McCain blasts Supreme Court's Guantanamo ruling

[dragonrider]

Did I ever Argue this.. I said I FEEL they should be considered POW's. Because if you look at the terminology used, logically you come to the conclusion that they are POW's. I know what they are and how our government views them. You're stating fact against opinion. Do you make it a habit to slam someone's opinion, something they've admitted to not be fact?

I did not slam your opinion or make any personal attack on you. I don't understand why you would percieve that as a slam. I'm pointing out the inconsistency between what you feel should be done and what the Bush adminsitration has argued should be done. If you feel that the Guantanamo detainees should be treated as POWs, then that is great and I applaud your desire to see them have the recognied legal status of POW as apposed to the legal limbo of "enemy combatant." Perhaps if the Bush administration had treated them as POWs, then we would not be in this situation of having them afforded the rights of a civilian trial.

What rights am I sacrificing? Last I've checked, in this great Country that I'm proud to be in, I have not sacrificed my rights due to the operations of GITMO.

Well, here now we are talking about MY opinon. And MY opinion is that the government has attempted to create a legal limbo in which a person can be designated an "enemy combatant" and afforded no legal status whatsoever, neither a POW nor a criminal. MY opinion is that by creating such a legal designation, the governemnt has weakend the right to due process in general and has diminished MY rights to due process. If you create a system where you can put someone in prison without charging them, without any access to the legal system, or even the right to have their government or family notidfed of their detention, then how do you KNOW that YOU won't someday find YOURSELF in that hole? Do you just take it on faith that the government will never make that kind of mistake, and wrongly put YOU in prison for something they suspect YOU did? And if it did happen, what would YOU do? What recourse would you have?

I don't want to expand the scope of this debate any further, but I do want to say that the legal status of prisoners in GITMO is only one area in which I think the Bush adminsitration has diminsihed the rights of Americans. I agree that the legal battle around the legal status of GITMO detainees may have little practical affect on the rights of Americans. I am far more worried about other erosion of rights that do DIRECTLY apply to Americans on American soil, such as warantless wiretapping and othe kinds of surveilance. Again, I'm not trying to expand the scope of the thread, but I see the GITMO detainee issue as part of a larger pattern of the erosion of American rights.

You're wanting to combat enemies, who video tape beheadings of innocent CIVILIANS, with compassion. Do you think they are going to respond with compassion to us? I seriously doubt that.

Don't telll me what I want to do. I dislike someone else putting words in my mouth. If you want to discuss what I want to do, ask me, don't tell me.

I have no compassion whatsoever for anyone who beheads a civilian or practices any other kind of attack on civilians. My opinion is that in a war zone if we thnk we have the coordinates for someone who is suspected of this kind of thing, or any kind of terrorist activity, then we should drop a bomb on them or send in a sqaud to kill them in combat. I'm not in favor of trials for enemies in a war zone. However, my opinion is that if we capture people we suspect are eneimeis in a war zone, then we need to treat them as POWs. If we capture people outside a war zone that we suspect are terrorists, then we need to afford them some legal status so that we can prove those charges. And once those charges are proven, we can apply the maximum legal punishment --- death if possible. I have no comapssion for terrorists --- I just believe in the rule of law.

While there may be a number of people in Guantanamo who may be innocent I feel a good number of people there are probably there for the correct reason.

Well, there it is. That is the real nut of the matter. That's why these people need some kind of legal status. I agree that nearly all of the suspects in GITMO are probably there for the correct reason. I also think that almost all civilians who are arrested by civilian police for routine crimes are guilty of the crimes they are charged with. However, I still believe in due process.

In addition I stand by my STATEMENT; which is *MY* opinion, that we need a seperate process for these detainees. Maybe something supervised by a UN council. Although admittingly the UN is useless. It's outdated and no longer serves the purpose for which it was originally created.

Earlier you said that your opinion is that the detainiees are POWs, but here you say that your opinion is that there should be a separate process for them. That is not a consisitent opinion. However, I do agree that there may be a need for a different kind of process. It may actually be legitimate to create a separate legal status of "enemy combatant" that applies to a person who is not part of a foreign army but takes up arms against the US. However, my opinion is that so far the governemnt has not managed to create such a status in a way that satisfies either inernational law or the Constitution with regards to due process.

Stop your finger pointing and look on both parties sides. :hippy:

I disagree that I am doing any finger pointing. I especially am not pointing the finger at anyone on these boards if that is what you mean. I am however very critical of the Bush adminsitrtion for its diseragard for due process.

dragonrider Reviewed by dragonrider on 06-16-2008. McCain blasts Supreme Court's Guantanamo ruling Republican presidential candidate Sen. John McCain today called the U.S. Supreme Court ruling allowing Guantanamo detainees to challenge their status in civilian courts "one of the worst I've ever seen." McCain made his comments while traveling on his campaign bus to a town hall meeting at Burlington County College in Pemberton. "These are not American citizens. They are enemy combatants," McCain said. "I think this is one of the biggest mistakes that's been made in terms of our ability Rating: 5