Weird Outlook On Death

What do you think happends when you die, Ive had two things goin on about this when I was high a few days ago.

1st one. When you die that just it, your done, you lie in rest, you do nothing, no afterlife, no heaven, nothing, just finished.

2nd one. When you die all that there is to do is think about how you lived you life and thats why you be nice to people so that when you look back on it you can feel good.

Now these seem pretty simple, but Im high right now so I can really elaborate but they sound like pretty solid ideas. But they give a crap view of whan the end is like, but its been buggin me for a while so I thought Id post these ideas. And it feels weird for me to be thinking about these ecpecially the first cuz I want there to be something great after death, but then I also feel like just the end could be good, like justbeing done, nothing more to do. Its really weird.

I know how you feel man. I've been thinking about things like this lately, got kind of weird, so i stoped smoking.

some think that there is nothing....
some think that there is more that just mortal life

you cant really know these things but rest assured that all your mortal fears will vanish so no need to worry...unless you fear nothingness...

but then you must figure out if nothingness exist to fear it and like many things it as not been proven

maybe for those who fear there is nothing after death maybe the words of a known physician, Lavoisier, will secure you... in the material world nothing is created thus nothing is ever lost also

that's what i believe...you die, you rot but a form of energy remains and that energy maybe carries something that we just dont know yet...infinitaly small yet there...maybe there is just change is the world

bah I wont go to far cause I'll lose myself in my ideas like we all do when we speak of such

For some of us... we might go and toke up with spirits after we leave our physical bodies behind when we die.
It's just your spirit leaving the physical shell behind. That way it can go into the next stage of existance. Then the spirit may be able to prepare itself for the next body that it may enter; before the body of the boy, or girl comes out of his, or her mother's womb.
The spirit may do other things way before its time to experience another human life, or "learn" things here on earth.

Maybe this is the spritiual word. Or maybe this is just a stepping stone to the spiritual word. This shit is fucking weird.

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Originally Posted by BestTonicIsChronic

Maybe this is the spritiual word. Or maybe this is just a stepping stone to the spiritual word. This shit is fucking weird.

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In a way this place is kind of like a stepping stone, but this place is more of a training ground than anything else. Yes... it sounds weard at first, but when you get in deeper into these kinds of matters, this might make sense. I'm just beginning to understand this stuff myself. When you study occultism, magic, witchcraft, and other supernatural things, including the matters of the spirit world, you might look at things differantly. I've tried to walk the traditional paths, but none of them wern't for me at all. I figured that I might as well cut my own path to walk on, but anyways, shit... I'm just stoned and spoutin stuff off right now.
:stoned:
:rasta:
:smokin:
:confused:

There may be something after death, there may be nothing, I don't know. But think of it this way; A forest is a forrest, and a thousand years later we'll still call it the same forest, even though non of the original trees inhabit it. But the forest continues to exist, and the trees don't care, because they have no ego. The ego will make you believe, whether you know it intellectually or not, that your existence is the only existence. When the only means of percieving the world is through your own eyes, it is impossible to percieve existence when you are dead, and the mind cannot therfore comprehend existence continueing on when your own brain doesn't see it. The illusion of self is what truely frightens us.

But nowing that all this shit is just a stepping stone really puts you in your place and makes you feel like shit. Like what the hell are you accomplishing. Like you go to school get a good job and for what, so you can have it all reeped away when you die, like I new in the first place but now it means that EVERYTHING means nothing.

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Originally Posted by BestTonicIsChronic

But nowing that all this shit is just a stepping stone really puts you in your place and makes you feel like shit. Like what the hell are you accomplishing. Like you go to school get a good job and for what, so you can have it all reeped away when you die, like I new in the first place but now it means that EVERYTHING means nothing.

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Perhapse we all stick too much importance on "meaning" and what it means. Seek a harmony with the world and realize you are part of the whole of existence, and the parts are not so clearly separate or together, they simply are. We all put too much importance on what we think of as MY existence.

I think that on a "personal self" level death probably is the end - like you said a deep sleep of nothingness - much in the same way we have no consciousness of existence before we were born......
but on an atomic level we are recycled - or reincarnated if you like - simply put the atoms that form me or you will one day be part of other bodies and other lives.....whether or not that constitutes a continued consciousness i dont know - i guess it depends if consciousness exists at an atomic level......

its kinda a headtrip but if you ever get the chance to read Bill Bryson's "A history of everything" he outlines scientific opinion on the matter.....its reckoned that if you choose any person from history (at least a couple of hundred of years back to allow the atoms to get through the ecosytem) then you will share some atoms with them - whether that's Jesus or Atilla the Hun....so basically humanity is a shared experience linked by our atoms....which i find a kinda reassuring idea
:) :) :)

i just love discussing religion with stoner,s...it can get pretty intence, and tecnical...there r million,s of belief,s out here...
i just really believe in Heaven and hell...i believe it is all hate, pain and sorrow in hell...and believe Heaven 2 be loveing and, and sireen, with no pain, or sorrow
but 2 b able 2 feel pain , or love, u have 2 have some kind of awareness...

i think that we live on as what we where...all of our actions, ideas, and impacts on others will create a never-ending wave...

if we curse at a man on the street, he may ho home and hit his son, which would make him depressed. and then he grows up, and his children always wonder why he is in an odd state...their wondering turns them into workers of the human perception, and they develope a new way of looking at things...which is viewed by the future humanity

Hey puffpuff so in your idea is like an opiate high. Cuz fuck that would be pretty kool or like an everlasting E high.

i believe in heaven and in hell. i believe this life is just a test.

short and simple.

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Originally Posted by Freedumb

I know how you feel man. I've been thinking about things like this lately, got kind of weird, so i stoped smoking.

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Don't do that! Keep smoking and sort it out!
That's what smoking should be for, questioning yourself and figuring things like this out.

Everybody keep smoking and thinking about death! In order to do it, you have to concentrate on what your body's like NOW, how dependent you are on all the inner processes that go on, and how you really don't control any of it. Once that stuff shuts down on you...

Each moment is a separate form of existence for you, it's just that your mind continually produces the illusion of a continuous self. But the difference between the moment before & the moment after death, is the same as the difference between this moment and the next one.

Ya Ive been gettin alot of those thoughts thinkin about death, and life and shit that goes on, real philisophical, but Ive cut down on the weed consumption and they go away. Like it was getting weird cuz it would all happen when Im sober. Maybe people like that shit, I say what ever floats your boat, but I dont like it. Im only 16, I shouldnt be thinking that hard bout life, death and the shit that happends. Hell I only really like weed cuz it makes everything so fucking funny and its socialable, plus music sounds pretty sweet too.

Well, I dont believe in God but I do believe that we all have a soul and I believe that when we die we become enlightened to the true nature of the universe and we spend eternity watching all of life and the universe unfold before this because in knowing the truth there is true bliss. I also believe in reincarnation (sort of) in that our souls live on in others because when we die its almost like we spread across all of creation.

I'm Catholic and I believe that Jesus lived and God exists but I just generally believe that if you're just a nice person and treat people nice and do the right thing then you're safe. So I think if you live a good life and just treat people nicely and aren't a fucking asshole then you'll just go to heaven...so I guess that's what I believe happens when you die; you go to heaven.

See thought my only prob with being nice and treating people right is, people will walk all over you, its fucking bullshit. So you cant be too nice you gotta be sarcastic and act like a dick everyonce in a while.

No way man, you just THINK people will walk all over you. I know the feeling of course, it's hard being nice. But when you really do it all the time people are pretty much shocked at your trustworthiness and respond with their own kindness. Maybe it depends who you hang out with though.

To each his own, but I have found being sincere and kind all the time to be a personality that works out for me. (So it's not like it's impossible). People find it disarming, and I think they're pretty grateful for it. They're like "oh wait... you mean we can actually be honest and up front for once?"

Even on forums like this, where lotsa people are sarcastic and mean, I try to be that way, and it works out just fine. People always appreciate it and if they don't that's their problem--it just means they're the kind of person who would judge you no matter what you're like, and they probably have their own issues that they're just hiding by being mean or something.

What people don't realize about choosing to be kind is that, once you really give it a try, I mean REALLY care about people, you feel soooo much better about your life. Even though it SEEMS like you're going to lose something or whatever, you're just fooling yourself. Making others truly happy = Making yourself truly happy

see, I have a more cynical outlook on people. I believe that people are innately evil, but the face that we all have a soul is what can make us good. If we had no souls, we would have no need to show anyone compassion, even when that compassion could jepordize our own survival. Without souls, we would just be surviving.

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Originally Posted by fikusroot

If we had no souls, we would have no need to show anyone compassion

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Why would having a soul produce the need to show compassion to others anyway? I don't believe in souls, and I don't think the impulse towards compassion has to come from anything external, like some God telling us what to do or what's right. It's just that our happiness is not self-contained, it is more of a communal thing that spreads by way of giving rather than taking. We don't have to see people as being in a state of competition with each other, because a state of collaboration and sharing is more advantageous to everyone, in this life here on earth, regardless of any afterlife you might believe in.

We ARE "just surviving," but it so happens that our survival as individuals is dependent on others, and really everything else in the universe, because we are not separate. Compassion does not have to jeopardize our survival, but rather helps our life to flourish.

It might be easy to think people are innately evil, depending on what your experience in life has been. But once you pay attention to your experience of different types of people, you realize that selfish and "evil" behavior is just a misguided expression of good impulses that have gotten confused. Secretly, everyone just wants what is good, except they may not have realized what is truly good yet. Which is to see how much we're all suffering, and to care for that suffering and admit how we are all the same, which can lead to an open and beneficial situation for everyone.

I agree with much of that however what do you think that thing is. that thing that causes us to compromise our own survival for the good of the community. The thing that you describe as "good impulses" that undermines our own survival for the good of mankind is a soul and the reason we have it is because we are all connected as one though the simple fact that we are humans. This is what makes us different from animals.

This life is a test for godto have the right to Bleep out a (soul,mind, thoughtprocess) Being Satan. I belive after this test or Court case is finished armagedon will come and well have the 1000 years of peace on earth while all the ones who died in the ages will be resurected. During this time will be able to focus on and do things naturaly bringing the whole earth to be a paradice state like we were intended to live in. Satan is there re relised to test the one who didn't go throu Armagedon and all thoses who follow him will be permaniuntly distroyed BECAUSE this shitty test were going throu now would prove Satan can't rule right and yes he was giveing free will and choice to choose a path of GREED and that just causes chaos. .......after that we live forever on earth pardice perma high SIGN ME UP....




Think of this how fair and just would GOD be if just because you were born poor and dad was a ganster and thats the only life you knew, you killed hella people and were GREEDY? No this has to be some test for something GRATER than US and once it's over well all get a perfect chance to get to know god and learn what he REALLY has intended for us. he CREATED the earth for us to live on ,this BULLSHIT we see today is just Satan chanlangeing his Right and so God Said ok you think you can rule better do it and satan GREED has caused this:smokin: Because if he just zaped his ass way back then how many would belive that satan might of had a point? SO THE TEST IS NEEDED:smokin: He made weed for us and if we just consumed 100% pur delta9 it does us no harm sounds like high is part of the plain to:smokin:

God was invented by people scared of truth
"If God did not exist, man would be forced to create him."

lol.

But good impulses do not undermine our own survival most of the time. And even when it seems that they do, even if you use the example of sacrificing your life for others, it's really because your life is not in any way shape or form separate from the life of others or the "community" as you put it. So really by "compromising" ourselves we are doing no such thing: we are simply preserving the larger Life that we already were before we were born, and will continue to be after we die. It's not even so much that we are "connected" as that we are already completely the same thing, we just use the word connected because we seem separate for the time being.

Nothing makes us different from animals. They are the same larger community of our fellow beings towards which we direct our compassion, and their life is ours as well. When your life is already the life of the whole universe, you don't need any explanation as to why you would help preserve that larger life, without "compromising" anything at all.

haha, never been in an ongoing debate like this before, it's been a while since I've seen one on here.

That would make logical sense, however there is too much evidence out the to support the "divine spark" that I believe is inside all men. You say we are connected simply by the laws of nature, which I do believe however I believe it to be more than that. We are all connceted (and yes, in a large since we are connected) by a need to survive but individually I believe we posess inside of us, something illogical, that cant be described by the laws of nature.

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Originally Posted by Trichocereus Panza

lol.

But good impulses do not undermine our own survival most of the time. And even when it seems that they do, even if you use the example of sacrificing your life for others, it's really because your life is not in any way shape or form separate from the life of others or the "community" as you put it. So really by "compromising" ourselves we are doing no such thing: we are simply preserving the larger Life that we already were before we were born, and will continue to be after we die. It's not even so much that we are "connected" as that we are already completely the same thing, we just use the word connected because we seem separate for the time being.

Nothing makes us different from animals. They are the same larger community of our fellow beings towards which we direct our compassion, and their life is ours as well. When your life is already the life of the whole universe, you don't need any explanation as to why you would help preserve that larger life, without "compromising" anything at all.

haha, never been in an ongoing debate like this before, it's been a while since I've seen one on here.

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In this case we are all but dust and no person life amounted to anything because if they didn't do it someone else would..... I chose to not think all but is for nothing and everyone is but a spec.... I also do not belive we were created to end up a angle why would he make angles and then make the earth for it to produce more angles? we are a new creation from the angles we are to live forever in our own exsistance. I belive this is all but a test for god to Rightfully Undisputed be able to permanutly kill satan. If he did it back when he 1st rebled instead of let him show hes idea that we don't need god to exsist and we should run our self is obiously being Proven Wrong right now once Satan is proven 100% wrong he can than be killed forever and no one would think he might or could of had a point. THIS UNIVERSAL COURT CASE is a better idea to me than our lives all but being the same as a animal and we are here due to some random crazy life that has no meaning what so ever and there nothing controling the huge expance that it's all Random and nothing has pourpos and when we as humans Distroy the EARTH we could possable wipeing out all forms of exsistance in the universe? But no one can Claim To KNOW one side or the Other were all Guessing.....

I am not really sure what the divine spark is, but the illogical aspect of humans you speak of sounds like it is influenced by Kierkegaard. I agree that we are not completely logical animals, it is only the brute processes that occur under the surface that support our illusion of "conscious mind" as something separate from matter. Who authorizes logic anyway? Does it authorize itself? No. You can only use logic to argue a point if everyone agrees that it is valid. If one person does not agree, there is nothing you can say to him. And it seems as though we agree that logic does not lead to truth, but only to itself; it doesn't lead anywhere; it's just playing with words. We play with words because we choose to, like a game. But if you don't play then there's no problem, everything is still the same.

And yet here we are arguing our points as if logic means something. It's nearly impossible to form an argument without implicitly using logic and accepting it as valid (although Krogith comes pretty close with his rambling...)

We forget that we eventually have to dispense with the need for words and just LIVE, and of course when that happens my life is the same as your life despite the way we conceptualize it differently.

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Originally Posted by Krogith

no one can Claim To KNOW one side or the Other were all Guessing.....

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ah but what we all know is that there IS some truth that none of us know:rasta:

The wisest thing anyone can tell you is just to trust reality to be what it is, without worrying too much about whether you "know" the truth about it.... Actually, all you ever experience is reality, which is yourself: the reality of your own thoughts, sensations, and whatever part of the world you live in, even when it turns out you were "in error" about something that was still just the reality of yourself. We all experience this reality and we all have different words for it but they mean the same thing:rasta:

When people were wild I doubt they shared and did shit like that with strangers and be nice to one another. Like maybe for their family and then screw anyone else who gets in your way.

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Originally Posted by Trichocereus Panza

ah but what we all know is that there IS some truth that none of us know:rasta:
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Typical stoner logic right there. All that really matters is that you believe in something, that inspires you to better your life and the life of others. AS for the divine spark, I cant remember where I read about it but I know its about mans creativity and the fact that within us we all have a creative potential is evidence of something divine. A divine spark of inspiration.

I prefer the scientific outlook of death.

If we are filled with energy (soul/spirit = energy, or whatever), and energy cannot be destroyed, then we obviously go on somehow - just in a very indirect way.

I completely agree with that except why call it indirect?

Nothing is born and nothing dies. It's 100% just as direct as any other physical process in the universe, the only reason to call it that would be because "we" don't experience it directly as individual beings. But that is misleading also--every physical part of our body experiences it on its OWN level, which is really the way we experience consciousness NOW, except we don't realize it cause we think of ourselves as "one" whole organism. The difference between death and life is meaningless for our energy on the subatomic level.

I also don't agree that there can be a "scientific" outlook on death because no one can experientially describe what it was like as a human being. Since science is empirical, and death is a private phenomenon which is most relevant to us each as individuals, there is no scientific outlook without an empirical description from the inside, which is impossible because subatomic energy by itself does not give "descriptions" of its experience anymore.

Ironically, perhaps the closest to a scientific viewpoint we have on this is the near-death experience, the DMT experience, or the experience of passing through the bardos as described by the practice of "conscious dying" and coming back again by Eastern yogis.

Yet most people who credit themselves as "scientists" discredit these experiences for their "metaphysical" connotations. What they don't realize is that everything is one thing, and nothing requires metaphysical explanation, no matter how unusual it seems to our current paradigm.

Interesting topic...

Reminds me of the books written by this stoner philosopher:
http://www.lulu.com/newport

I've been through many different beliefs and have peacefully settled with believing nothing while helplessly hoping this is just a dream of sorts.

I believe that we become non-existant, and become reborn. Being non-existant is nothing new to us..just think of what the feeling was like before you was born..you didn't even exist right? You was basically 'dead' in a sense. I believe life has a cycle of rebirth because you gain your conciousness in the form of another human being..or an animal..but you won't remember what happened unless you're hypnotized. Some people get hypnotized and regain memory under hypnosis of their past lives..so personally I think that's exactly what we'll go through. Our SPIRITS, the energy that compells us, it doesn't just die off and become non-existant, but goes through rebirth and lives once again.

Those are pretty simple views.

Think about if a person who died though about life.

And was like.

1) When you incarnate, you don't remember anything about this world you just are, you're incarnate, and that's the only think you can know or remember.

2) You're just a rock, and that's what happens, you don't know anything, you don't think anythink, you don't even feel, other times you can be dirt, or sand.

where were we before we were born into the 3rd dimension? Da doc says sperm and egg?

suppose before we were born we asked the same questions, 'i wonder what it is like to be alive', and now we ask, 'i wonder what its like to be dead',.. then when we are dead we wonder what its like to be a fkin star or planet or some odd shit that we don't yet know exists until we die.

Me not affraid to die, just affraid to live until death.

I recently stopped being afraid to die. I dont think it matters much. When your dead...it's out of your hands.