HELP! BROWN tips and spots, pale green leaves and death of leaves.

I have made threads in other forums about my plants before, i thought they were just yellow tipped and it was nutrient overdose from the soil, because i never fed them nutrients myself since i saw the yellow/brown tips. And now all of the tips are brown on all of my plants and leaves are turning pale green.

I HAVE NOT FED MY PLANTS in a long time and new leaves keep brown tipping and old are falling off. I only water them.
But every tip is not yellow, they are brown. I have 2 mature plants and a new baby. Leaves are browning, drying,and falling off from the bottom-up on the mature ladies.


The baby is 3 leaf sets in and about 20 something days out of the ground. Her second set brown tipped first and now her first set is. But the baby is in SEED STARTING MIX and i have not fed it any nutes and i only water it.


Could the reason for the browning be that my grow room is too dry? Cuz every friggin plant i have gets the yellow then brown tips. Also, some leaves on my older plants are turning pale green.

Here are the pics of everything.

http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e9...9/c40af546.jpg
http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e9...9/7a9275e4.jpg
http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e9...9/483f22e6.jpg

And here is a picture of the bottom-most leaves of the plant.
http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e9...9/651729bc.jpg





Are the leaves too dry from the room? Should i mist them everyday?

Or is it a deficiency that is causing brown spots on some leaves like in the third picture?

And what is killing off my leaves?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jeremybxtriv

And what is killing off my leaves?

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Lack of experience/knowledge....

No worries though, we all had to learn somehow....

Click on the troubleshooting form link in my sig, copy the questions, come back here, paste, answer and we might have a better understanding of what's going on with your brown tippin....

CGI::::::

Well your photos don't show. As above do the troubleshooting form, we don't know if you are hydro, soil, or ? Pretty hard to answer questions without all the information in those forms. Gut instinct says that you are growing in soil and as the nutrients are used up you are showing signs of N deficiency, but at the end of a grow you should see that, else the taste will be vile.

Sounds a bit l;ike overwatering. But since you removed the pictures from Photobucket, it's a guess. As previously mentioned...copy-n-paste the troubleshooting form here, and answer it as completely and honestly as possible.

Crap i forgot to fix the links, here they are.

Diesel:
1.) http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e9...9/c40af546.jpg
2.) http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e9...9/483f22e6.jpg

And i'll do the troubleshooting in a sec.

Wonder Seedling: http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e9...9/7a9275e4.jpg

Your Equipment:
.1) 2 150 watt "plant lights" they are my primaries, they are more blue spectrum and look like this. http://image.become.com/imageserver/...atco-s2852.jpg

I also have a 90w Halogen a few feet away from the growing area for filler and extra light, this is not the primary light.
.2) Distance from tops? The plant lights are around,eh, 5 or 6 inches away aiming at the top?
.3) Reflector type: Enclosed circular reflectors for 150-250 watt lights.
.4) Is there a consistent fresh air supply? Yes there is an air circulator that takes the air in the room and blows it back out also
.5) Do you have an exhaust fan and a circulation fan? I do have a circulation device in the wall that takes the air and blows it out whatever temperature i set it too. So yes air is circulating in and out of the room.
.6) What are the bulb wattages, kelvin ratings, and schedule? 150 watt and the Halogen is 90w

Your medium:
.7) Specific brand and type of soil: My diesel plant is planted in potting soil with a mix of top soil and i have added perlite to it. But soil is definatly not my problem as my diesel is planted in potting soil mixed with top soil and perlite, as my other mature plant is planted in all potting soil, and my baby is planted in seed starting mix from Jiffy. All different soils but are all suffering from the brown tips and lighter green leaves. My potting soil is from Schultz and the seed starting mix is from Jiffy.
.8) 5 gallon pot
.9) Did you use peat pucks (or similar) to root clones or germinate seedlings? Nope.

Your nutrients and water:
10) Source of water? (tap, bottled or filtered) What's it's ph before adjusting? Tap, but i do not alter the ph, the water comes out of the tap with a ph of 6.7
11) Method of checking water ph. (ph pen, test strips, aquarium test kit...) I dont have a ph test tool.
12) Method of adjusting water ph. (phosphoric acid, white vinegar, hydrated lime, PH Up...)
13) Specific brand and N-P-K ratio for each bottle. List dosages (quantity per gallon) and current feeding schedule. I have not fed my plants since the day i noticed the brown and yellow tips and leaves.
14) How often are you watering between feedings, and how much per watering? I water every 4-5 days and maybe 1/4 of a gallon of water every time for each plant in the big pots. I dont know how much i water my seedling, since its in a plastic cup i just water it from the tap.
15) Any additives or tea's? (Superthrive, CalMag, molasses, Mother's Earth...) Nope
16) Are your ph levels stable, or do they fluctuate? No clue.
17) What is your ingoing water's ph? ...your runoff ph? The water comes out with a ph of about 6.6 or 6.7 and i dont know what the runoff is.
18) Do you foliar feed? If so, with what, how often, and at what time do you spray?

Your growroom:
19) Indoors or outdoors? Indoors
20) What size of closet, room or hut? It is a relatively small room, its about a 12x12 room in the basement.
21) What are the temps and humidity levels while lights are on? I usually keep the temperature anywhere from 74-77 degrees Fahrenheit and i dont really change it when the lights are off. And i dont know about humidity levels.
22) Have you seen signs of insects in the growroom? Nothing major i saw a few little white bugs in the soil a while back but i dont see them anymore. Everytime i saw them i sprayed with organic plant safe pesticide.

Your strain:
23) What strain are you growing? My wonder plants are indica dominant and my Diesel plant is sativa dominant.
24) From seeds or clones? Seeds
25) Is this an autoflower strain? Only the wonder is autoflower

12x12 area for 300+ watts is part of the prob.... Your plant lights are not the ones you want to use.... Having a 90w a few feet away is nowhere near filler light or extra light....because the lamp is too far away for it to be effective....which also seems to be the deal with your blue bulb plant lights....

You can't make chicken soup with pork....get the right ingredients and you will enjoy the taste....

Your problems are due to ineffective grow area/environment provided....

Do much more research, get the right equipment/grow space(s), and then you will prosper....

Good luck!!!:jointsmile:

CGI::::::

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CanGroIt

12x12 area for 300+ watts is part of the prob.... Your plant lights are not the ones you want to use.... Having a 90w a few feet away is nowhere near filler light or extra light....because the lamp is too far away for it to be effective....which also seems to be the deal with your blue bulb plant lights....

You can't make chicken soup with pork....get the right ingredients and you will enjoy the taste....

Your problems are due to ineffective grow area/environment provided....

Do much more research, get the right equipment/grow space(s), and then you will prosper....

Good luck!!!:jointsmile:

CGI::::::

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The 90w is like a foot and a half away. And im not getting what your saying. A 12 foot by 12 foot room is not all being used up. I have TWO big plants that are in the corner of the room. I have multiple lights around them and the entire area is lit up. My lights are not the problem, which is why i added in the baby's issue also.

The baby i am growing has been growing in a plastic cup placed in a white hard plastic bucket with a 60w daylight bulb clamped onto the side of it with the light aiming straight down in to the bucket. But yet the seedling still was exposed to the brown tips and lighter green leaves. I dont think its my light that is the problem, i will take a picture of the entire grow space. Im pretty sure its not insufficient lighting.

Ok so you have them in one corner of the 12x12 room.... If you can stand on the opposite corner of the room and light is illuminating the corner in which you are standing, from your plant lights, you are losing lumens....

18"-24" from a 1000w lamp is the most effective range for a 1000watter.... Anything closer and the foliage will bleach from light intensity.... So YES, I do believe your 90w being 18" away is still ineffective....

Plus your plants told me everything I needed to know.... Your two LARGE plants are stretching like crazy and are just tall not large.... At least that's the way they look in the first two pics....

Will be waiting to see your full grow space....

You are right about the insufficient lighting not being the cause of the brown tips though....

CGI::::::

Multiple leaf sets have already browned out, died , and fallen off so it makes it seem like the plant should be a shorter but at one point there were leaves up and down the entire plant.

Seedling Bucket
http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e9...9/86eda66a.jpg


Growing Corner
http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e9...9/f112647a.jpg

I focused on the plants in this picture so you could get a better vision of the position of the lights and the surroundings without the glare of the leaves and lights.
http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e9...9/49de50b8.jpg

Here is the natural setting, glare and all so you can see how much light is hitting the plant.
http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e9...9/e46894af.jpg

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jeremybxtriv

Multiple leaf sets have already browned out, died , and fallen off so it makes it seem like the plant should be a shorter but at one point there were leaves up and down the entire plant....

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Listen to me very carefully....are you listening....YOUR ENTIRE SETUP IS THE PROBLEM WITH YOUR PLANTS....

And I say this from experience....:jointsmile:

Like I said before....do more research, get the right space/equipment and then you will prosper....

I said Good-Day....

CGI::::::

Why not see if you can find a nice light setup on Craig list. With what you have now, you should just give up as you will never get any product off of those plants without proper lighting.....as already stated. To hell with the brown spots, which are probably a N lockout, you don't have enough light for the plant to thrive. Sorry dude, you got to spend some money if you want to grow your own.

I'd ditch the plant flood lights and use proper CFL's. The flood lights give more heat than usable lumens, (which means you likely can't get 'em close enough to power photosynthesis) and are more effective as mood-lighting rather than as a grow light.

Is your Schultz soil the three month formula? Why do you mix-in the topsoil? Likely the ph of the topsoil is too acidic (near 5.0ish, unless it's buffered)

Do not keep the seedling soil saturated.

Kay if i was to get CFLs, would i be able to put them in the fixtures i already have?
And what problem does this solve?

And how do i fix the brown tips? Is it a low umidity problem?

And how would it be a N lockout, the seedling got brown tips in a completely different soil than all my other plants.

And also my plants are getting pre-flowering hairs lol.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jeremybxtriv

Kay if i was to get CFLs, would i be able to put them in the fixtures i already have?
And what problem does this solve?

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Yes, the CFL's use the same base as 'normal' bulbs. No special equipment needed.
There are basically two types of CFL's. Soft White and Daylight. One type is mainly used for the growth phase, the other is used for the flowering stage. If pressed for cash, get the ones for flowering, as they can be used for the growth phase, however they are a bit less effecient. Check the indoor lighting section for more details...

The CFL's burn cooler than the spot flood lights which means you can get the light source closer to the leaves. This is where the plant's power comes from. As a general rule (the square-inverse law) the closer the light source, the more lumens you can offer.
CFL's are much more energy effecient, and buy American if possible.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jeremybxtriv

And how do i fix the brown tips? Is it a low umidity problem?

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You don't. Leaves don't repair themselves, they just make more if the conditions allow it. (old leaves are old news) Keep an eye on the new growth to see how they feel now.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jeremybxtriv

And how would it be a N lockout, the seedling got brown tips in a completely different soil than all my other plants.

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Ph issues can cause mineral and nutrient lockout. Topsoil is not buffered, so is likely pulling-down your ph and dumping shitloads of nutrients at the same time. (adding nutrients will not cure this issue) You might want to think about a transplant into fresh soil without the topsoil, and don't overwater.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jeremybxtriv

And also my plants are getting pre-flowering hairs lol.

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A bikini wax solves that...

I have a stupid question for ya. How do you know the ph of your tap water without having anything to test it?

Most water quality reports are posted online, and can be found via Google.

For example: "Costa Mesa, CA water quality report" But enter your town and state, or water company's name.

Well rusty the thing is is that my seedling isnt in topsoil, only my diesel is. My seedling is in Jiffy Seed Starting Mix and i have never added nutrients to it yet and it already has brown tips. Along with every single other one of my plants.

Interesting thread and nice information! pr

Hey Jeremy... CGI is right, your light setup is whack. Don't take that the wrong way, I started the same way. I've changed my light setup atleast 4 times, getting better each time, because from the beginning I had no idea what I was doing. Those blue lights put out WAY to much heat, and I know you said you had ventilation, but maybe you cooked your plants... But adequate light will solve a lot of your problems, because even if your pH isnt spot on, new growth is happening, which is needed to keep your plant alive. BUT, if you want to truly have a healthy grow all the way through, you NEED a pH indicator. There are some great reads if you do a forum search on pH, and why it is important. If your pH is too unstable, lockout of nutrients happen, as CGI said, and your plants life slowly but surely goes down hill.

For those CFL's, if you want to make a setup out of those, lowes/HD/walmart has those "Y" splitters for light fixtures, so for every socket you have, you convert it to two, and yes you can place two CFLS in it. Now with CFL's, you need them 2" from the canopy.

Oh and lastly, when you mix your nutes with water so you can feed your plants, it drops the pH considerably. So each time you feed, if you arent fixing pH, its lowering your soils pH each time. After a few feedings, well, you will have a problem. The reason why transplanting will help is because the pH of that soil is in better range for your plant. If you kept feeding THAT soil with nute mix that isnt pH'd, well you will continue to have the same problems. Transplanting also gives roots more room to grow..

Sal.

I will be working on getting those CFL's.

And about the pH, am i able to get a pH up and pH down solution or will that only work with hydro?

And yes i have transplanted my diesel many times. But it is in its final home of a 5 gallon pot.

And should i get an electronic pH pen?

Also, yea i know the blue lights are givong off way too much heat, i've already had an instance where the plant got too close, didnt even touch the light but already burnt.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jeremybxtriv

I will be working on getting those CFL's.

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That's a good idea. It will help with all that stretching, and the floods won't grow 'em proper. Putting a circulating fan on 'em will strengthen the stems. Otherwise, you'll have to train 'em to a stake and they'll still have problems supporting buds. So you're in a seedling mix, (unbuffered, most likely) haven't fed 'em and have crappy lighting. Time for some changes. A seedling mix is a bad idea for more than seedlings. Too acidic, no 'body' to support plant.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jeremybxtriv

And about the pH, am i able to get a pH up and pH down solution or will that only work with hydro?

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You might need one or the other. Nobody needs both. But be certain of you tapwater ph before buying anything. I am in soil, and have to adjust my 7.9 ph water. I use phDown. Transplanting into fresh soil, if it's buffered, should be fine over the long haul. A monthly flush helps remove nutrient build-up that will alter ph in the soil.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jeremybxtriv

And should i get an electronic pH pen?

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If you have money to get a gadget, a good ph pen is a worthy tool. But if you get it, also get the calibrating solution and the storage solution. If you let the electrode in the ph pen dry out, it ruins the electrode.
In the mean time, a freshwater aquarium ph test kit works pretty good for ingoing water ph, but it is a color-coded result. If you mix nutrients that tint the water, it skews the results. Same for the runoff ph which is tinted. Only a ph pen will gain you that info, which is invaluable for newbies.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jeremybxtriv

Also, yea i know the blue lights are givong off way too much heat, i've already had an instance where the plant got too close, didnt even touch the light but already burnt.

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The plant is stretching, looking for the quality of light those bulbs don't provide. You'll be amazed at what issues the change to CFL's will solve. Do you have more bases you can use for more CFL's? If not, you'll likely want a higher wattage CFL than is available at WalMart.

Rusty,
I have on occasion need either to adjust my pH up or down out of the tap. That is why it is so critical to never forget to do the check in my water supply. USUALLY it is 6.5-7.0, but occasionally it will jump. For example if it rains really hard on the fall leaves, it will get as low as 5.0, and conversely, at other times of the year it will suddenly jump to 8.5 as it did last week.

Again I suggest watching Craigs list, I always see stuff like that for sale there.

Most are on a muni water supply which is kept relatively constant.
But yes, some weirdo's have it both ways, lol.

How's the AK x PF seedlings doing, WW?

Quote:

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So you're in a seedling mix, (unbuffered, most likely) haven't fed 'em and have crappy lighting. Time for some changes. A seedling mix is a bad idea for more than seedlings. Too acidic, no 'body' to support

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Lol no no no no no no, i do not have any plants that are bigger than seedlings in seedling mix. I only have my seedling in a seedling mix haha. My bigger plants are in real soil. My Wonder is in all potting soil and my Diesel is in a mix of potting soil and top soil with extra peat moss and perlite that i added in myself. And i know the top soil was a bad idea, i now have a big bag of growers mix i am going to use for future plants.

Okay i now have soft white CFL's, all of them being 100-150 watt replacements.

But anyway, i just watered my diesel plant and while i was looking at the water drain down from the top of the medium, i noticed these clumps of shit that look like little grains of pete moss float at the top and clump together. This made me curious and as i kneeled down to take a closer look these looked like tiny little fish-like things swimming around and clumping together. Once the water drained i looked at them and they appear to be tiny ass white bugs. But they are only in the soil, not on the leaves or the stems.

As soon as i saw them i grabbed my GardenSafe organic insent killer and sprayed them. What do i do now?

Might be fungus knats.... Be sure to let your soil dry 90% before watering again.... Moist environments invite unwanted pests....

Also, place some dryer sheets around your pots or even at the base of your plants.... Pests cannot stand the fragrance....

CGI::::::

Dude... why are you bothering wasting your money on all of these stupid lights! Im guessing you have probably spent a couple hundred dollars on all the light bulbs and sockets you have there! If you would just go out and buy one of these 600 watt systems for 220 bucks you would have BOTH of the proper bulbs (MH for veg.. and HPS for flowering) PLUS a sweet shade and hardware to hang it..

600W/1000W Digital Air Cooled Box Grow System

stop wasting your money dude.. go big or go home.. Think about it this way.. all those crap CFL's might give you an ounce of half assed buds off of those 2 plants if your lucky... throw those baby's under a 600w HPS and you will probably DOUBLE your yeild and DOUBLE your quality! You are trying to cut corners dude.. and it just doesnt work! Sorry for being blunt... but seriously dude... look up used gear.. you can get a quality set up going for super cheap these days.. I know a guy who set up a whole 6 light room for under $1000 bucks on craigslist.. he will probably pull 7 or 8 pounds out of his first crop alone!.. a 600w bulb would be enough to grow 14 - 16 plants depending on the size and bushyness of the strain.. and that would yeild you close to a pound my friend.... I dont know where your from.. but roughly $2000 for a $220investment is a SMOKIN deal! Good luck with your grow man.. I hope you decide to get it running properly.. its totally worth it dude!

I agree with you but this dude hasnt logged in since jan. Almost a year old thread but good info none the less.