An Innocent Man Tortured at Gitmo Tells All

[8182KSKUSH]

Rhetoric and nothing more.

Do I understand correctly that you are in Europe? How do they use the terms, Liberal and Conservative there? Do they have the same meaning? Anyways, this very first statement where you dismiss out of hand anything that is said that contradicts what you believe, and label it as "rhetoric" is fairly common here in the U.S. among what are called "Democrats/Liberals". I have seen people from all political beliefs do it, but it seems to be a mainstay of the "Liberal Playbook". Really I mean no personal offense to you. It does seem like you want me to address what you said point by point so I will, please don't take it personally though.:jointsmile:

If you gave even one answer to what I asked I wouldn't feel the need to repeat myself.
As I asked (and you failed to answer) how can America call itself civilised when it advocates torture?.

I am confused, you didn't repeat any questions? Just statements? I thought your question were rhetorical, they are legit questions, but have been debated up and down forever now. What I was getting at was the fact that there is a large post with quite a bit of contrary information, or info that is nicely left out of the first post here, that may alter some perception of the premise that "America Kidnapped and Tortured an Innocent Man". As soon as I provide any idea to the contrary, and point out it took about 10 seconds worth of reading to figure out that this story is not at all the whole story, the immediate response had no more than 3 sentences before ranting off about "remember WMD's".:wtf:
Wow, remember what I posted a couple of hours ago? No. Yeah you may have to read it first huh? Fact of the matter is, this guy was very likely not at all innocent, and likely is one lucky s.o.b. (Maybe) Fact is, you have to believe without question everything that he says about what "supposedly" happen to him. Fact is, liberals tend to be the first people to jump on the band wagon anytime an excuse to have "anti-America Rants" presents itself. Why bother checking to see the merits of the story? Supports my world belief!! I will not question it!!! Rant Rant, Remember WMD's" Do you see what I was getting at?
As for your direct question, I do not believe that "America advocates torture" which is I believe, a subjective statement that you are propping up as fact to support your own opinion. Of course you can believe whatever you want more power to you, I just think you are dead wrong. So I don't believe we advocate torture, and we are civilized obviously. Start a whole new thread just on "Is America a civilized Nation" if you want, I am sure it would be active.

How is it possible to take a moral stand when your (your being the US gov) methods are no better than those you denounce?
Why should America be allowed to torture ?.

Wow, well buddy, these are all 3 basically the same as the first question I just answered. You are restating that you believe "America advocates torture" multiple times. Again this is common practice of liberals in America when they do not want to actually have a real conversation. In this instance, you are using this tactic, whilst avoiding saying anything about the counter article that I posted here? Which is why I implied earlier that you didn't read it. That was just a joke, I am sure you did read it, and I am sure that you purposefully have failed to directly address it with regard to what this post is about, and have instead to pull out your "America advocates torture", "Remember WMD's" , blah, blah, on and on.

Are you trying to say that all the inmates of GB are guilty until proven innocent ??.

Yeah, I am good with that, fuck'em!:thumbsup:

And if that's the case doesn't it go against the normal practice of innocent until PROVEN guilty??.

You are correct, that is how OUR legal system works in America for Americans. As much as I know you wish for it, unfortunately America can't guarantee rights for Americans to everyone else in the world. Especially people that are AT WAR AGAINST US!@! So again, I say, fuck'em!:thumbsup:

Rights for all is Americas stand isn't it???.

Um....right, but this douche bag is actually German, not American. Remember, (again, common liberal tactic of moving on to a whole different debate once challenged with reality)!:thumbsup:

What about the rights of those detained????.

Again, FUCK'EM!!!! :jointsmile:

You say plenty but fail to adress what are very valid points.
If you would be so kind as to make an attempt to answer at least one thing :????.

Really, honestly, I just addressed everything you asked me to, as respectfully as possible for me.:thumbsup: Now I hope that you are kind enough to do likewise, read the original counter post, and ADDRESS THAT, INSTEAD OF WHAT YOU DID!

I do not hate America , I do however hate hypocrisy and blatant misuse of power. the "you hate America" card whenever someone questions thier practices is growing extremely old BTW
Gauntanamo Bay is an atrocity and those who support it's methods are no better than the people they are supposed to oppose.
As I already stated I have no faith in anything the security forces have to say as they have already proven how inept they are. They remind me of the Ministry of Misinformation from 1984.
Liberal is something anyone who knows me would never use to describe me

Enough said, whether or not you hate America is for you to know, I don't care if you do or not to be honest. I hate Europe it sucks, but it's just an opinion. I wouldn't exactly rant on and on about my personal OPINIONS that may or may not have anything relevant with the discussion. You basically just made alot of very broad, non specific, un-related to this post statements of your personal opinion. I am sorry I called you a liberal, you are what you are I guess, if you say you aren't great whatever the fuck, I don't care. I was just characterizing what you were saying, if you aren't what we here would call a "liberal" then you sure do repeat alot of their rhetoric and propaganda, which I can now fairly say about your posts, since I actually addressed every point you made point by point. Then I can actually support that statement that you are repeating the liberal political dogma!
Cheers Mate

[psychocat]

If that's your idea of respect then you really need to look up the definition of the word.
As I said you are using double standards , it isn't okay for others to use torture but it is okay for America.
Are you denying it happens ?
Dispatches: Kidnap and Torture American Style from Channel4.com
Waterboarding is torture regardless of your beliefs.
Are you trying to tell me that only Americans should be assumed innocent until proven guilty ?
If that is the case I find it simply unnaceptable. Ever heard the saying "practice what you preach" ?
America proclaims that everyone (not just Americans) has basic human rights such as presumed innocent till proven guilty and yet you seem to believe that isn't so. Why?
You even go so far as to say MIGHT not be so innocent, that in itself allows for the idea that they MIGHT not be so guilty as you believe.
Again it comes back to one set of rules for America and another for non Americans , surely that goes against the American idea of equality for all.
How about kidnapping of "suspects" ?
Statewatch News Online: Shannon used as kidnap operation stop-over - two men abducted from Sweden to Egypt
I'm sure if someone tried to kidnap an American citizen suspected of terrorism abroad the US goverment would be extremely pissed off.

Your logic is seriously deficient IMO.

A country cannot say "we promote the idea of equality for all" and then not actualy afford it . That's called hypocrisy.
It also reminds me of yet another Orwell book.
Animal Farm
"All animals are equal but some animals are more equal than others." - :wtf:

Sound familiar ?

[8182KSKUSH]

So I am right? You are going to continue to rant on and you are not going to comment on the article I posted, and you are going to continue to try and make the discussion about anything but what is was specifically about? Good to know, I won't be holding my breath waiting for you to say anything new or insightful, or comment directly on the article that I posted. Thanks for re-inforcing my beliefs though!:jointsmile:

[8182KSKUSH]

Be sure that in the future when you ask someone to do something you are willing to do the same.
Cherrio

[8182KSKUSH]

Stupidity is repeating the same acts and expecting different results.
The fact that stupid people will always make the same mistakes means that it requires the intelligence and ability to learn to know you are responsible for your own actions ..

I read this and couldn't agree with you more!

[fishman3811]

So if this guy is guilty of being a terrorist or having links to terrorism why is he free.Come on KUSH tell me why.He was brought infront of a kangaroo court and let go lol why???You say your country doesnt advocate torture thats B.S and you know it.Your country has kidnapped and tortured innocent canadians and europeans and for you to say we dont advocate torture is unbelievable.No wonder the rest of the world has such high regards for America

[Breukelen advocaat]

So if this guy is guilty of being a terrorist or having links to terrorism why is he free.Come on KUSH tell me why.He was brought infront of a kangaroo court and let go lol why???You say your country doesnt advocate torture thats B.S and you know it.Your country has kidnapped and tortured innocent canadians and europeans and for you to say we dont advocate torture is unbelievable.No wonder the rest of the world has such high regards for America

All I know is, thankfully, the United States has not been attacked since 9/11. I live less than 10 miles from Ground Zero, was in very close proximity when the attacks of 1993 and 2001 occurred, and have no sympathy for the people who wish to engage in more such actions against our society.

Rather than engage them, I'd rather boycott the entire Muslim world until they stop these threats themselves, but apparently nobody in the West wants us to do this - so there will be dangerous people hunted down and sometimes treated rough. I do not think that they deserve to benefit from the rights stipulated in the Geneva convention because they have no intention of ever adhering to ethics that are in accordance with it. They do not recognize it, or anything resembling a similar agreement, so we must do the best we can under the circumstances.

[8182KSKUSH]

So if this guy is guilty of being a terrorist or having links to terrorism why is he free.Come on KUSH tell me why.He was brought infront of a kangaroo court and let go lol why???

Who knows? I don't? Maybe zeee Germans had something to do wis it. I dunno but really, there is obviously more to the story than the initial article would have you believe, and that means that the author is either ignorant, or agenda driven. IMO Yark yark! I think it is the second option, and it's pretty obvious. IMHO yark yark!
The individual stories of people that are vacationing at Gitmo are likely all very intresting though.
I wish them all.....
FUCK'EM!:jointsmile:

[fishman3811]

BREUKEN how can you boycott the middle east??We get most of our oil from the middle east soo that will never happen......

[8182KSKUSH]

Actually the U.S. imports most of it's oil from Canada eh?!