House Votes to Extend Patriot Act

By GLEN JOHNSON, Associated Press Writer

WASHINGTON - The House voted Thursday to extend the USA Patriot Act, the nation's main anti-terrorism tool, just hours after televisions in the Capitol beamed images of a new attack in London.
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As similar legislation worked its way through the Senate, House Republicans generally cast the law as a valuable asset in the war on terror. Most Democrats echoed that support but said they were concerned the law could allow citizens' civil liberties to be infringed.

After more than nine hours of debate, the House approved the measure 257-171. Forty-three Democrats joined 214 Republicans in voting to renew key provisions of the Patriot Act that were set to expire at the end of the year.

The bulk of the back-and-forth centered on language making permanent 14 of 16 provisions that had four-year sunset provisions under the original law, which Congress passed overwhelmingly after the Sept. 11, 2001, terrorist attacks.

The bill also includes 10-year extensions to the two other provisions set to expire on Dec. 31, one allowing roving wiretaps and another allowing searches of library and medical records.

"While the Patriot Act and other anti-trrorism initiatives have helped avert additional attacks on our soil, the threat has not receded," said Rep. James Sensenbrenner, R-Wis., chairman of the
House Judiciary Committee.

Rep. John Conyers of Michigan, the top Democrat on the committee, said that while "I support the majority of the 166 provisions of the Patriot Act," the extensions could lessen accountability. "Ten years is not a sunset; 10 years is semi-permanent," he said.

President Bush hailed the vote.

"The Patriot Act is a key part of our efforts to combat terrorism and protect the American people, and the Congress needs to send me a bill soon that renews the act without weakening our ability to fight terror," Bush said in a statement released by the White House.

As the House debated the legislation, the Senate Judiciary Committee approved its own extension of the bill, though it included only four-year extensions for the roving wiretap and records search provisions.

A competing bill also has been approved by the Senate Intelligence Committee, which would give the
FBI expanded powers to subpoena records without the approval of a judge or grand jury. That ensured further Senate talks on the terrorism-fighting measure. The House legislation will also have to be reconciled with whatever emerges from the Senate.

The House debate included frequent references to the attacks earlier in the day, two weeks after larger London blasts that killed 56, including four suicide bombers.

The roving wiretap provision, Section 206, allows investigators to obtain warrants to intercept a suspect's phone conversations or Internet traffic without limiting it to a specific phone or identifying the suspect. The records provision, Section 215, authorizes federal officials to obtain "tangible items" such as business, library and medical records.

Advocates argued that such powers already exist in criminal investigations so they should be expressly continued for terrorism investigations. They also cited safeguards in the bill, such as a requirement that a judge approve the records search.

One amendment, passed by a 402-26 vote, requires the FBI director to personally approve any request for library or bookstore records. Another successful amendment sets a 20-year jail term for an attack against a rail or mass-transit vehicle; a 30-year sentence if the vehicle carries nuclear material; and life imprisonment â?? with the possibility of the death penalty â?? if anyone is killed in such an attack.

Rep. Mike Rogers, R-Mich., a former FBI agent, recalled using such tools in gang and child molestation investigations.

"All we do in the Patriot Act is say, `Look, if we can go after child molesters sitting in the library and bombers who we need to sneak-and-peek on a warrant, we ought to be able to go after terrorists,'" he said.

Critics heralded the bulk of the existing law, but said the sunsets were wisely inserted amid the inflamed passions following the Sept. 11 attacks, and should be retained to assess the long-term impact of the law.

"Periodically revisiting the Patriot Act is a good thing," said Rep. Martin Meehan, D-Mass. "The Patriot Act was an effort to answer the most difficult question a democracy faces: How much freedom are we willing to give up to feel safe?"

Democrats were incensed after Republican leaders blocked consideration of an amendment that would have blocked the library searches. The House approved identical language last month in a test vote.

"If you don't like it, come up and speak against it," said Rep. Bernie Sanders, I-Vt., who sponsored the amendment. "But it has passed once and it would likely pass again."

The House bill number is H.R. 3199.




I've asked this before and I'll ask it again: is it really worth it to go to all of this trouble to defend freedom when the steps we take to do so abridge what we're supposed to be fighting for?

Do you know what this actually means? Our privacy might and probably will be invaded by the FBI. or any other government agencies. If I could walk into a book store and buy a contravercial book, my records would be looked into by some government agent. Yeh, I might be alittle paranoied, but this is going abit too far. I could hear that on the knews as I sit in a jail. "Blind man gets arested after he comes out of the Barns and Nobles Bookstore for buying a contravercial book." Does anyone feel the same way? What are your thoughts on this decision?

Remember, democracy never lasts long. It soon wastes, exhausts, and murders itself. There never was a democracy yet that did not commit suicide." - John Adams

Minimum Document Requirements- To meet the requirements of this section, a State shall include, at a minimum, the following information and features on each driver's license and identification card issued to a person by the State:

(1) The person's full legal name.

(2) The person's date of birth.

(3) The person's gender.

(4) The person's driver's license or identification card number.

(5) A digital photograph of the person.

(6) The person's address of principle residence.

(7) The person's signature.

(8) Physical security features designed to prevent tampering, counterfeiting, or duplication of the document for fraudulent purposes.

(9) A common machine-readable technology, with defined minimum data elements

Welcom to Big Brothers play ground, the definition of minimum data elements is subject to the interpretation of the govt. Soon they will have all of your data, but wait, it gets better they have also authorized full electronic survelliance of the border and will soon be able to see you 24/7....Enjoy the Box!!!!!!!!!

Unless your checking out books on kiddy porn, or how to make a bomb, or "AlQuada...the lighter side", I really woudn't worry about it. :rolleyes:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by highinspain

Minimum Document Requirements- To meet the requirements of this section, a State shall include, at a minimum, the following information and features on each driver's license and identification card issued to a person by the State:

(1) The person's full legal name.

(2) The person's date of birth.

(3) The person's gender.

(4) The person's driver's license or identification card number.

(5) A digital photograph of the person.

(6) The person's address of principle residence.

(7) The person's signature.

(8) Physical security features designed to prevent tampering, counterfeiting, or duplication of the document for fraudulent purposes.

(9) A common machine-readable technology, with defined minimum data elements

Welcom to Big Brothers play ground, the definition of minimum data elements is subject to the interpretation of the govt. Soon they will have all of your data, but wait, it gets better they have also authorized full electronic survelliance of the border and will soon be able to see you 24/7....Enjoy the Box!!!!!!!!!

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Sounds like my drivers licence....big deal!

It is just like your drivers licence with the addition of the bio-metrics, I am sure some thought is was no big deal to sew a yellow star on the clothes, that didnt work out to well now did it?

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Originally Posted by highinspain

It is just like your drivers licence with the addition of the bio-metrics, I am sure some thought is was no big deal to sew a yellow star on the clothes, that didnt work out to well now did it?

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Just a little bit dramatic aren't we??

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Originally Posted by Psycho4Bud

Unless your checking out books on kiddy porn, or how to make a bomb, or "AlQuada...the lighter side", I really woudn't worry about it. :rolleyes:

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Well psycho, did you think they were just going to come out and say "we dont like how you guys have too much freedom, so we're taking it away" or do you think they'd try to hide it behind searching for child molesters at first?

when you give some people an inch...

Hell... anything could be deamed contravercial by this government, even books on Witchcraft if they go so far to do something like that. It's all good though, you can get used to having the government running your life. Yes, believe that they are doing this for your own good, it's a lie.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by stoner spirit

Hell... anything could be deamed contravercial by this government, even books on Witchcraft if they go so far to do something like that. It's all good though, you can get used to having the government running your life. Yes, believe that they are doing this for your own good, it's a lie.

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That's what im sayin. You think the government cares about you? no way! politicians and citizens are separate. its our job to make sure they do their jobs properly and its their job to make sure the country is stable. We arent friends with the government and they sure as hell dont want to be friends with the likes of us.

has anyone actually read the patriot act...it's not for terrorists...it's for all crime. all criminals are terrorists...of course this will become more apparent after we're attacked again...and we have the military out on the streets searching people at malls and train stations and on the streets...

that's already been done though in san antonio, corpus christi, alabama...all around the country.

and when we all get CPS visits and are forcibly drugged, when we get issued our gray uniforms and are forced to do national service...high school kids running checkpoints searching cars...hitler youth type stuff...putin youth type stuff...and we have cameras in our houses...

this is nothing new for tyranny in the world though...it's all pretty standard. tyrants want more and more and more...and these tyrants aren't threatened by any muslim terrorists...their tax free foundations and corporations own the muslim terrorists.

putin just a couple days ago said we need to give up our rights to be safe from terrorism. you don't get security or freedom when you give up your freedom, you get and deserve neither.

Camras in our houses... oh grate. We are not like zoo animals that need to be watched by some fucking keepers. This is some bullshit that they're pulling here! I won't get used to having big brother looking in on me and mine, if I and others are even aloud to have wives. I'd rather for the both of us to die fighting for our right to privacy. You goe ahead and believe the government, and watch your puppet on national tv. Goe ahead and eat that up with a spoon, and wait in line for seconds and thirds with your bowls and spoons in hand. If you don't have none of those things, well... tuff shit. Yes... that's good ain't it, mmmmm, how does that taist?
All hail the mighty government! We shall be it's servants, and kneel while we worship the mighty government. We shall surrender our will to it, as well as our bodies.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by stoner spirit

Camras in our houses... oh grate. We are not like zoo animals that need to be watched by some fucking keepers. This is some bullshit that they're pulling here! I won't get used to having big brother looking in on me and mine, if I and others are even aloud to have wives. I'd rather for the both of us to die fighting for our right to privacy. You goe ahead and believe the government, and watch your puppet on national tv. Goe ahead and eat that up with a spoon, and wait in line for seconds and thirds with your bowls and spoons in hand. If you don't have none of those things, well... tuff shit. Yes... that's good ain't it, mmmmm, how does that taist?
All hail the mighty government! We shall be it's servants, and kneel while we worship the mighty government. We shall surrender our will to it, as well as our bodies.

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not if me and the BUK BUK BUK from my ak-47 has anything to do with it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by nicholasstanko

not if me and the BUK BUK BUK from my ak-47 has anything to do with it.

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Hahahahahaha, you can see well enough to use a gun. I can't see a damn thing at all, and if I had a gun, I might accidentally shoot the person next to me, instead of the person that's four hundred feet or so infrunt of me. The only weapons I'd be able to use, if possible, are swords, knives, and maylay weapons. That's if I manage not to get shot by government agents.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by stoner spirit

Hahahahahaha, you can see well enough to use a gun. I can't see a damn thing at all, and if I had a gun, I might accidentally shoot the person next to me, instead of the person that's four hundred feet or so infrunt of me. The only weapons I'd be able to use, if possible, are swords, knives, and maylay weapons. That's if I manage not to get shot by government agents.

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lol. you should learn the secret art of gun-fu. you pick up a gun and just start spraying it with reckless abandon.

Would I be able to use almost any gun for that? or Do I have to get ahold of an automatic rifle for that purpose?

I hear ya with that guys! Live free or die! And that I shall.

guess your gonna be alive until that 76.5 years is up.

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Live free or die!

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word
werd
amen
agreed
affirmative

what a relief.