Argument made by religious people that just isn't valid

[sd6515]

*wasn't

[Fallen_Icarus]

I am ignorant because I choose not to believe something without a shred of evidence for its support of existence?

lol

No one has the slightest physical evidence to support a historical Jesus; no artifacts, dwelling, works of carpentry, or self-written manuscripts. All claims about Jesus derive from writings of other people. There occurs no contemporary Roman record that shows Pontius Pilate executing a man named Jesus. Devastating to historians, there occurs not a single contemporary writing that mentions Jesus. All documents about Jesus got written well after the life of the alleged Jesus from either: unknown authors, people who had never met an earthly Jesus, or from fraudulent, mythical or allegorical writings. Although one can argue that many of these writings come from fraud or interpolations, the information and dates to show that even if these sources did not come from interpolations, they could still not serve as reliable evidence for a historical Jesus, simply because all sources derive from hearsay accounts.

So lets be sensible about this, evidence is not based upon hearsay, which is the only type of evidence one can provide in terms of the existence of jesus christ.

And im still waiting for the evidence that Jesus Christ existed

I accept that not everyone should or does believe in his divinity but they can't just out right deny his existance

And why not?

Why does the Jesus on the Cross for all our sins story hold so much weight that we all MUST believe it?

IT and HIS EXISTENCE holds as much weight as the earlier comparision to the great African Tinman.

So do you believe that nobody should deny the existence of the African Tinman?

Because i dont see the difference in terms of evidence for existence between the two Myths

[Iambreathingin]

How dare you call somone who doesn't follow a linear faith ignorant.

[Fallen_Icarus]

lol yes i too would like to know how on earth someone who chooses not to believe in jesus christ (the existence or the divinity) is ignorant.

[delusionsofNORMALity]

Unless I'm mistaken, no one's saying that nothing from the bible ever happened. Some of it is probably true, the question is whether all of it happened.

i'm not sure that even that is the question. even if every action attributed to jesus were proven to have been truthfully related, there are possible scientific explanations for most of it and the remainder could easily be disregarded as misinterpretation or dozens of other flaws in observation. the real problem seem to lie in the reasons for the actions, not the actions themselves.

miracles occur every day. most are easily explained away by the lunatic nature of reality or as out and out fraud, but some remain unexplained. those unexplained bits always seem to end up being attributed to some higher power or other and i would imagine that such was the case two thousand years ago as well. once the idea of god is taken out of the equation it all becomes nothing more than tales of interesting goings on in the middle of the desert.

so, there we are again. back to mankind's need for scapegoats and saviors.:beatdeadhorse:

[Iambreathingin]

In the end what's important is what's learnt from teachings and stories. Everyone knows about the kid who cried wolf, and lots of children learn a valuble lesson from it, but nobody I'm aware of debates the historical accuracy of the story, because we accept that its truth is irrelvant, and we get the point. We learn the lesson, or atleast understand what it's communicating.

While I am happy to let Christian people follow their own faith and find their own path to spiritual peace, it seems that most christians will not extend me the same cursoty. Perhaps it's due to weak faith in need of reassurance. Perhaps they genuninly want to "Save me", or heck, maybe they want to get into one of the few remaining spots left in "heaven".

Who knows, but like I said, please try and take the message from these teachings, instead of taknig them all literally leading you to violently disagree with people on a level associated with your ego.

-thanks.

[Fallen_Icarus]

I dont know about heaven lol

I mean..

Can you imagine spending 100,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,00 0,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 years in heaven?

im sure if you times that by 50 trillion you havent even entered the mathematical realm of "eternity" yet.

Just a thought.

[delusionsofNORMALity]

In the end what's important is what's learned from teachings and stories.

as philosophy it is a gem, but the creation of religion brings with it a huge amount on unwieldy baggage.

many years ago i inadvertently insulted an electrician i was working with by praising the ideals in the bible as a great philosophy. what followed was a frightening diatribe, vehemently demanding that i realize that the bible was not some mere philosophical text but the true and only word of god. this seems to be the eventual outcome of spiritualizing morality. it creates an us against them mentality that glorifies one set of ideas at the expense of all others.

[sd6515]

TO this

Why does the Jesus on the Cross for all our sins story hold so much weight that we all MUST believe it?

IT and HIS EXISTENCE holds as much weight as the earlier comparision to the great African Tinman.

So do you believe that nobody should deny the existence of the African Tinman?

Because i dont see the difference in terms of evidence for existence between the two Myths

and this

How dare you call somone who doesn't follow a linear faith ignorant.
Reply With Quote

This would be the reason you are ignorant. one to the first quote a re read this

I accept that not everyone should or does believe in his divinity but they can't just out right deny his existance

Speaking to the historical fact that there was a man named Jesus who is the same Jesus in the bible, not ignorant that you do not believe in "my" "liniear faith" you can choose to or not to believe in the religon or divinity but to use history as you defense and then deny history is true is pretty much the definition of ignorance and then to further compund this and give us the full definition of ignorance you can't understand simple english in which no one if ever called or reffered to as being ignorant for not believe at least we did find someone more ignorant that fallen who actualy wrote this after read the original writing and then again reading a quoted text and still not being able to comprhend what is being said maybe this is a little over your head so to slow things down for you I will quote what was said again, that twice here and 4 times total it has been used can you understand it yet iambreathingin

I accept that not everyone should or does believe in his divinity

and considering that it is said that Jesus used to use cannabis in is healings and other religous acts performed I am shocked that so many atheiests are on hear but i think it has a lot to do with the other fact of the high depression suicide and confrontational acts of athiests

[sd6515]

I DO NOT judge anyone for not believing and have said that multiple times I do not push my religon on anyone but I do defend my beliefs to the death as I would expect you to and respect you all for your strong beliefs in non believing, the only ignorant thing is deny the historical facts you so greatly claim to desire. It just makes you seem just like the frieken radical christians out there who do force religion and ridiculous claims on people and claim that they will be eternally damned. I have no problem with athiest until they begin to atack me and my faith with ignorance.