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I ordered a 150 watt hps floralux light system used off some guy on ebay and payed using paypal. Well ten minutes later I read the artice about paypal being narks to the police. Am I gonna get raided or something? Is it really that tight of security? I didn't think it would be that big of a deal seeing that he was a personal seller. I'm kind of freakin out. Should I be worried?
doubtful; there are way too many transactions to be concerned about. if you're doing it on a regular basis, or there is additional suspicious activity, paypal is likely to take a closely look at your account.
in the future, though, i would personally avoid using paypal to buy growing goods. at this point, though, don't worry and good luck!
dude, the last thing anybody is interested in is a single 150watt hps light. as for paypal being narcs, thats bs. the one thing that would kill ebay and paypals business is if people did not trust the service they provide. leo has way to many problems chasing meth labs and cocaine dealers to worry about a very small grow. i've ordered all kinds of stuff off ebay, try not to send the stuff to where you are growing. :rasta:
Ebay / PayPal (and also AOL) actively works with law enforcement; go out of their way to report people.
With that said, Ebay / PayPal (it's the same company) likely is not even going to notice the sale of one or even 10 lights, but definitely avoid using them in the future whenever possible - sometimes one has to chance it, but best to minimize transactions through them.
Ron
Mr. Bennett how do you know this? Please share the info you have, if able. I was wondering what the guidelines they use to report or is it that their just turning over records. I know that AOL has been letting the FBI into their records but was not aware that Paypal/Ebay was also doing it. It was my understanding that the FBI's carnivore program was no longer being used.
See this news link below...
http://www.thenation.com/doc/20030707/engle
In that article is the following paragraph ...
In the fall of 2001 a Stanford-educated Pakistani scientist, a permanent resident of the United States, was visited at his home in the Bay Area by the FBI, who asked about several books he'd recently purchased on eBay. The man's lawyer said the FBI agent reported having been alerted by eBay. eBay denied having provided the information to the FBI, and the bureau refused to comment.
Note that according to that account, Ebay alerted the FBI not the other way around. In essance Ebay is acting as a quasi-law enforcement agency, as the above article explains.
I wasn't able to find them, but I recall seeing some press releases by Ebay / PayPal in which they tout how they go out of their way to assist law enforcement.
If still not convinced ... read Ebay's privacy policy, terms of use, etc ... just the length alone should make one cringe ... last I read, their agreements all together is something of upwards of 40,000 words! Note the various links in their agreement pointing to other agreements ... clicking all around is an oddssey in and of itself ... set aside a decent part of a day to read through all it.
Often the longer a terms of use / privacy policy is, the more tilted it is towards the company; less rights / less privacy for the user.
Ron
I have believed that Ebay/Paypal were helping law enforcement for awhile. I was just wanted to to see something in writing. The thing with the Pakistani sounds like the FBI's carnivore program, which was have to ended last year, but I doubt that. I agree with your thoughts about Ebay policies, I have gotten the run around from Ebay/Paypal officials, they will not answer your questions. So I tend to stay away from doing business there.
After reading The Nation link, I think I will stop all activity with Ebay/Paypal. Welcome to 1984.
OH ****! I ordered some BZP off of paypal (to the U.S., which is illegal) will I get caught?
Bump....
Of course, Ebay doesnt want its service to be used for Illegal ActivitiesQuote:
Originally Posted by Ron Bennett
Then why have so many people selling massive amounts of hydroponic stuff there?? I mean seriously, I was clicking around and there were auctions where people had bought ten x 1000 watt lights in one shot and another that ordered a kit, light, mylar, and a few other things along with a book titled "How to grow MJ in your own home"
Sound stupid? I thought it was all BS so I ordered 90% of my grow room off of ebay and now my account keeps getting locked up and I am getting errors I havent had with e-bay for the years I have been dealing with them. I just ordered about 10 different packs of flowering and vegitable seeds (at .39 a pack) to maybe dissuade the third reich from showing up at my door.
Dont let the "priivate listing" or "identity private" or "private" anything thing fool you either.. thats a bunch of B.S. too.
Oh and another tip.. if you go to a hydroponics shop be ready to talk about that tomato plant you are growing and the bell peppers you want to get started.. seriously, the guy in the shop started into me with twenty questions and I know I failed.. I could tell he was questioning me and he acted different after. I was pretty rattled and by the time I left the store with the goodies I forgot which freakn car I drove to the shop (not mine of course) and was walking around the parkinglot aimlessly looking for a car i recognized. It was not a smooth day for me :(
When I go into the store, they ALWAYS love to try and chat me up. I finally found the best way to avoid all talking with the sales people without being rude.
Be on your cell phone :D Call your girlfriend, best friend whatever and now it will be rude of "them" to try and have a conversation with ya.
"Yeah can I get 2 bottles of GH bloom? Thanks. :cocks head a bit: What babe? Oh yeah, that stacy girl is fricken annoying.... blah blah blah.
glad it wasnt just me!
Im telling you.. I must have sounded like a moron.. He was like.. "whatcha growin" and I was COMPLETELY off guard.. I thought it was gunna be dont ask dont tell like a headshop.. haha.. WRONG..
I was like "uhh.... tomatoes" and he was like "what kinds?" and I dont know freakn anything about tomatoes.. so Im like "big ones.." and "you know the red kind"
oh yea and he stood at the door watching me walk aimlessly around the parking lot looking at the cars trying to remember which one i drove up in while carrying a 50l bag of hygrodon, gallons of nutes, and enough rockwool to replant a forrest.
Soooooo not a slick day for me :)
well locnar, got busted and the cops told him paypal confirmed his buying hydro equipment...put that in your pipe and smoke it! peace
locnar didnt play his cards right with the cops either.. not tryin to be an asshole but.. if cops dont have a warrent they dont come in the house.. PERIOD.. thats the rules and dont let them brake the rules.. remember that they exist because you.. the american citizen.. allow them to! You want them to.. because most of the cops most of the time are out there doing good things and messing with bad people.. unfortunantly sometimes they develope the mindset that allows them to treat us like bad people.. but we arent (most of us anyways.. haha), so just take it with a grain of salt but stay true to the bill of rights.. because they are right.. and you are right.. and the second ammendment is right.. hahaha.. Ok I will stop..
The moral of the story is C.Y.A. and be ready for anything.. walk thru conversations and actions with cops before they happen.. use the internet to find out what your powers are.. and expecially check for dialoge that is predetermined for use by lawyers.. it is out there.. look for it.. how to answer a cop type of Q&A from a legal standpoint.. PRACTICE.. and be ready to respectfully refuse the police when you have the legal right to do so.. they WILL TELL YOU THAT YOU DONT>>> Dont listen to the cops.. listen to lawyers, and know how its going to play out in advance.
I know what the conversation will be like if a cop shows up without a warrent, I know what the conversation will go like if he does have a warrent.. I know what my local laws are and I know what I can and cannot be held liable for.. Do you????
We all know loc, fucked up by not telling them to hit the road, but that is in the past...he already opened the door.
you're not an asshole for pointing that out, i am just a close friend and i don't see any reason to stress him anymore, thinking about water under the bridge...If he were just another guy posting here...I would've already posted a statement similar to yours...peace.
You would think, with all the law and order shows...3 CSI shows...people would learn that cops are allowed to lie...outright, if it allows them to confirm their suspicions.
the reason loc, didn't react correctly and wasn't prepared, possibly...Is the fact that he is not a criminal. just another in a long line of people persecuted for his needs of medical marijuana. Locnar is a legitimate candidate for MMJ...peace
Unfortunately, your friend loc is a criminal now. Its sad to see our legal justice used to make non-criminal types into basicly, criminals. I hope your friend is prepard for what is happening. If he pleds or is found guilty his life got tougher, not impossible just way harder, I wish him luck. My partner came home, late at night after a week stay elsewhere, when first thing in the morning the popos come knocking on his door. He was told that "someone" called in a report of a weird smell, like drugs, and a yellow cloud coming from his house. He did not have any drugs on him or in the house and his roommates had been told not to bring that sort of stuff into his house, so when asked if the popos could search, he consented.Everyone knows that Williamson vs. U.S. set president in which a landlord cannot give the popos the right to seach tenants private areas. Well they found several grams of a white power identified as cocaine in the absent roommates room. My partner was arrested and eventually pled to attempted poss. for sale, just pay court cost and summary probation with suspended sentence of three years doc. My freind is an idiot to pled but his public pretender was to overworked to want to take this to trial. My freind is now finding out how hard it is to get a decent job with a felony record. The moral is to fight everything and never agree to anything the popos want to do, infact dont even open the door, if you have to say something and I mean really have to say something say it through the closed door.
Im sorry it was United States v Whitfield, 939 F.2d 1071 (D.C. Cir. 1991) not wiliiamson vs. U.S.
Good info motor222.. and i did not know about US v Whitfield.. thats a GREAT little decision of the courts..
and you are another fan of the "dont open the freakn door" policy! I try to tell people this is the way to play their cards.. if the police have a warrent they will kindly break the door down anyways.. so just dont open the door people! If you really want to talk to the cops go down to the station in a couple hours and say when you came home your neighbors said there were cops at the door and you want to know what it was all about.. thats my plan.. of course I know how to talk to cops.. id just rather do it at the station where they cant say they smell pot.. besides.. at your door they are in their element and you are weak.. when you go to the station and ask why they were beating on your door pissing off your terrified girlfriend who was hiding in a closet who thought someone was trying to beat the door down and rape her (that works if it was obvious there were ppl in the house when they came but you didnt open the door).. it takes them WAY out of their element.. they are NOT expecting you to come visit them.. you can discuss whatever you bought on ebay or why some other pot head put your name on a long list they turned in to try and save their ass.. And please please please do something good for society like volunteer for comunity clean ups and stuff like that.. you get face to face time with cops there and you are doing good stuff for your community.. you build confidence in your ability to play it cool and you will lose your fear of cops.. so when anything goes down you show up at the station and ask whats up guys?? can I help you?
But not at the front door... or any door.. if there is a door between you and the police who want to talk to you dont open it EVER.. if they have a warrent.. they will open the door with a battering ram.. if they dont.. its all up to you.. I would not even open the door if they SAY they have a warrent.. they are probably lying.. if they have a warrent for drug related charges they will be in swat gear and break your door down.. If they are knocking.. forget about um.
oh and here is a clue... if they have a warrent they will almost always be at the door with a battering ram.. they are not stupid.. they know if they knock you will be flushing your stash.. they may knock once but then.. so LOOK FOR A BATTERING RAM... no ram.. no warrent.