G is for gun: Texas in a class of its own

[psychocat]

Well actually they are also illegal to manufacture for the general public. And NONE, I repeat NONE of the school shootings in this country were done with an automatic weapon!!!
The gun that kills the most is a .22.

"Yeah because we all know a criminal is going to get his weapon from a legit source."
You were the one that said "I am only guessing but I would be willing to bet that most of the weapons used in school shootings are owned by the culprit and also fully legal.". Do you believe your own words or not?

I did not suggest for one second that the scenario I gave earlier was real , I simply stated that in a situation where the crims can access automatic weapons then you with your legal weapons will be outgunned.
I made no reference to any school shooting regarding automatic weapons other than that fantasy scenario .
I hate when people try to twist my words and you will find I am very astute.
I never stated that any school shooting involved automatic weapons , I DID state that I would bet that most school shootings were carried out with fully legal weapons.
One is not contradictory to the other.
The first is a make believe scenario with the question of what would you do if ?
The second is an estimated and researched opinion based on actual incidents.

You're going to have to try harder if you think I will allow my words or thier meaning to be twisted. :thumbsup:

psychocat Reviewed by psychocat on 08-22-2008. G is for gun: Texas in a class of its own G is for gun: Texas in a class of its own * Andrew Clark, New York * August 19, 2008 WHEN teachers return for a new school term in the tiny Texas farming town of Harrold, they may be packing more than books and pens. To defend students from any gun-toting maniacs, they can also carry loaded pistols into the classroom. The remote rural community has appalled gun-control advocates by becoming America's first to allow teachers to bear concealed firearms. Harrold's school board Rating: 5

[Mississippi Steve]

It's a good thing to because school shootings have always taken place in tiny ass schools out in BFE. I love texas, the only thing we're progressive about is getting dumber. :thumbsup:

How about the public school systems anti up and hire some armed trained security instead of leaving it up to any ol 2nd amendment thumpin teacher with a carry conceal license?

They *probably* already have security guards...and its a hell of a lot cheaper to let the teachers carry weapons, than it is to hire more security guards.

FWIW, most all of the school "security guards" are there only as a figurehead, because they were too fat and lazy to work for a *real* police department.

[Mississippi Steve]

They could get the money for security personnel by eliminating some deadwood from the dept. of education's payroll, for starters.

Which is funded by hard earned tax dollars. It costs the shool district in excess of $80,000/yr for each security guard.....and no its *NOT* just their saleries....its their medical, dental and vision insurance, its their retirement(401K or whatever), its having to provide a vehicle, its having to provide communications(simple repeater system remote base, and a half dozen walkie talkies all with service contract starts at about $20,000), its school liability insurance, bonds, its having to train them, its having to issue sidearms, then there is the little matter of proficiency.... for both the guards and the teachers...how often do they need to qualify??

Welll...you get the idea. Its a whole lot simpler, easier, and less expensive to allow the teachers to carry a weapon of their choosing, the local sheriffs department can give them a course on weapons safety, basic tactical defense, and shoot for proficiency on their range. It could be done on a Saturday, and set a standard length of time for re-training and qualifications.. ...maybe once a quarter.

[McDanger]

I should have stated it better. I was making 2 separate points. But all I did was cut and paste your statement about most school shootings being done with legal weapons, and Most are not. Virginia Tech was, but most are done with stolen guns.

[psychocat]

I should have stated it better. I was making 2 separate points. But all I did was cut and paste your statement about most school shootings being done with legal weapons, and Most are not. Virginia Tech was, but most are done with stolen guns.

I have been able to find some statistics regarding legal guns used in school shootings , if you have links to prove your claim I would be interested in reading them.

My research suggests the majority of the firearms used in these events were obtained from perpetrators' homes or the homes of friends or relatives.

Source of Firearms Used by Students in School-Associated Violent Deaths --- United States, 1992--1999

In a study of 65 high-profile multiple-victim shootings in the United States over a period of 40 years, 62% of handgun shootings and 71% of long gun shootings were committed with legally acquired firearms.

Gun Facts - Mass Shootings

Feel free to dispute this but only with hard facts.

[MadSativa]

Hey Sativa sorry to be a pedant man but your sig has a problem.
It's spelled "THIER". :thumbsup:

Ita alright, I didnt even notice it till you said. its not a sig thoughjust had to light up the obvious.

[McDanger]

I have been able to find some statistics regarding legal guns used in school shootings , if you have links to prove your claim I would be interested in reading them.

My research suggests the majority of the firearms used in these events were obtained from perpetrators' homes or the homes of friends or relatives.

Source of Firearms Used by Students in School-Associated Violent Deaths --- United States, 1992--1999

In a study of 65 high-profile multiple-victim shootings in the United States over a period of 40 years, 62% of handgun shootings and 71% of long gun shootings were committed with legally acquired firearms.

Gun Facts - Mass Shootings

Feel free to dispute this but only with hard facts.

Well, here is a quote from your 1st link. The findings in this report are subject to at least four limitations. First, because events were identified from news media reports, any event not reported in the media was excluded. Second, this report includes events associated with schools; other homicide and suicide events involving school-aged perpetrators might have different firearm-acquisition patterns. Third, the results reported for homicide events might not reflect the true distribution of sources because the source of the firearms in approximately 25% of these events is unknown. Finally, among the student perpetrators who obtained their firearms from home or from friends or relatives, how the students gained access to these firearms is unknown.

They do not know where 25% of the guns came from, and the rest they don't know how they were obtained, so according to these FACTS how can you say "I would be willing to bet that most of the weapons used in school shootings are owned by the culprit and also fully legal."
Stealing from family is still stealing, and according to most of the reports that I read at the time of those shootings, the perpetrators did not have permission from the owners of those guns.
Now, I am only talking about the US. Minors cannot legally purchase firearms.

I'm done with this. We will have to agree to disagree.

[DaBudhaStank]

You can't go to a gun store and buy an automatic weapon.

Yes, you can. My friend bought an Israeli AK-47 a week ago. Fully automatic, background check was done in under a week. Buying a gun is so easy it's actually pretty laughable.

As far as I can tell, the second amendment does not say "everyone can own a gun."

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

Americans are allowed to create a civilian-based, armed militia, not carry weapons wherever they want.

[texas grass]

i do believe most the mass shootings in america are from people on perscription psycosomatic drugs. and alot of the shootings had auto weapons and pipe bombs.

to have a automatic weapon you have to have a class c license. and thats the same license to have silenced weapons. not many have this one. that israeli ak is most likely illegally sold being an auto


guns in responsible hands is way better than waiting for some cop to come 20 minutes late.

i for 1 would trust a responsible teacher that has been licensed to help protect my kid. and if you trust a teacher with your kids mind shouldnt you trust them with protecting them against harm.

[McDanger]

Yes, you can. My friend bought an Israeli AK-47 a week ago. Fully automatic, background check was done in under a week. Buying a gun is so easy it's actually pretty laughable.

As far as I can tell, the second amendment does not say "everyone can own a gun."

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

Americans are allowed to create a civilian-based, armed militia, not carry weapons wherever they want.

Well then he underwent other screening before he was given the permit for it. What are "the people" if not everyone? There is only one comma in that statement. There is no separation between the right of the people to keep and bear arms, and shall not be infringed. In the 1700's a militia was every man.