guilty until proven innocent????

[slipnslide087]

becareful in the US. i fell a victim to a new freedom that was taken away by our govt. got a letter in the mail that says i have a court date for running a red light. they havea pic of my car going under a red light. then under it, it said "the light has been red for 0.2 seconds." fucking bullshit. theres no way they can prove i was driving my car. pinned on me bc a fucking camera at the red light? sorry USA, but thats not being innocent until proven guilty....and i think tahts something are country is supposed to be based on. HA im fighting in it court though. fuck paying $100 thats bullshit. and i want the courts to hear my 2 cents.

slipnslide087 Reviewed by slipnslide087 on 02-09-2005. guilty until proven innocent???? becareful in the US. i fell a victim to a new freedom that was taken away by our govt. got a letter in the mail that says i have a court date for running a red light. they havea pic of my car going under a red light. then under it, it said "the light has been red for 0.2 seconds." fucking bullshit. theres no way they can prove i was driving my car. pinned on me bc a fucking camera at the red light? sorry USA, but thats not being innocent until proven guilty....and i think tahts something are Rating: 5

[az666]

good on ya. lol. although im not sure............about anything

[Rarrr]

we have red light cameras here in australia, big revenue raisers... fuck them all!!!

[FRANKFRANKFRANK]

FIGHT THE FUCKING POWER, MAN!

[Cannabis.com]

Red light cameras are just a continuation of the erosion of the natural rights of all Americans.

Most states already can require drivers to submit to a breathalizer test upon request - if the driver refuses, they can lose their license and can even jailed ... some states even allow the person to *physically* forced to give a sample - be it breath, urine, or more often blood.

And it makes NO difference if the person is actually drunk or not - a driver is, in layman's terms, assumed guilty; the poster of this thread hit the title right on

How can that be possible ... the govt uses the logic that driving is a privilege - when I was younger, I too bought into that logic ... however, such logic is faulty because if driving is a privilege, then is biking, walking, etc too? ... all of those activities are often done on public streets too.

For folks who buys into the driving is a privilege logic, go to a rural area and see how long one can go without a car; many employers will not hire people who don't have car transportation.

More fundamentally, simply living in a house, etc can be considered a privilege - the government has eminent domain over *all* property (any property "owner" who doesn't think so - see what happens when you don't pay your taxes - yep, say bye bye to your property; an illusion anyways, since the govt owns all land) ... so in essance, merely living in a house, etc could be considered a privilege ...

Point is that if "privilege" is all it takes for the govt to justify assuming one is guilty until show otherwise, the collective basic natural human rights of Americans is already long gone ...

The reality of Kings and Peasants is still as real now as it ever was ... really digressed in this post - point is that ultimately, one has to be aware of their rights and *publicly* defend them like slipnslide087 is going to do by fighting that ticket - wish you the best

A few tips when challenging the ticket ...

* Challenging who is driving is likely *NOT* the best approach for various reasons ... ie. they could easily challenge you by asking "If that's not you, then who is it?" ... "Really, you don't know them?" "Did you file a stolen car report with the police?" etc...

* Google around and see what other folks have used to challenge such tickets.

* Research the laws in your state - was the red light camera properly certified?, is it properly installed/aimed?, -is the yellow light timing too short?, -is the camera properly syncronized; perhaps the camera took the picture when the light was only yellow?

* Was the light green when you entered the intersection? -if so, then it doesn't matter if you went through the red light or not ... a car already in an intersection may continue through; clear the intersection.

* Were you driving straight through ... or were you turning? This relates to above - ie. if you were making a left-hand turn, then going through on red should not be surprising since one often has to wait for opposing traffic to clear.

None of this is legal advice of any kind, but I hope it's helpful nevertheless ... and again I wish you the best

Ron

p.s. let us know what eventually happens.

[Buck268]

I'm pissed so I'll make it short (Pissed cuz my car is STILL in the fucking garage on fucking jackstands instead of out cruising around tonight like it should be)

THe US is not the same country that was created by the Revolutionary War, nor is it the country who ratified the Constitution, nor the country that settled the entire North American continent. We, as a country, are but a shell, a psuedoAmerican country. And it makes me fucking sick. Nobody values freedom anymore, these Neo Con's have made sure of that! The terrorists will get you unless you allow us to proect you! Yup, and we need them too also, since they have taken away (or tried to) our best means of defense, firearms. You mean there is actually a reason for every American to own an assault rifle? HELL YES. Its called National Security. If we were still an armed nation, do you think 9/11 would have happened? Not a chance, those box cutter weilding towelheads would have been shot to pieces. And the same goes for any other terrorist act.

But come on now, guns are evil, right?

This country is reaping the seeds sowed by the flower children of the 60's. Congrats.

[RESiNATE]

Some excellent points there, Ron
(you should visit the UK ..we have loads of them!!!)

In the UK, though, any Traffic Safety Devices (a posh term that the government uses for 'revenue raisers') have to have at least 100mtrs prior notification of their position - ie, they have to warn drivers that a speed-tracking device is ahead.
The law also stipulates that these cameras have to be 'in plain sight' (ie, not hidden behind a bush), and have to have reflective yellow cases.

Obviously, this is UK law and I don't know how things stand in the US...but might be worth looking into

The RAC (a motorist body) recently investigated the effectivness of these so-called traffic safety devices, and concluded that their implimentation bore no evidence of a reduction in road traffic accidents...but had helped to generate millions of £s in revenue.

And does this revenue go towards improving road surfaces, school crossing safety, or better road markings?

Does it fuck!
It goes into the pockets of the government - as does all taxes

http://www.safespeed.org.uk/effects.html
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/talking_point/3731585.stm

"Example... Essex County: for 2003 they had a massive increase in Speed Cameras: issuing 94,537 Fines: which netted them £5,672,220. And the Result? in 2002 there were 92 Fatalities: in 2003 there were 116 Fatalities: a rise of 25%. An unbiased conclusion might be that the Cameras were making no noticeable difference: and it was all a waste of Time and Money. The Authority's Conclusion? the County obviously needs more Speed Cameras! Strange how any decrease is due to Speed Cameras: but any increase is nothing to do with Speed Cameras!" - http://www.roadsupervisors.net/aej.speed.htm

Sorry...I'm a professional driver, and it's a pet hate!

The bottom line is this:
You SHOULD be aware of what is going on in front of you - whether that be the colour of the lights, or if the road surface is wet, etc etc etc
Speed doesn't kill - ineffectual drivers do!

However, if less time was spent looking out for these fucking cameras, then more attention could be spent on actually driving in a safe manner.
Every sensible person... is in favour of safer roads: but we are now in the 21st Century so it is about time the Authorities packed in their patronising lectures and put some effort into developing a Plan which is a little most sophisticated than some of the garbage they are peddling at the moment. You cannot develop a higher standard of driving for a whole country by simply Punishing people in ever greater numbers: their strategies are ill-conceived: simplistic: and unworthy of public support.

All power to you, slipnslide, i hope it goes well for you - remember, ignorance isnt a defense ...that's what the lawyers will tell you, not me being an asshole

[qwerty]

so then go faster so they cant see your liscense plate only a blurr

[RESiNATE]

lmao...they can detect speed up to 160mph (as far as I know), so unless you have something akin to a fucking formula one racing car, then you're pretty much nabbed, init

Just do what everyone else does...slam the brakes on!!
Then watch as 20 or 30 cars pile into your boot (trunk)...good safety device, eh?

[fatty lumps]

I don't understand. What freedom, exactly, was taken away? You knew there was a red light camera there (if you didn't you should pay more attention), and you blew through it when it was either red, or in the process of turning red. You knew what was gonna happen.

Just be happy you don't get demerits (only because, like you say, they can't prove it was you).

out.