*Low-Budget ScrOG Log*

Hi,

Second grow, Screen of Green attempt it is. New cabinet, and it's a bit too big. Dimensions are depth: 1.5m width: 1.3m height: a stunning 2m (-50 cm space underneath) (Unable to photograph the entire closet yet, because of space restrictions. Will do later. I'm only growing 4 plants, because i want to keep it simple.
Of course, anyone that has or experience with ScrOG or LST is very welcome to adjust my current plan; here it is.

• same lighting set-up as last time, 1 400wHPS lamp with very effective reflection shield. (cabinet painted white, so no need for reflection foil)

• 1 25 cm fan to cool the lamp, and to provide the cabinet with an upper airflow

• planning on buying an exhaust fan. could someone fill me in on that one? i want a reasonable intake/exhaust balance. until now, regular ventilation has done the job for me, with sessions of fanning inbetween.

• 4 clones - white widow - good shape, 1.5 weeks pre-veg in humidity 'dome', which consisted of seethrough plastic with holes in it, primitive, but effective, exactly how I like 'em!

• same soil as last time, Plagron Growmix with perlite, which was perfect for my first grow

• the screen itself is 90 cmX 80cm (2.95ft x 2.62ft), holes are 4 inches wide approx, outer ones are not so wide, to bend the branches, in order to fill the screen

• the clones are on 18-6, goin' easy on the ol' electr. bill

• for feeding, I've done a bit more researching. Started off using the Plagron suggested doses (little less) but now I'm creating custom feeding for the clones. I was able to mess around a lot, and the results of those exps. were easy to notice.
  -custom guano mix/flower fert for pre-soil-feeding (soaked for three days, also thanks to RastaKaze for his extensive Bat-Shit speeches ;))
  -for vegging: start-up, combined with root-stimulator and extra N
  -pH value- 6.2/6.3 with no possibility of over/under pH values (i'm buying the water now, the tap water CAN'T be trusted here :mad: made me lose two plants)
  -for flowering: I think I'm gonna boost them a bit more. will look into the best ferts later

• and yeah you're allowed to LYAO (laugh your ass off) at my CHEAP solutions to all my problems.. (the screen = painting frame with wire & duck tape, screen support = polystyrene + broken ashtray for weight... lamp suspension = old duffelbag belt (hahahah yah..)

So i'm gonna flower quick. But not too quick. I don't wanna make the mistake to flower too soon/late. So when I arrive at that stage, could you inform me to switch to 12-12?

The Question Section :D
-Considering the internodes & nodes of the plant, which ones are bent best?
-The lower branches, underneath the screen, when should they be removed? I saw some pics where there was absolutely no leafage under the screen? :confused: looked a bit like a handicapped plant. Should I do this too? And if so, when?
-the lamp is currently about 30 inches above the plants. I hang the lamp higher every two days, but not too much, I want low grow, no reaching for the sun like sunflowers.
Is it smart to not adjust lamp height in order to grow low or what do you guys suggest? A total elevation (veg to flower) of about ten inches?

Oh i'm sorry if it was too much to read ;) I'll be updating a bit more often, since it's always nice to see a Sea expanding. SOG logs are usually visually compelling, so I'll try to post nice progression pics.
Also, the cabinet is not located in my home. It's hovering in mid-air above some rural road and is completely imaginative. The pictures included are also mere projections of my own illegal thoughts, very accurately, manually drawn with an antique chinese ink needle, scanned for the purpose of boasting.

See you soon ;)
and love thy neighbour and such :thumbsup:

Looks nice!:)


On pic. two, is the HPS that far up?? I think you could lower it a few inches!:)


Best of wishes, and good luck!:)

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Originally Posted by Powder Puff

Looks nice!:)


On pic. two, is the HPS that far up?? I think you could lower it a few inches!:)


Best of wishes, and good luck!:)

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cheers, and normally the light is about 30 inches above the plants, I've read that that is the suggested distance for 400ws (like 20 inches for a 250w)

na, you dont need it 30 inches away from the plants. i had my 250 about 6 inches away with a heat shield. if you have good ventilation. i would bring that down to 12 inches. to measure if its too hot, put you hand on top of your plants, make sure that it isn't uncomfortable an put the light a couple of inches above that

I have a 400W, and it's about 12" as well.. lol.. No fan!!:p:D

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Originally Posted by amstron

na, you dont need it 30 inches away from the plants. i had my 250 about 6 inches away with a heat shield. if you have good ventilation. i would bring that down to 12 inches. to measure if its too hot, put you hand on top of your plants, make sure that it isn't uncomfortable an put the light a couple of inches above that

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thx (u 2 PP)

I'm gonna lower the lights yeah i've searched some more. I thought they'd burn up if the light was that close but that might have been a little paranoid. lol :thumbsup:
now this is what i wish to achieve (pic)

And i'm going to make the holes in the screen a little smaller, so the screen can support more weight.

MMMMMM that looks good this will be interesting.... Yeah my 400w hps is about 4 or 5 inches away from the plants cause I want enough light not only hit the top of the canopy hard but also the bottom..... I do use mylar as well tho but you know what they say the more light the better, I would invest in 1000w but I dont want the elec.bill to get any higher or worry about them ever finding out:o

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Originally Posted by BukDatAss

MMMMMM that looks good this will be interesting.... Yeah my 400w hps is about 4 or 5 inches away from the plants cause I want enough light not only hit the top of the canopy hard but also the bottom..... I do use mylar as well tho but you know what they say the more light the better, I would invest in 1000w but I dont want the elec.bill to get any higher or worry about them ever finding out:o

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So I've lowered the 400 hps... The temperature stayed the same, and it wasn't too much of a shock, i planned on gradually lowering the light 1 inch per day.

But... Dear fellow growers i've got a huge issue here... Droopage.. I've posted a thread in plant problems too, to maybe get some specific help.

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Plant droopage all around on my ScrOG....... Don't know why (by a LONG shot) because NONE of the environmental 'statistics' were changed, same water, same amount of light, same humidity, same temperatures for sure... same pH, EC and nutrients....

purple branches VERY droopy leaves and apparently NOTHING helps... i'm scared of losing three, because one of them isn't damaged at all.

any suggestions or experience with this WEIRD stuff? because it blows my mind how they can deteriorate like that... i'm not happy and very concerned

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Let's hope this doesn't turn out horrible, I managed to save a plant before but this one... blows my mind :(

WooW and its not Watering? Hmmm cant be much help sorry:o :(

repot that plant with perlite/ soil mix
looks like its overwatered.
remove the plants from the pots and smell the dirt.

It could also be under watering..

I'm not sure. . . How much/often do you water?

it looks like overwatering ,with underwatering the leaves start to dry out begining at the tips and i dont see that when did this occur morning or night , time, and how long after watering did it occur harvesthetic im on my way setting up a scrog so keep the thread updated as im following wth great intrest and any info you got would be of great help and very pro mate keep it up,and as freind owl said i woul repot with a better draining soil mix best off luck mate i will pray to nebula the god of all mary jane plants and ask her to spread a little love your way ,lol best of luck mate and keep it up

this may help mate



If disease is a possibility, check the following general guidelines for identifying the different causes of disease:
A fungal pathogen often causes round leaf spots, stem rots with a dry/papery texture, concentric rings, discoloration, or wilt. Fruiting structures (sometimes microscopic) may form on affected tissue.

A bacterial disease can take the form of galls (swollen areas), irregularly shaped leaf spots, wilting (then yellowing and dying), or rot (often a wet rot).

A viral pathogen can inhibit chlorophyll formation, causing degrees of yellowing or mottling, stunting, distortion, or dieback of part of the plant. Viruses usually debilitate rather than kill, as they are parasitic.

Nematodes are microscopic roundworms that cause disease-like symptoms. Stem nematodes feed on stems and cause shortening of internodes. Root nematodes feed underground, damaging the root system; this leads to moisture and nutrient stress which shows up as wilting and stunting. Foliar nematodes cause angular leaf spots.

If an insect problem seems likely, check the following:

A chewing/rasping insect feeds on plant tissue and can cause ragged/chewed or missing leaves (caterpillars, slugs, beetles, grasshoppers), rolled leaves (leafroller), tunnels in between upper and lower leaf surfaces (leaf miners), holes in stems, branches or trunk; sections of tree dying; or premature yellowing (wood borers), girdled or dead stems (cutworms, twig girdlers, or stem borers), or general decline of plants due to root damage (soil dwelling insects)

A sucking insect feeds on plant fluids and injects toxins into the plant. The toxins can cause leaf spotting or stippling (aphids, leafhoppers, spider mites, other bugs), leaf distortion such as curling or puckering (or more commonly this can be damage from leafhoppers and thrips), or poisoning of entire plants, resulting in stunted growth and/or yellowing (scale, mealybugs, mites, aphids, whitefly).

Return to Table of Contents


Non-living Factors
Damage caused by mechanical factors is usually revealed by close visual examination; check for broken or girdled stems or roots, also bruised, punctured, or broken leaves.
Damage due to physical factors often results from environmental extremes. Cold damage is characterized by death of exposed foliage. Container plants are susceptible to cold damage to the root system, characterized by blackened or spongy roots with lack of new growth or root hairs, usually near the container edge.

A rapid change from low light to high light intensity, or vice versa, can cause yellowing of leaves, reduced growth, and leaf drop or death. Too little light can reduce, delay, or prevent flowering.

Excess heat usually causes scorch symptoms on leaf tips and interveinal areas. Portions of leaves shaded by other leaves, or leaves on the shady side of the plant, may be undamaged. Frequently, heat damage will occur uniformly over all plants in an affected area.

Drought and waterlogging produce many of the same symptoms on the above-ground parts of the plant, mainly chlorosis (yellowing leaves), abscission (shedding older leaves), and wilt. Waterlogging of the root zone also results in oxygen deficiency, leading to a halt in root growth and metabolism, death of the roots, and wilt.

Damage due to chemical factors - inappropriately used pesticides or excessive rates of pesticides can cause symptoms, such as leaf burn, distortion, chlorosis, or bleaching, depending on the chemical. On a field basis, pesticide or fertilizer damage symptoms frequently are associated with application patterns.

Nutrient deficiencies show up as yellowing, stunting, or death of older plant leaves or new growth, depending on the missing nutrients.

Refer to expert information. Talk to your Extension agent or local garden center, explaining the symptoms thoroughly, or check all the symptoms against a good chart or reference book, keeping in mind the factor you have determined as the likely cause. If it appears insects or pathogens are causing the problem, be sure to positively identify the pest so you can choose the most effective control measure.

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-The lower branches, underneath the screen, when should they be removed? I saw some pics where there was absolutely no leafage under the screen? looked a bit like a handicapped plant. Should I do this too? And if so, when?

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I haven't done it yet, but I've read that all growth UNDER the screen should be removed.

You shouldn't remove everything in a 20 minute cutting frenzy... you should day by day, progressively remove all leaves, secondary growth, flowers, etc.. that are located under the screen.

Although the plant will look handicapped, my opinion is: looooong time ago that plant stopped growing like it did in nature... I mean, you're weaving it into a screen. I hope my SCRoG is all clean cut underneath. :)

Best,

-turtle420 :cool:
.

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Originally Posted by friendowl

repot that plant with perlite/ soil mix
looks like its overwatered.
remove the plants from the pots and smell the dirt.

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hiya friendowl, they're already in perlite/soil mix :p found the problem, apparently it was underwatering :confused: but uhm... i'm using second hand soil could this have any significant consequenses?

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Originally Posted by Powder Puff

It could also be under watering..

I'm not sure. . . How much/often do you water?

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yeah m8 that was the dilly. i normally stick to a strict watering regiment, because after all it's what they eat right? tonight was a very hot night in my appartment (to be interpreted) and the temp had risen to nearly 31°celsius. Whereas they are normally at a stable 26°c i failed to notice in all my despair lol.

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Originally Posted by scobbie

it looks like overwatering ,with underwatering the leaves start to dry out begining at the tips and i dont see that when did this occur morning or night , time, and how long after watering did it occur harvesthetic im on my way setting up a scrog so keep the thread updated as im following wth great intrest and any info you got would be of great help and very pro mate keep it up,and as freind owl said i woul repot with a better draining soil mix best off luck mate i will pray to nebula the god of all mary jane plants and ask her to spread a little love your way ,lol best of luck mate and keep it up

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hey scobbie the love arrived homie :) they made an incredibly fast recovery. you could almost watch the leaves strenghten up. It's because you said that dry tips are signs of underwatering that i was able to fix it. the soil somehow completely dried out in one night, and I watered yesterday :confused: also thanks for the info on diseases, real damn helpful. already won the battle against the spider mites :cool: cheers!
hail nebula!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by turtle420

I haven't done it yet, but I've read that all growth UNDER the screen should be removed.

You shouldn't remove everything in a 20 minute cutting frenzy... you should day by day, progressively remove all leaves, secondary growth, flowers, etc.. that are located under the screen.

Although the plant will look handicapped, my opinion is: looooong time ago that plant stopped growing like it did in nature... I mean, you're weaving it into a screen. I hope my SCRoG is all clean cut underneath.

Best,

-turtle420

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There's quite the debate going on there on other forums huh? :) trimming all the leaves in a 20 minute chainsaw massacre isn't the way to go, that's clear, but some say that in order to have full nutrient absorption, the maximum is trimming the secondary internodes. but.... hey i'm going scrog, as you say, the plant stopped growing in a natural way (LST, suppercropping, bending, topping, SOG, hydroponics, aeroponics, SCROG, tube-growing, hedgefarming... LOL!) Me thinks our little girls could handle a bit of weaving huh? Check the picture, i've already trimmed some, but i'll be gradually cutting away so I can achieve the effect of Scrog pic i posted earlier.

thx for the input 'ppreciate it was scared there for a minute. as you see the droopage has decreased very fast, and three hours after I posted, they're up again... Better keep monitoring those babies ;)

It's ok now, only slight droop on 1 plant, the tips of each plant are now above the screen, beginning to die down the main stems to try to weave them across the screen.
Is fishing wire ok for supporting and tying down the main stems? Or is that going to cut into the plants? Planning on getting the right material tomorrow, along with the exhaust fan, so any suggestions are welcome.
later on i'll post in detail how I tie down the stems for the optimal use of light, space and height.
Cya later!
harv

hey wassup harv ive been meaning to stop by and show some support but looking at your grow progress jus makes me want to do more for my own and get sidetracked but hey that 1st grow of yours bangen an im sure afta u figure out this overwatering/drooping problem this one'll be just as effective.. keep them up!

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Originally Posted by BkSkillz

hey wassup harv ive been meaning to stop by and show some support but looking at your grow progress jus makes me want to do more for my own and get sidetracked but hey that 1st grow of yours bangen an im sure afta u figure out this overwatering/drooping problem this one'll be just as effective.. keep them up!

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no problem dude, thanks for the support

Day 8 of the scrog
good on its way now, only signs of the underwatering situation are some yellow leaves. No biggie, 85-90% of the plants are completely healthy and growing fast. Started building up the nutrient mix as described earlier. The bends don't seem to harm or stunt the growth of the plant in any way, and it's a fun thing to do. :) I'm bending each of the four plants in a different way, to see what is best. The one with the 90° angle is in pic 1. I'm going to lead him alongside the strings, straight on, to cover the screen and get all the internodes to bud straight up, for optimal use of the light.
All four babies have their heads above the screen. pic 3

good thread mate i have been low stress training on some clones for a scrog they are just about ready about a week to go then the screen is going over them , so im enjoying learning a thing or 2 with your thread , keeep it up mate great thread:thumbsup:

what do u tie the plant to im trying to do a scrog grow an i need some help i wanna do it with 250 watt hps an how big does the screen have to be ???

good question about how big is your screen and about how big are your square spaces

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Originally Posted by Harvesthetic

the screen itself is 90 cmX 80cm (2.95ft x 2.62ft), holes are 4 inches wide approx, outer ones are not so wide, to bend the branches, in order to fill the screen

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Buk, first post in this thread :) but i'm planning on adding extra wire later on to make the square spaces smaller, if necessary. i'll update first thing when the plants wake up.

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Originally Posted by tinybudd

what do u tie the plant to im trying to do a scrog grow an i need some help i wanna do it with 250 watt hps an how big does the screen have to be ???

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Well you can tie them down when the stems are still soft, and gently, gradually lower them, by using let's say bendy plastic wire or a thin iron string. you can see it in this picture, on the left top of the highlighted area. i've tied down the stem using steel wire wrapped in plastic.
for more info on the screen, do a little search on scrog growing and you'll find help.

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Buk, first post in this thread

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No prob will do... thanx for the measurements

L8 upd8 cuz i had 2 help out a m8. (crazy kids these days)

So day 10 of the grow and they're vegetating along nicely. I feared that the lower branches wouldn't be able to get above the screen, but i think that's gonna be ok.. See pic 1. It does take a lot of effort to maintain the grow, bending, tying down and checking the branches takes time. But it's ok, i'm not bitching about it, these are the consequenses lol. Good bend in the second largest stem too.
Still gradually trimming the lower branches... As told by everyone here. :)

Q: Humidity issue: 56% 27° C ok? (veg)

Damn Lookin good Harv... Cant wait for you to start flowering

ok. Just to let you know the 12/12 started yesterday @ day 12 of scrog, early flowering, but the screen is filled for 65-70% ;) update tomorrow with pics

Cool!:D

Can't wait for pics!:D

Right on! :thumbsup:

Cant wait to see... im trying to see what to do for my grow... :rasta:

Stay UP ::smokin:
!Acoustic :stoned:
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Any posts made by me are purely fictional in nature and by no means is anything I say to be taken seriously. I do not grow or condone the growing of anything not legal. Any and all pictures I post are pictures widley available on the internet and any discussions I am involved in are purely hypothetical or are commentary in nature and should not constitute advice or be considered advice to assist in activities that are deemed illegal.

lookin good harv man keep it up and you may be doin better than me my 20 went under the screen yesterday but ive been busy and think i might have let them get to big for the screen ,but ill just keep spying on your thread for ideas lol later bro , lookin real good man

Hi powder, pics are a coming my man :)
Acoustic, I can definately recommend this type of grow for small spaces and a low budget, wanting a bigger yield :thumbsup: consider it dude, you won't regret it. Lots of info about scrog available.
Scobbie, thx man, how big are your plants? Because that is somewhat of an essential part of the method. Can you still bend your stems? Are they reasonable soft? You can try weaving them a bit, and topping to save height, the stems, especially the internode branches are very resilient IMO I don't need to use my wire for the branches, only for the main stems, shown in the pics.

Update:
One major point in the starting of flowering. It's been about two and a half days and they've reacted immediately. Really, from day 1, the white hairs sprung up at literally every internode, and growing very fast.
I've bent all four clones now, weaving them each in a different direction (see pic 2), yet forming a circle. See the pic. I'm aiming to go for a nice little circle of bud.
The tying down is best done every single day. You don't want your stem to grow over your wire, so it's best to check every now and then if it's still a bit loose. Plus when you skip a day, the stem will immediately reach for the artificial sun and grow straight up, and I want a 90° bend :p on all of them. (see pic 3&4)
Started very weak flowering Algae ferts, with some of my own mix I've used at the end of the first grow, to stimulate bud growth. Temp 27° hum. 60% very stable now :). The carbon filter and the exhaust fan work amazing.
A nice Scrog with some Low Stress Training is turning out to be real enjoyable and fun to do. It's also a modest, low profile grow. I can't wait for this one, I love to see them evolve.
'Till next time,
Harv

woot.. those are looking good.. nice set up =]

It's over. Grow is taken down, everything's out. Was informed just in time before the legal consequenses........ Had to evacuate in movie-style..........:mad: :mad:

cya later.... not :( :(

WHAT?!?!!!!


WHAT THE HELL??! That's NOT true man.. Stop pulling my leg man.. NOT a good joke..

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Originally Posted by Powder Puff

WHAT?!?!!!!


WHAT THE HELL??! That's NOT true man.. Stop pulling my leg man.. NOT a good joke..

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It's over Puff... I'm wouldn't joke about that.

I'll stick around for helping out the others though... But not as frequent :( I know it sucks, but life goes on right?

I'm going to grow tomatoes and peppers and strawberries now though, because I've caught an extreme love for gardening and treating plants. I don't know, It's very therapeutic and the various plants are like pets.

I'm going to open up a strawberry/tomatoe/pepper thread, wouldn't that be fun? Maybe others can grow some to, because they need the same cultivation methods as hemp.

i'm a bit sad though now :( really sad face all day.............

Shit..:(

But.. Yeah.. You're right.. Life goes on!:) (To bad though..:()

hmm

I'm starting Tomatoes with my cannabis next time..:) We can share info:) Maybe some strawberries as well:)

It's so I can keep growing weed.. I told my mom I would grow her some tomatoes as well:p

Later, tah

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Originally Posted by Powder Puff

Shit..:(

But.. Yeah.. You're right.. Life goes on!:) (To bad though..:()

hmm

I'm starting Tomatoes with my cannabis next time..:) We can share info:) Maybe some strawberries as well:)

It's so I can keep growing weed.. I told my mom I would grow her some tomatoes as well:p

Later, tah

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thx man all the best to you and your grow!! I'm gonna grow some very potent strawberries and peppers, to flavour my blunt wraps :)

see harve you got it bro we are all, in shiot here you look at whats going down and they are defenately here ive got what you are saying about theraputic bro my illness has greatly improvred since i started growing and i had to take down my own set up because the info i gave when joining this site was given to police by some on e i only gave this info when joining this site , it was false thank god but they have been lookin around for me but now there is nothing for them to find bro its all down and gone and it broke my heart bro , that was last week but im still hurting and and i feel worst than ive felt for a long time bro but im not stopping grown only weed im going for peppers bro so any info you can give me would be greatly appreciated as the growing is very theraputic anyway bro you take care and if you want you post an addy here and you can join our thing via messenger totaly legal theraputic growing man, why cant they leave us alone