should XScotlandX go independant?

[Staurm]

I thought it might be a good time to ask what people think of the possibilty of Scotland becoming an independant state from England, after 300 years of union. Here's a short badly constructed summary of my tuppence on the issue.

I wouldn't call myself a nationalist, I'm more of an anarchist. But I am a sensible anarchist, I beleive in leaders but only if they earn their authority, not through ballot boxes, but through action. I understand the neccessity for some centralised power base, for the purpose of defending ourselves in the world today. If only America would stop acting like a pariah state I might even support it's cause towards stopping terrorism.

I beleive in communities and democracy, but through decentralised government, to the point where individual towns and communities form their own rules together, not have them thrust upon them by some politically stagnate realpolitik.

I've always been more of an SSP supporter (Scottish Socialist Party), but they are as good as dead now. I'm more happy to see the SNP in power in Scotland though, than any of the others. And they have formed a coalition with the green party as well which will grant them more influence.

So far as the consquences of independence for scotland go, I just don't know. I suspect that the main counter argument that Scotland would suffer because it would lose tax subsidies might be flawed, coming as it is from the forked tongues that dictate to us how we live our lives from Whitehall.

Whatever happens, I hope the current Scottish Assembly is succesful in blocking any plans the MOD has to splash out more working class tax revenue on a new trident. I'm more concerned with home affairs, what destructuve technology we might be building, than what Iran might be building.

One thing is for sure, if we do end up with a referedum on Scottish independence, and Scotland became independent, I think there will be a greater chance of Scotland taking back it's sovereignty from from any foreign investors with ulterior motives, what with Westminster being out of the equation, and the Scottish assembly not being known for taking any shite from the Bank of America.

BBC NEWS | Scotland | Tolls abolished for Skye Bridge

Staurm Reviewed by Staurm on 06-22-2007. should XScotlandX go independant? I thought it might be a good time to ask what people think of the possibilty of Scotland becoming an independant state from England, after 300 years of union. Here's a short badly constructed summary of my tuppence on the issue. I wouldn't call myself a nationalist, I'm more of an anarchist. But I am a sensible anarchist, I beleive in leaders but only if they earn their authority, not through ballot boxes, but through action. I understand the neccessity for some centralised power base, for Rating: 5

[Psycho4Bud]

How is their representation in the British government? Right now I'd almost compare this to lets say Texas breaking away.....

By the way....keep these threads coming!!! Great reading!:thumbsup:

Have a good one!:s4:

[S.P.Q.R.]

well it depends... how stable would Scotlands economy be without England?

But I'm all for independance :thumbsup:

[Staurm]

When Tony Blair came to power in 1997 he immediately set about having a referendum in Wales and Scotland for devolution, both countries voted in favour of it. The first First Minister of scotland was called Donald Dewar, but he died suddenly of a heart attack not long after winning the first election, and was replaced internally shortly thereafter by Jack McConnell, who remained First Minister until last month when the leader of the SNP, Alex Salmond, won an assembly election for the position, following his parties narrow and last minute victory in the scottish elections. The SNP won by a majority of only 1 seat, I think, and since this wasn't enough to secure Salmond the chair by default, they had to form a minority coalition government with a further 2 Green party MSP's, who reached a compromise between their two manifestos. The other two parties, the lib dems and the conservative's were obliged to honour the manifesto they were elected upon and were therefore unable to reach a mutually agreeable compromise with them. As it stands the SNP, therefore, have limited powers to have their motions passed through the scottish parliament. The SNP's main agenda is to form an independent state, separate from Westminster, and all of the other parties oppose this, so it will be difficult for them to pass a motion for having a referendum on independence. They are aiming to have a referendum in 2 or 3 years, probably after Gordon Brown has lost the next UK wide general election and the Conservatives get back in. They are even less popular in Scotland than the Labour party. At the moment, I don't know what limited powers the devolved scottish parliament has, I think it's probably a grey area on the whole, but as for the specific details laid out in paper I don't really know what they are good for. Not shy of attracting any controversy through the years, one thing they are good at is pishing our money away on badly designed parliament buildings. It seems as though our first two First Ministers acted with pretty much the same agenda as the British government, which isn't surprising since they bore the same political tripe. But now, the SNP are not popular with the Labour government so it'll be interesting to see what happens. Gordon Brown expressed his welcomings to Alex Salmond with the same level of disingenuity that Tony Blair would have unintentionally displayed.

I've always like the SSP. They have some support, but largely their vote is taken away by the more popular and long standing SNP. The SSP stand for the legalisation of all drugs, hence their limited political influence, and sadly this year they lost all of their seats in scotland. During the swearing in procedure at one of the elections, Colin Fox, their now leader, subverted the procedure by closing his eyes and singing a song by the Scottish bard Robert Burns, much to the chagrin of the speaker of the house. He expressed his regret after this, I don't know why. Nearly every time I attended a protest in edinburgh against the Iraq Invasion he was there on his soap box.

[Staurm]

well it depends... how stable would Scotlands economy be without England?

But I'm all for independance :thumbsup:

As an anarchist, I don't give a shit about the economy. It's freedom from totalitarian rule that I am after. A stable ecology is one free from abstract monetary association. The less it costs, the more it's worth.

[Gandalf_The_Grey]

I usually hear British politicians making the argument that Scotland's economy is too dependant on Britain. But really, should a nation and ancient society lose its independance because one of the world's most historically arrogant powers believes they much permanently suckle at their tit to survive? Scotland existed thousands of years without the brits, and I'm sure they could establish their own economy and international trade systems were they left to govern themselves. I just don't believe a nation has the right to conquere and control another because they'd bring a "civilized" way of life to them. How the people of an ancient society live is up to them, not up to western superpowers to dictate.

[Gandalf_The_Grey]

BTW I'm just curious, why the "X" placed around the word "Scotland"?

[Staurm]

Sxottish flag Gandalf, not that I am a supporters of flags, as an anarchist, but it sort of tied in the topic and made the title look more interesting.

[Gandalf_The_Grey]

Sxottish flag Gandalf, not that I am a supporters of flags, as an anarchist, but it sort of tied in the topic and made the title look more interesting.

Ah I see, that's cool.

Have a good one.

[all ablaze]

As an english man i say yes scotland should be independant. I don't see why scots should have a say on english polocies where as english don't get a say on scottish ones. If the scots want independance as they all say they do then go independant it's no big deal to us english, mind you there are loads of "proud scots" plying their trade in england that you might want to call back home to help with the economy up there.

Laters.