/pages/clones/cl-pics/1.jpg

How?
I am making 2 Bonzai mothers atm and just want some onput on how to harvest it and keep it a small bonzai like that.

Puffzter

[justsoso]

Hey Puff, how are your mums doing? If you've found some answers to some of your questions in this post, would you mind giving an update? Is the Bonsai method working for you?

[Puffzter]

My mother plants are doing just fine. Still the size of a bonzai and I have encountered no problems with them.
Sometimes I have forgot to water them 2-3 days but they bounce right back in 6-8 hours again.

I would say bonzai is the way to go for a small to medium op since you easy can keep 2-3 moms on a square foot under a 125W LE and take around 20-25 clones a month from them.

Puffzter

[fffuuudesu]

:hippy:

i got me an o.g. blueberry seed from at least 5 years ago.. not sure which pheno it came off of but im gonna find out. any way.. i need a mother.

i found this article a while ago and have been wanting to try it. everything seems simple enough and i have enough experience to do it properly.

however there is one question i have. when the article talks about root pruning it says to bury it deeper and deeper everytime.

I have a banyan bonsai and i noticed that where the arial roots come out of is like tiny little dots on the branches... my 2 week old BB has the same "nodes" partially up the stem, up to where the first leave formed.

since it shot up like crazy after the first feeding i have approx. 4"/8cm of bare trunk.

My question is this. Based on my experience with ficus, and the ability of cannabis to pretty much go through hell and still come out amazing, im assuming that when i drop this thing into a bigger pot that i can fill the soil up to the first nodal segment. is this true? or do i have to do it slowely over time? basically im lookin to keep it as short as possible.. and having 4 inches of trunk aint exactly conservative if i go pop that whole thing into a bigger pot as is.

ps 4th grow. fire everytime... now im lookin for efficiency and longevity=)

if its female, off the first clones ima cross with lowrider just for some unstable seed stock

if its male i got some more pollen =D

7Wx5Dx5H dedicated flower +1000watt hps.

4Wx2Dx4.5H dedicated veg + 3x105watt cfls 6000k, 4500-5000k and 2400k full spectrum

ill start a thread soon, but i gotta know if i can bury this thing up to its ass no worries :giggity:

[oldmac]

Hello and welcome fffuuudesu,

Probably would get more responces if you started a fresh thread for your question, but it did give backround to your question so who cares?

Yea you can bury the plant up to it's ears. The stalk will simply send roots out from it and become a root rather then a stalk.
Besides helping you get rid of 4" of useless stem, the plant will be happier too.

Don't sweat it. :thumbsup:

[fffuuudesu]

:thumbsup::hippy: