Ron Paul's Inconvenient Facts

[Breukelen advocaat]

Breukelen advocaat, you're not actually buying into this "they hate freedom" thing are you? I'm sure AlQaeda would rather have a suppressive Taliban state than a democracy, but please, don't tell me this whole war on America is simply because they "hate their freedom" . That's about the lamest excuse I've heard from officials, as if we're fighting the forces of Mordor who are furious that every sentient being isn't in shackles and suffering. If freedom was all that pissed them off, America would hardly be their number 1 target, there are tonnes of countries in Europe, as well as Japan, Canada, and Australia that have more freedoms and civil liberties than the states.

A jihad on Holland, a Jihad on the Aussies! lol

But we were the target. The extremists in this religion are insane, and anybody that can't see that isn't far behind them, or misinformed. Their goal is to rule the world with Islam, or see the whole planet destroyed. If they had attacked another country, I'd feel the same way.

You know after reading the original post again, I find it absurd that giuliani says he "lived through the 9/11 attacks". So what, now anybody who lived in New York "lived through it"? Give me a break, unless you were actually in or around the towers, you didn't live through anything but the usual smog in the air.

Bullshit. Giuliani was right down there, and in very much in harm's way. He lost a number of close associates, and friends.

The toxic chemicals that were released from the attack were not just the "usual smog in the air" - many people are still sick, and some have died from it. Not only were people hurt physically, but many were injured emotionally by Post Traumatic Syndrome, not to mention the loss of jobs, business, and tourism to NYC.

Imagine that had happened to Houston, or Dallas. You can bet that Ron Paul wouldn't dare shoot off his mouth like he has, for fear of being shot.

[mrdevious]

But we were the target. The extremists in this religion are insane, and anybody that can't see that isn't far behind them, or misinformed. Their goal is to rule the world with Islam, or see the whole planet destroyed. If they had attacked another country, I'd feel the same way.

But still, they didn't make America their number 1 target because they're the almightly shining beacon of freedom. It just irks me that the current leaders are trying to sell the notion that this whole war is about crazy people hating freedom, and nothing else. It's bad enough how every war, in any country, for any reason, is "fighting to protect our freedom" by default.

Bullshit. Giuliani was right down there, and in very much in harm's way. He lost a number of close associates, and friends.

Alright that's cool, I wasn't aware that Giuliana was actually down there during or before the tower collapse. You do mean during or before or at least right after, right?

The toxic chemicals that were released from the attack were not just the "usual smog in the air" - many people are still sick, and some have died from it. Not only were people hurt physically, but many were injured emotionally by Post Traumatic Syndrome, not to mention the loss of jobs, business, and tourism to NYC.

I'm not arguing with you man. The "usual smog" comment was referring to, literally, the usual New York air pollution, it was just a light-hearted jest.

[Breukelen advocaat]

But still, they didn't make America their number 1 target because they're the almightly shining beacon of freedom. It just irks me that the current leaders are trying to sell the notion that this whole war is about crazy people hating freedom, and nothing else. It's bad enough how every war, in any country, for any reason, is "fighting to protect our freedom" by default.

I do not agree with everything that has been done by the U.S. since 9/11 - but the attacks of 9/11 were done by "crazy people hating freedom". Read up on bin Laden's agenda. Personally, I'd boycott the whole Muslim/Islamic world until they get this bastard, and others like him. Bin Laden does not want us to do business with the Arab nations, and I say lets do exactly that. Then weâ??ll see what happens. Unfortunately, the majority of car-driving people wonâ??t go along with such a boycott because it might mean that theyâ??ll have to get up off their fat asses and walk more.


Alright that's cool, I wasn't aware that Giuliana was actually down there during or before the tower collapse. You do mean during or before or at least right after, right?

NYC City Hall is 2 minutes from the WTC, and Rudy was right in the thick of it. He could have been killed. Of course, ANY mayor would have had to do the same - and he was no exception.

I'm not arguing with you man. The "usual smog" comment was referring to, literally, the usual New York air pollution, it was just a light-hearted jest.
Oh, I understand. The air in NYC isn't that bad - maybe you're thinking of another city. The air is now "good to moderate": AIRNow - Air Quality Conditions & Forecasts - New York City, NY.

New York elected Giuliani twice - and the city made a remarkable comeback under his administration. I don't agree with a lot of things he stands for, but he's got a hell of a lot more guts and brains than Ron Paul.

Once again, if an equivalent act of terrorism had happened in Texas, and Ron Paul (or any Texan politician for that matter) insinuated that it was our won fault, they'd get their head blown off - and don't think for one minute that it wouldn't happpen. He knows that much!

Have a good 'un.

[fishman3811]

America has been messing with Arab affairs for decades and to say that its not Americas fault that it got attacked is absurd and if anyone thinks that they hate us because of our freedom and our money or the way we treat our women is misinformed to the highest degree.In laymans terms they hate us because we fuck with them.We occupy their lands we prop up corrupt governments and worst of all Western sanctions has killed thousands if not hundreds of thousands of Muslims mostly women and children.So if you want to find out why they hate us maybe you should stop listnening to GWB/Cheney and do some real research.

[RamblerGambler]

Of course Giuliani was there, someone had to lead. Right?

An examination of Mr. Giulianiâ??s handling of the extraordinary recovery operation during his last months in office shows that he seized control and largely limited the influence of experienced federal agencies. In doing that, according to some experts and many of those who worked in the trade centerâ??s ruins, Mr. Giuliani might have allowed his sense of purpose to trump caution in the rush to prove that his city was not crippled by the attack.

Ground Zero Illnesses Clouding Giuliani’s Legacy - New York Times

So rational explanations are bad but political posturing is good?

[Psycho4Bud]

America has been messing with Arab affairs for decades and to say that its not Americas fault that it got attacked is absurd.

IF that is actually the case then why didn't they go after Great Britain or France? Weren't they raping them countries WAY before we were even a nation?

Have a good one!:s4:

[fishman3811]

P4B YOUR right they were but America give billions of dollars to Isreal each year and since Isreal kills muslims every year America gets blamed because most of the weapons that Isreal buys comes from the money you guys give them.Isreal is seen by many Muslims as just another arm of the U.S unfortunitly.So,many people would agree that Isreal has comitted war crimes against the muslim people and the muslims have retaliated.In my view Isreal should give back all of the occupied lands back to the muslims and stay on their little stretch of land but whether or not that will solve anything is beyond me,probably not.

[PlantBoxer]

[Alright that's cool, I wasn't aware that Giuliana was actually down there during or before the tower collapse. You do mean during or before or at least right after, right? ]

Sure makes you wonder why the scum bag Gulianni wasnt running TO his $40,000,000.00 Emergency Command Headquarters WTC7,on 911. You remember THAT one, that FELL STRAIGHT DOWN INTO IT'S OWN FOOTPRINT @ 5:30pm or so...from a fire!!
He was running AWAY from the fire.Fire never brought down a steel/concrete building...exactly why fire fighters went in also, they never fall from fire....but he was heading away from his command center, way early ?

[Psycho4Bud]

P4B YOUR right they were but America give billions of dollars to Isreal each year and since Isreal kills muslims every year.

LOL...and when the rockets come over towards Israel killing women and children what SHOULD they do........send fruit baskets over to the poor Muslims?

This recent outbreak of bombing on the Gaza strip was because they sat back and watched 50 rockets being thrown at them by Hamas.

Have a good one!:jointsmile:

[fishman3811]

Yeah but they want Isreal out of the occupied terrortories.Dont you think if we Canadians occupied North Dakota dont you think youd be a little pissed.