atheism vs. agnostic

[halfassedjediknight]

I always wondered how people could be atheist. How can you be totally sure there are no gods if there is no proof?

I dont necessarilly believe in god, but I believe in the chance that there could be a god, I just have no proof. So I guess I define myself as agnostic.

Sorry if this is a repeated thread. Just thinking.

halfassedjediknight Reviewed by halfassedjediknight on 03-28-2007. atheism vs. agnostic I always wondered how people could be atheist. How can you be totally sure there are no gods if there is no proof? I dont necessarilly believe in god, but I believe in the chance that there could be a god, I just have no proof. So I guess I define myself as agnostic. Sorry if this is a repeated thread. Just thinking. Rating: 5

[suhl]

well the exact same way people can fully believe in god when there is no proof there is one id imagine. im with you though, i cant see how people can be completely sure in something one way or the other if the facts arent in and on that they arent and probably never will be

[halfassedjediknight]

i guess im just too logical for belief.

[mrdevious]

This is a common misconception about proper atheism, a total denial of god in existence or possibility. But I'll try to clear that up a bit. Anywhoo...

Atheism does not claim that god is definitively proven to not exist. Just as the existence of any being the mind can conjure up like the flying spagetti monster or invisible jellyfish, something non-existent can never be disproven since there is no supporting evidence capable of arising relating to something non-existent. Atheism merely states that there is no logical reason to believe in god, and until there actually is sufficient evidence pointing to it's existence, the belief in god has no more validity than any other imaginary being we can concieve of. Logically, you cannot say anything doesn't exist conclusively, since it may exist in some form somewhere in the universe.

[Polymirize]

This is a common misconception about proper atheism, a total denial of god in existence or possibility. But I'll try to clear that up a bit. Anywhoo...

Atheism does not claim that god is definitively proven to not exist. Just as the existence of any being the mind can conjure up like the flying spagetti monster or invisible jellyfish, something non-existent can never be disproven since there is no supporting evidence capable of arising relating to something non-existent. Atheism merely states that there is no logical reason to believe in god, and until there actually is sufficient evidence pointing to it's existence, the belief in god has no more validity than any other imaginary being we can concieve of. Logically, you cannot say anything doesn't exist conclusively, since it may exist in some form somewhere in the universe.

Oh so prim and proper Dev...

Come on now. I've yet to meet an atheist who didn't think absence of evidence wasn't equivalent to evidence of absence.

But most atheists tend to stop talking to me when I point out the similarities between their beliefs and those of practicing catholics.

Does atheism define the atheist? Or do the atheists define atheism?

[mrdevious]

Oh so prim and proper Dev...

Are you just convinced that my tendencies toward analytical explanations means I have no explorative philisophical side Polymerize? I wanted to explain atheism, so i did.

Come on now. I've yet to meet an atheist who didn't think absence of evidence wasn't equivalent to evidence of absence.

There are plenty of atheists who believe this indeed, which is why i specified proper atheism rather than the somewhat illogical brand you described above.

But most atheists tend to stop talking to me when I point out the similarities between their beliefs and those of practicing catholics.

If you mean in regard to a devoted belief in the existence or non-existence of god, the similarities are of course there. But please keep in mind that to be atheistic, sometimes just means a person (like myself) doesn't like to be theistic, but rather philisophical and constantly questioning and trying to understand. Am I to be inseparably percieved in the light cast by other atheists?

Does atheism define the atheist? Or do the atheists define atheism?

A little of both I suppose. Personally, I like to define the atheism. But my atheism primarily extends to a non-belief in dieties. That doesn't mean I reject everything not found in a school textbook.

[smoke it]

atheism isnt a beleif that there is nothing, it is a lack of beleif. agnostics, are searching for the religion which is right for them.

[halfassedjediknight]

agnostics, are searching for the religion which is right for them.

i dont think thats all too true. agnostics believe that there is no proof of higher powers to exist. i dont know how to say they are searching for a religion..id more say theyre searching for proof in order to believe in anything.

[Samwhore]

I feel that much of the A&A population is completely fake. Much of the A&A populations are people who are around 20 years and under, I complete agree with smoke it for the persons im describing above. Many are just people who think, oh, well, I dont like what 'God' stands for, therefore Ill choose not to belive in him. Well, that makes a few A&A's look bad, and add a fakeness to A&A.

[Breukelen advocaat]

Here is more from American Atheists, an organization that has been at the forefront of organized Atheism for many decades:

ATHEISM

Atheism is a doctrine that states that nothing exists but natural phenomena (matter), that thought is a property or function of matter, and that death irreversibly and totally terminates individual organic units. This definition means that there are no forces, phenomena, or entities which exist outside of or apart from physical nature, or which transcend nature, or are â??superâ?� natural, nor can there be. Humankind is on its own.

The following definition of Atheism was given to the Supreme Court of the United States in the case of Murray v. Curlett, 374 U.S. 203, 83 S. Ct. 1560, 10 L.Ed.2d (MD, 1963), to remove reverential Bible reading and oral unison recitation of the Lord's Prayer in the public schools.

â??Your petitioners are Atheists and they define their beliefs as follows. An Atheist loves his fellow man instead of god. An Atheist believes that heaven is something for which we should work now â?? here on earth for all men together to enjoy.

An Atheist believes that he can get no help through prayer but that he must find in himself the inner conviction, and strength to meet life, to grapple with it, to subdue it and enjoy it.

An Atheist believes that only in a knowledge of himself and a knowledge of his fellow man can he find the understanding that will help to a life of fulfillment.

He seeks to know himself and his fellow man rather than to know a god. An Atheist believes that a hospital should be built instead of a church. An Atheist believes that a deed must be done instead of a prayer said. An Atheist strives for involvement in life and not escape into death. He wants disease conquered, poverty vanquished, war eliminated. He wants man to understand and love man.

He wants an ethical way of life. He believes that we cannot rely on a god or channel action into prayer nor hope for an end of troubles in a hereafter.

He believes that we are our brother's keepers; and are keepers of our own lives; that we are responsible persons and the job is here and the time is now.â?�

American Atheists