"We Muslims Living in America are getting sick of this crap

[F L E S H]

You got me totally wrong, LT. First of all, as I said in another post, I'm in no way a left-winger, except on social issues. Second of all, yes, I do like to believe that I'm somewhat above petty propaganda, and I'm able to recognize it from all parts of the political spectrum, I don't really care what you think about me. Thirdly, I never said muslims aren't so bad when you compare them to christians. I said that Islam is a religion that is not more violent, or less, than Christianity. Don't take my words out of context.

You seem so sure of yourself when you say that Islam is inherently violent. I wanna know where you got this opinion from, because your argument for everything boils down to "because I say so." If you're gonna convince people, you gotta do better than that.... I've been known to change my mind when I'm thoroughly convinced .

F L E S H Reviewed by F L E S H on 01-25-2005. "We Muslims Living in America are getting sick of this crap Hugh Fitzgerald: "We Muslims living in America are getting sick of this crap" jihadwatch ^ | jan 21 | Hugh Fitzgerald Fitzgerald: "We Muslims living in America are getting sick of this crap" Jihad Watch Vice President Hugh Fitzgerald reflects on recent Muslim complaints that they are unfairly suspected and discriminated against: "We Muslims living in America are getting sick of this crap." There is no Muslim contribution to the American polity, not to the entire edifice of the Rating: 5

[Libertarian Toker]

"You got me totally wrong, LT."

Maybe, maybe not.

"First of all, as I said in another post, I'm in no way a left-winger, except on social issues."

Yep, and that's kind of a problem since I said nothing about left or right. You are not using preprogramed remarks are you? How can you be in no way a lefty, except on social issues? That would mean that you do swing to the left in some ways. What is not a social issue?

"Second of all, yes, I do like to believe that I'm somewhat above petty propaganda, and I'm able to recognize it from all parts of the political spectrum"

And that's a problem also. Tell me Flesh, what is propaganda, and who uses it? It's been my expirence that those that think they are not, and can not, be propagated are usually the one that are taken in the most by one side or the other of any given issues propaganda. You didn't answer directly, so I will have to assume your answer means you think you hold the truth. Where do you get your truth from Flesh?

"I don't really care what you think about me."

Sure ya do! Why else would you try to explain yourself to me?

"Thirdly, I never said muslims aren't so bad when you compare them to christians. I said that Islam is a religion that is not more violent, or less, than Christianity. Don't take my words out of context."

You go first on the context thing! BTW, what I said was, "what you "seemed" to be saying". That is what it seemed like you were saying to me. Your kind of a picky one ain't ya?

"You seem so sure of yourself when you say that Islam is inherently violent."

I am sure of myself. Are you unsure of yourself?

"I wanna know where you got this opinion from, because your argument for everything boils down to "because I say so."

I thought you didn't care? Oh well, I guess you do care after all. I get my opinion from me. I don't get my opinon from others. I am the only source for my opinion. Who is it that tells you what your opinion is?

"If you're gonna convince people, you gotta do better than that"

I don't do this to change other peoples minds, I do it to change mine.

Toker

[Libertarian Toker]

"LT, you know exactly what I meant by what I said. Most of Torogs opinions come from either the Bush administration or his religion."

Since he doesn't think like you, you think it's cool to call him racist? Is that what you meant? When you say someone "probable" hates blacks and jews and the like, what is it your doing? I see clearly what it is your doing, I wonder if you do?

Toker

[F L E S H]

You're funny. You ask me "where do I get my truth from" yet when I ask you, you won't tell me. I never said I didn't care, in fact, I'm extremely curious about where you hear these things, since you act as if you hold the key to this argument.... Don't keep it to yourself, share the knowledge! I told you, I can change my mind, if your case is good enough. Nobody tells me what my opinions are, I try to see the facts, and I form my own conclusions.

[GHoSToKeR]

You're right, LT, Torog doesn't think like me. I dont spread hate and fear and anger. The only thing I hate is blind prejudism. Period.

[pisshead]

You're funny. You ask me "where do I get my truth from" yet when I ask you, you won't tell me. I never said I didn't care, in fact, I'm extremely curious about where you hear these things, since you act as if you hold the key to this argument.... Don't keep it to yourself, share the knowledge! I told you, I can change my mind, if your case is good enough. Nobody tells me what my opinions are, I try to see the facts, and I form my own conclusions.

good luck with that. he's the same way to me. nothing i provide is ever good enough (even when it's congressman, congressional reports, executive orders, recognizing spin, articles from around the world, ap, upi, reuters, legislation, etc...), yet it's like pulling teeth to find out his hidden knowledge that refutes everything and is propaganda free...

toker's all talk. he can ask a thousand questions, but can't answer any himself. check out his responses to my posts on the politics board, it's always semantical or nonsensical, and never addresses any of the issues. he is a good double thinker though.

[Libertarian Toker]

You're right, LT, Torog doesn't think like me. I dont spread hate and fear and anger. The only thing I hate is blind prejudism. Period.

So what your saying is that your blindly prejudice against people that probably are prejudice??? If someone probably hates, you feel the need to hate also? Is that what your saying? What are you spreading when you claim Torog is probably racist? Hate? Fear? Anger?

Toker

[Libertarian Toker]

I do hold the key! Didn't you know? So, you act as if you hold the key, and I act as if I do. Now what? Who does hold that key man? Is it you, or is it me? Maybe it's neither one? The evidence is all over that proves islam is violent. Why do you ignore it? You want me to change your mind for you. I say change it yourself.

Toker

[pisshead]

i know muslims, they aren't violent. i know christians who aren't violent as well. there are violent muslims and there are violent christians.

i could care less what people half way around the world are doing when my republic is being dismantled and a technological dictatorship is emerging. why should we cheer on the destruction of our country while our great officials claim to want to spread freedom all around the world?

evil muslims didn't pass the patriot act and give us homeland security and the new freedom initiative and national id cards. they didn't force homeland security to hire ex stasi and KGB chiefs to work out our internal passport system. they didn't force the put options on the airlines or call people government 'officials' and tell them not to fly...

but wait, i forgot, i'm supposed to be looking at the other hand...

[GHoSToKeR]

So what your saying is that your blindly prejudice against people that probably are prejudice??? If someone probably hates, you feel the need to hate also? Is that what your saying? What are you spreading when you claim Torog is probably racist? Hate? Fear? Anger?

Toker

LOL

If somebody comes out with blatantly racist or prejudist remarks, then calling them out for what they are does not classas prejudism. And even if being anti-racist IS prejudism, then i'm definately prejudist in that respect. Stop trying to twist my words, because I dont care enough to argue with you anymore.