biblical contradictions: hit me

[bobbygreenbear]

if you have read the bible, the first testament speaks mainly as god as the "ruler" of the people, with no mercy and forgivness.

Once you hit the new testament and the comming of jesus, we see a total turn around as god being a savor, and he with all the mercy and forgivness.

It was made this way so we see the mercy limits of god, we have a lifetime of mercy, but on our day of judgement god has no mercy.

Personally i think its a load of BS, because any god whom tests his people through human sacrifice is just wrong.

From the teachings of Abraham we can see the controversy instilled when God asked him to kill his child in the name of god, Abraham with the ax in his hand about to do it, and god say's you have proven your love to me.

i can understand where you're coming from; i will say that God would never have let Abraham kill his son, but, that is sort of irrelevant, he set Abraham up to be willing to do it. this is a morality issue; i can't logically argue that this is a good or right thing. i feel where you're coming from.

[bobbygreenbear]

if humans are dumb as sheep why should we go to church and listen to what pastors think the scriptures mean.. going to church is a little to much like the catholic church before the protestant reformation for me.

i actually haven't been to church in years. i think i'd like to go back though. all churches are different. on the one hand, i agree wholeheartedly that checking your brain at the door and just accepting whatever you're told is bullshit. in fact, i believe that more than anything, you have to come to your own conclusions, and can't just believe whatever someone tells you, and that with anything in this life. on the other hand, i've known pastors that were wonderful fellows (my pastor's son and i were great friends and i used to hang with his fam.); he was the kind of man that i'd like to be someday; caring, hardworking, giving, and would do anything for his family.

[bobbygreenbear]

jesus also appears in writings of Josephus (who was NOT a follower or believer)...

here is a question Bobby...

According to the Bible, those who do not believe in and accept Jesus as their Savior cannot go to heaven. God created a place for those (both angelic and human) who do not believe. This place is called "Hell" and is described as a place of complete seperation from God as well as utter torture and misery (fire and brimstone).

If God truly is love, then why did he create hell to add more misery to eternal seperation from HIMSELF? That seems to contradict who he says he is. What would God have to gain or prove from not only eternally seperating himself from them, but actually trying to add more to the misery of eternal seperation by adding other forms of misery???

understood that sin cannot be in a perfect place, so sinners cannot enter heaven... that is logical. why would he try to add more misery?!?!?!?! it isn't to teach the beings a lesson since there is no redemption after damnation. isn't eternal seperation enough without the extra torture???

or is the Bible inaccurate in its description of hell...?

this really is THE question. it is for me. i'll be honest with you, i can't wrap my head around it. i understand all the logic of "God is holy, if you've sinned you can't be in His presence", but that's not nearly good enough for me.

this is totally extra-biblical, but i guess i keep in mind that the Bible doesn't contain EVERYTHING there is to know about God, not hardly. i think of it as god explaining heavenly things down to our level, and it can often get figurative and incomplete. i guess what i really hope is that god has an ace up his sleeve and everyone will be saved. my parents aren't believers in christ; i can't imagine them suffering forever. i cannot possibly imagine that, and there is no way i can understand how god could possibly let that happen, if he loves us so much. so i guess my answer is: i feel the same way, i can't believe that god would let that happen, but i also recognize that what i understand is extremely limited; i can't wrap my head around a fraction of god's mind.

i warned y'all i didn't have all the answers


ps: also, it should be noted that hell was made for the devil and the fallen angels, not for man. this isn't really an explanation, but it's something to note

yeah, i really don't get it

[bobbygreenbear]

Okay, how about this one? When the women arrive at Jesus' tomb, according to Luke, Mark and John, the tomb was open, but according to Matthew it was closed.




But:


Or how about these two Biblical passages, which clearly contradict each other:


So, God makes a commandment prohibiting killing, and then makes another commandment to kill your wife if she's had her cherry popped, and one to kill women who are raped in the city if they don't scream loud enough.

Regardless of whether or not this is a contradiction, this is a stinking heap of extremely barbaric misogyny.

as far as the killing, the hebrew word "you shall not KILL" means to "murder", so there is no contradiction; it's not prohibiting all killing, but murder. as far as the penalities for sin in the tribe, i can't argue that it was right for god to enact those penalties; it was to keep the tribe holy and pure, but again this is a question of personal opinion of morality.

as far as the first question, i don't think the reading is supposed to indicate that that is a 1-2 sequence of events, like:

1.they come to the tomb
2.the stone gets rolled away

i'm trying to parse "descended" (katabas) but having some trouble

this is the sort of thing where the original languages are essential, but as far as i can see, the folks coming to the tomb, and the earthquake could have very well been simultaneous

[bobbygreenbear]

My big problem with God and all that is...doesn't it seem a little too convenient that thousands of years ago people saw miracles and burning bushes and giant man eating whales (stomach acids would digest you in seconds, not to mention other digestive processes apparently absent from completely hollow fish) and now nothing. Anything that doesnt make sense is simply explained by saying. "god works in mysterious ways or sense you arent God you cant understand it" thats BS. I thought God gave me intelect and rationality so i could understand things like that. Our GOD GIVEN rationality tells us to reject concepts that dont make sense within our physical world... I think that the Bible was written by many naive people, like greeks who thought there was a SUN GOD or GOD of WAR. Remember it was only 600 years ago that man thought you fell off the end of the earth if you sailed to far...and we are to take the words of men 1800 years or so ago as facts...Also very convenient that when Jesus rose from the dead only 12 guys saw him and a couple ladies i think. He couldnt of gone to market that would of gotten the message out that hes meeans business...

one thing that you do have to deal with though is this: the followers of jesus were willing to die, often in terrible ways, and be persecuted for their belief; it would be hard for me to understand that if jesus died and that's it, that they made up a story about him being risen, and then went and dedicated their lives to the lie, got persecuted, and most of them killed in terrible ways

[bobbygreenbear]

The Bible cannot be read literally because people of that time had no idea what they were seeing. The describe bright lights, voices, chariots of fire et cetera. They lacked our vocabulary and described certain visions and apparitions with the words they had. Just read the first couple pages of ezekiel and you will understand what i mean. Ezekiel speaks of a metallic object in the sky and a creature with 4 faces and other odd features. Well i'm done with this rant for now.

i really don't get this argument. they lacked our language? i'd COMPLETELY disagree with that; in fact i'd say that language has degraded more than anything. for example, in the new testament there are three different words which are all translated as "love" in english. this is one of the most prime examples for the importance of original language understanding.

yeah, that ezekiel stuff is REALLY weird, but i'd tend to say it is a person trying to describe something heavenly with earthly words, not that their language was primative. you get the same problem in revelation. john is like: "well, it looks kinda like this shining thing, with glass, and water, and uhh......." and you get the picture he can't find words to describe it; i think if he had modern english it would probably be much worse

[bobbygreenbear]

Was Jesus the only one that had the name jesus back then?

not remotely. it was an EXTREMELY common name. Jesus and joshua is the same name. the transliteration "jesus" is from the greek which sounds like "E-A-sus". in hebrew, the name would be "ye-shu-A" and means "god saves". it would be as common a name as bob or something today.

oh, and his last name wasn't "christ" rather than last names, they were known as who their father was, i.e. "jesus, son of joseph", or where they came from "jesus of nazareth" which is where he grew up

[bobbygreenbear]

christianity and the roman cathlic church are 2 of the worst things to ever happen to this planet

think of how many have died (and are still dying) by them

do i have to mention that the vatican were the ones that were saying the sun relvolves around the earth...think of what could have been accomplished if galileos work wasnt banned

people have done atrocious and horrible things in the NAME of god. we all know that. because someone claims that god is on their side does not mean he is, in fact usually anyone claiming this would already be going down the wrong path.

i'm not really disagreeing though. you're right that horrible things have been done by the catholic church, and not just them, puritans burned witches for example. no excuse.

[bobbygreenbear]

y'all will have to forgive me for spewing out so much peace everybody and keep searching and keep making up your own minds.

[RichieRich]

jesus also appears in writings of Josephus (who was NOT a follower or believer)...

here is a question Bobby...

According to the Bible, those who do not believe in and accept Jesus as their Savior cannot go to heaven. God created a place for those (both angelic and human) who do not believe. This place is called "Hell" and is described as a place of complete seperation from God as well as utter torture and misery (fire and brimstone).

If God truly is love, then why did he create hell to add more misery to eternal seperation from HIMSELF? That seems to contradict who he says he is. What would God have to gain or prove from not only eternally seperating himself from them, but actually trying to add more to the misery of eternal seperation by adding other forms of misery???

understood that sin cannot be in a perfect place, so sinners cannot enter heaven... that is logical. why would he try to add more misery?!?!?!?! it isn't to teach the beings a lesson since there is no redemption after damnation. isn't eternal seperation enough without the extra torture???

or is the Bible inaccurate in its description of hell...?

Ok so I want to break this down a little bit...."According to the Bible, those who do not believe in and accept Jesus as their Savior cannot go to heaven."

I would disagree with this statement somewhat. According to Romans 1, God has clearly given people knowledge of himself through conscience and nature. And the wrath of God is revealed against godlessness and wickedness and people who have knowledge of God but choose not to follow and glorify him. I don't think that this means EVERYONE does this or has done this. (Resorting to total depravity and idolatry) I think people will be accountable to the amount of knowledge that they have available and what they do with that. For many who lived before Jesus and others who have never heard of Jesus this means nature, conscience, and the invisible qualities of God. Which leads me to my next point that is the doctrine of Rewards and punishments.

The bible clearly teaches that there are different rewards, crowns, and degrees of punishment for those who do right and wrong. Jesus clearly told people to store up treasure in heaven (Matt 6:20 Luke 18:22). Paul teaches that our works will be tested and will survive or be burned up. (1 Cor 3:14-15)
There are many other passages as well that teach the same thing.

The wages of all sin is death. That is a fact regardless (spirtual and physical). But the only way I can give an example of the degrees of heaven and hell would be a sliding scale. 1 to 10 (Heaven) and -1 to -10 (Hell). I would say that the lake of fire that was created for the devil and the angels that rebelled would be the -10 place (eternal agony and punishment). I would say that not accepting Jesus would put you in the camp of -1. And then what you did from there would determine what your degree of punishment would be and where you would land.

Maybe -1 is a paradise compared to earth. Maybe its just seperation from God and is full of sorrow. I don't think anyone knows. Maybe +1 is paradise beyond anything we can imagine.
I am reminded of that wonderful verse that says "no eye has seen, no ear has heard, no mind has conceived what God has prepared for those who love him."

Sorry this is so long...peace....:jointsmile: