McCain's Mansions

[khronik]

You are right higher taxes would be better. Those gas taxes should be higher since we are not using as much quanity, and getting the revenue from those gas sales. Right?

Dude Desiel at 489 a gallon almost sunk us. Remeber you have to pay it out FIRST before you can get it as a write OFF.

Big oil gets 8 cents per gallon
goverment what 14-50 cents per gallon for what ????

nothing... if big oil made record profits what did the goverment make?

Gas prices are high due to market forces, not taxes. Even you must know that. And tax on gas and diesel generally goes towards the upkeep and construction of roads and bridges. Since you're buying a lot of gas/diesel, I'm pretty sure you're using these roads. If you're not, you can get the taxes back at the end of the year. My dad does this.

[McDanger]

Special rights are granted to huge corporations, government sanctioned profit.

This is total bullshit. Corporations do not have ANY rights, let alone SPECIAL RIGHTS. They do take advantage of the laws the way they are written, but anybody can do this ...INCLUDING YOU. JUST BECAUSE YOU DO NOT IS NOT THE FAULT OF THE CORPORATION

"Gas prices are high due to market forces, not taxes. Even you must know that. And tax on gas and diesel generally goes towards the upkeep and construction of roads and bridges. Since you're buying a lot of gas/diesel, I'm pretty sure you're using these roads. If you're not, you can get the taxes back at the end of the year. My dad does this."
Never heard of this one, but if you could provide some specifics, I would be willing to listen. He may be able to deduct fuel costs from income, but I seriously doubt he gets a refund of gas taxes.

"If you own a business, you can write off just about everything as far as expenses, so I find that hard to believe. "
Taxes are on profit after expenses are deducted, so higher taxes come right out of your back pocket. Expenses are money spent to run the business.(other that depreciation).

I cannot believe people can go through 4 years of college and not be taught the most basic of economic facts.

[khronik]

This is total bullshit. Corporations do not have ANY rights, let alone SPECIAL RIGHTS. They do take advantage of the laws the way they are written, but anybody can do this ...INCLUDING YOU. JUST BECAUSE YOU DO NOT IS NOT THE FAULT OF THE CORPORATION

Corporations do have some rights and some special rights, but they also have special liabilities too. Saying corporations have NO rights is even more wrong.

"Gas prices are high due to market forces, not taxes. Even you must know that. And tax on gas and diesel generally goes towards the upkeep and construction of roads and bridges. Since you're buying a lot of gas/diesel, I'm pretty sure you're using these roads. If you're not, you can get the taxes back at the end of the year. My dad does this."
Never heard of this one, but if you could provide some specifics, I would be willing to listen. He may be able to deduct fuel costs from income, but I seriously doubt he gets a refund of gas taxes.

My dad is a dairy farmer and uses gas for his tractor. Because he's not using the roads when he uses this gas, he gets all the taxes he pays on gas as a refund at the end of the year.

"If you own a business, you can write off just about everything as far as expenses, so I find that hard to believe. "
Taxes are on profit after expenses are deducted, so higher taxes come right out of your back pocket. Expenses are money spent to run the business.(other that depreciation).

I cannot believe people can go through 4 years of college and not be taught the most basic of economic facts.

He was saying that higher income taxes would make them go out of business. This can't be true, because income tax is based on profit. So therefore, they only pay income taxes if they are profitable.

[McDanger]

Corporations do have some rights and some special rights, but they also have special liabilities too. Saying corporations have NO rights is even more wrong.
Name a "right" that a business has.


My dad is a dairy farmer and uses gas for his tractor. Because he's not using the roads when he uses this gas, he gets all the taxes he pays on gas as a refund at the end of the year.
From who... fed or state?


He was saying that higher income taxes would make them go out of business. This can't be true, because income tax is based on profit. So therefore, they only pay income taxes if they are profitable.

This may technically true, but it sure is not worth the time and risk involved. There still may be some profit left after the gov't steals what they want, but working 60+hrs/wk for next to nuthin aint worth it.

[khronik]

This may technically true, but it sure is not worth the time and risk involved. There still may be some profit left after the gov't steals what they want, but working 60+hrs/wk for next to nuthin aint worth it.

If you make very little money, then your income tax is really, really low, if anything. The tax rate only starts to get high when your profits are also high.

[khronik]

Name a "right" that a business has.

Um... the right to incorporate, the right to sell stock, the right to property, the right to own patents, the right to confidentiality, the right to hire and fire employees, etc. Granted, some of these rights may be encroached upon by governments in certain situations, but for the most part they hold true.

From who... fed or state?

State for sure, and federal taxes i think. State sales tax he still has to pay, but that's true for everything else too. I'm not 100% sure about federal taxes though, I'll have to ask him at some point.

By the way, can you try and figure out how to use the QUOTE tags? It makes it easier to respond to your posts and figure out when you're actually responding to stuff I said.

[killerweed420]

Originally Posted by killerweed420
Whats wrong with doing something because thats what you love to do?
Nothing they are called hobbies

Money shouldn't be the motivating factor in this country but it is.

Yes it should be.... Its called a Profit Motive (look it up, and get back to me)

when you are living off the goverment tit, you wont EVER get out of bed.

when you think you might make some money... you get your ass up! thats why.


Its not socialism its just making companies pay there fair share for ripping off employees and customers.

My Dad and I own Our Own Business, and work our asses off. More Taxes would sink us. Im sure thats ok with you, cause we are and evil corp.



People have the right to make as much money as they want in the US.

Yes...maybe there is hope.


But there is also a social obligation to not ripoff everybody to make the big bucks.

its called "what the market will bear" along with Supply and Demand curves that will establish price. (P)

Look up Business ethics.
You see, the ripoff artist will go out of business.

Profit Motive. Isn't that just a fancy phrase for greed? There is nothing wrong with making money. In our society its a requirement to live. I'm just saying there is a difference between profit making and cheating people to get ahead. $4 a gallon for gas? Anyone being cheated there? If we didn't have a futures market which is just legal gambling gas would be $2 a gallon.

[seattlesmoke247]

oh noes !!!he has a bunch of houses what an evil bastard... i dont follow politics because it is rediculous shit like this.

[thcbongman]

You have to accept this about the free market. Greed is what drives it. Those people making big bucks are addicted to making money. It creates more jobs and they run the economy. I agree that the best business practices is to profit within a realm of social responsibility. The futures market is basically buying rights to future oil sites, it's a limited market to begin with, demand was bound to go up since we are dealing with a resource that depletes. If someone else wants to buy it, why shouldn't they? People have to adapt to the economic reality and get away from oil. $4 and increasing gas will do that. Let market forces play out. That's the only way we'll have change.

[dragonrider]

The futures market is basically buying rights to future oil sites, it's a limited market to begin with, demand was bound to go up since we are dealing with a resource that depletes.

The futures market is not buying the rights to future oil sites.

The futures market is a market of contracts to buy and sell a commoditiy at a set price on a future date. In the case of oil, it is a contract that says one party agrees to buy a barral of oil at a set price on a future date and another party agrees to sell the barrel of oil at that set price on that set date. There are also futures markets for all kinds of other commodities like corn and "pork bellies" (Whatever the hell that is! No futures market for snouts, just bellies). Futures markets are very important and useful tools for producers and users of commodities because futures contracts help to remove uncertainlty from their businesses.

For example a farmer might not know exactly how much he is going to be able to sell corn for at harvest time --- maybe there will be a crop failure and prices will be high becasue of low supply, or maybe there will be a bumper crop and prices will be low. A futures contract allows him to lock in the price. He won't be ruinied if the price drops, but he won't make a windfall if the price is high either. Same deal for a buyer of corn -- they can lock in a price and remove uncertainty.

There are also people who get into the market who are not producers or users of the commodity. They never actually want to own or handle the commodity --- only the contracts. They are speculators who get into the market to make money buying and selling contracts. Theoretically they help in the process of "price discovery."

It seems like the only way to make money as a speculator in a futures market is to actually be really good at guessing what the actual real market price of an item is going to be and how the price is going to move over time. Seems like the real supply and the real demand will set the real market price. But apparently there is something I don't understand, because you hear all this talk about how the price we are paying for gas is not the "real" price --- it's been market up by "speculators." I don't get that. I'm not actually sure how futures market speculation affects the ACTUAL price --- sems like supply and demade would always drive that, regardless of futures specualtion, and if speculators were trading overpriced contracts, the THEY would be the ones losing money. No one has been able to explain this to me.