Phat Jays 2nd Grow (CFL/Coco) w/pics

I started off my second grow today. I am keeping my setup similar to last time, but I am hoping to try out a couple of new things this time round. I am also mixing my own food for this grow.

My last grow is still in it's final 2 weeks so I am using a smaller cupboard to start these off and I will be transferring them across to my main cabinet, when the other 2 plants are finished and harvested. :jointsmile:

Today I potted up my cuttings and fed them with 200ml 1/4 strength Canna Hydro Vega nutes.

(Click for hi-res versions)

Plant D
http://imgur.com/Rb9FOl.jpg

Plant E
http://imgur.com/drJApl.jpg

Are you growing genetics or bagseed?

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Originally Posted by jtsik330

Are you growing genetics or bagseed?

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Ghetto Genetics :weedpoke:

It's from the same family line as the cuttings for my last grow.

Nice, looks good. Subscribed! Hope it goes as well as the last one's going.

Nice, looks great. Hope it goes as well as the last one's going. Subscribed.

Nice! Good luck with your next grow :thumbsup::thumbsup:

I'm still waiting for my babies to show some sex :(

I have now started adding Cannazyme to my feed at half strength. So my feed is 1/4 strength Canna Hydro Vega + 1/2 strength Cannazyme. I am watering at 200ml per plant a day now.

(click for hi-res versions)
Plant D
http://imgur.com/esgpDl.jpg

Plant E
http://imgur.com/mv5zYl.jpg

Quote:

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Originally Posted by PhatJay

I have now started adding Cannazyme to my feed at half strength. So my feed is 1/4 strength Canna Hydro Vega + 1/2 strength Cannazyme. I am watering at 200ml per plant a day now.

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I got the above post wrong, I have stepped up my nute dosage to half strength. It should read...

"I have now started adding Cannazyme to my feed at half strength. So my feed is 1/2 strength Canna Hydro Vega + 1/2 strength Cannazyme. I am watering at 200ml per plant a day now."

Having nearly finished my 1st grow I am feeling a bit more confident this time around. Last time I just let them grow naturally and I think it is going to have an effect on the size of my harvest. So today I think I Fimmed my plants. :)

Stepped up nutes to 3/4 strength. I am using 3/4 strength because my local grow shop recommends this when using hydro food in coco. I also think this is why my food supplying friend told me to feed 2 days on, 1 day off, when I was getting full strength food from him, as this would make my feed strength about 66% last time round.

Pics taken before my attempt at fimming
Plant D
http://imgur.com/rwBfRl.jpg

Plant E
http://imgur.com/nFlPil.jpg

I havn't updated for a while because I had to give back the camera I had on loan. I have it back now, so here goes....

My first attempt at Fimming has worked on plant E but not D. I think I didn't cut enough off D or I cut it a little late. Plant E has four main tops and D has the usual one. I suppose one advantage of the FIM going wrong on D, is that I will get to compare the results side by side.

I am considering trying a Scrog for my next grow and I think Topping and/or Fimming would help with this, because plant E is really open and spread out and I can see that it would definitely help fill a screen. The only thing that is putting me of a scrog is the time factor, I like a low maintenance setup.

Day 21 Veg

Moved the plants into my main cabinet, they are now vegging under 2x125w cfls (blue spectrum). I am still feeding them 3/4 strength Canna Aqua Vega and full strength Cannazyme on a daily basis at lights on.

Day 1 Flower

Pruned out a lot of the growth around the base of the plants so I get less popcorn buds this time round. I also added about another inch of coco around the base of the plants. I have now switched to feeding them 3/4 strength Canna Hydro Flores and full strength Cannazyme. They are currently drinking around 450/500ml a day.

I also switched the bulbs to 2x125w cfls (red spectrum)

Day 7 Flower

The girls are looking very healthy and showing signs of flowering. I am still feeding with 3/4 strength Canna Hydro Flores and full strength Cannazyme.

(click for hi-res versions)

Plant E (left) Plant D (right)
http://imgur.com/z0OoGl.jpg

Plant E (aka Four Tops)
http://imgur.com/xnroul.jpg

Plant D
http://imgur.com/eWdahl.jpg

Plant D
http://imgur.com/ZXsTsl.jpg

I have now started adding Cannaboost to my feed at 3ml per litre. I know Cannaboost is expensive and probably overkill on my setup, but I got 2 bottles of it for free. If your growing on a budget I recommend visiting a cannabis growing show, I must have got a good $200 worth of food for practically nothing ($20 for fuel and parking).

Free Food!
http://imgur.com/U09Hxl.jpg


The girls are coming on O.K. despite the fact that I made a noob mistake when mixing up my last batch of food. I accidentally mixed it at half strength, I didn't realise my error until until I mixed up a new batch yesterday. I think it has slowed flowering down just a little bit after comparing these pics to my plants in my last grow log, at the same age.


Plant D (Main Cola)
http://imgur.com/rgW2kl.jpg


Plant E - There are four top buds in this picture, honest! They are just really hard to spot.
http://imgur.com/7tAGOl.jpg

I am continiuing with the same food regime of 3/4 Strength Canna Hydro Flores, full strength Cannazyme and 3ml per litre Cannaboost, feeding daily at lights on.

I don't want to jinx myself, but both plants are looking really, really healthy. They are not quite as advanced as my last grow at this age, as they seem to be about 3-4 days behind. This could be due to my earlier underfeeding mistake or the fact that I vegged these for 28 days and the last grow I vegged for 39. Who knows, but it is going to be interesting to compare yields at the end.

(click for hi-res versions)

Plant D Main Cola
http://imgur.com/3D8mcl.jpg

Plant E (Four tops)
http://imgur.com/Kunuul.jpg

Some random secondary bud
http://imgur.com/SvXFkl.jpg

Looking nice! Can't wait to start my next grow! :thumbsup:

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Originally Posted by aquanaut

Can't wait to start my next grow! :thumbsup:

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I can't wait for you to start your next grow either xD What do you plan to do different this time round?

On a different note... I tried to give you some rep when I posted in your thread yesterday and the system wouldn`t let me!

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Originally Posted by PhatJay

I can't wait for you to start your next grow either xD What do you plan to do different this time round?

On a different note... I tried to give you some rep when I posted in your thread yesterday and the system wouldn`t let me!

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Well for my next grow I'm going a little different.

I recently acquired trays that are about 8 feet long by 3 feet wide by 6" tall. I plan on filling the entire thing with coco on a table with some drainage on the bottom to waste. Then have a timer turn on a pump from a reservoir every morning to flood the entire tray. Figure I can just transplant clones / germinated seeds into the coco "bed" and let them grow openly in the tray.

We'll see how it goes. :thumbsup:

Hi PhatJay, interesting looking grow. You asked about the way I use molasses... um but with what you're already using, it would truly be overkill.

I can't see what I'm doing being a benefit while you're still using boost and cannazyme, so I wont take up space in details here, unless you are still interested in alternatives.

sara.

nice grow phat....i like your idea of the muffin fan....i have a spare one and i am going to do something similar....thanks for the idea! :thumbsup:

keep her green..she's lookin nice :smokin:

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Originally Posted by sarah louise

I can't see what I'm doing being a benefit while you're still using boost and cannazyme, so I wont take up space in details here, unless you are still interested in alternatives.

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Thanks for stopping by. :)

I am only using boost and cannazyme because I got them for free, so I am definitely interested in alternatives, especially cheap ones. Having read a few posts most people seem to use 1tspn/gal, but I noticed a difference in feeding schedules, seeing as you grow in coco and get great results, I would really like to know more about how you use molasses.

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Originally Posted by stra8outtaWeed

nice grow phat....i like your idea of the muffin fan....i have a spare one and i am going to do something similar....thanks for the idea! :thumbsup:

keep her green..she's lookin nice :smokin:

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Nice to know your visit to my humble grow log was fruitful :D I always enjoy visiting yours for the bud porn.

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Originally Posted by PhatJay

Thanks for stopping by. :)

I am only using boost and cannazyme because I got them for free, so I am definitely interested in alternatives, especially cheap ones. Having read a few posts most people seem to use 1tspn/gal, but I noticed a difference in feeding schedules, seeing as you grow in coco and get great results, I would really like to know more about how you use molasses.

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No worries then, I dilute molasses with equal parts warm water and seaweed extract, allow it to ferment and then bottle. This makes it much easier to work with on a daily basis. When you dilute molasses, fermentation is impossible to prevent, even pure molasses will ferment given hot enough temps for long enough. If you don't happen to have constant +25C the fermentation may be pretty slow, if so you can just bottle it and open the bottle once a day to allow the built up gas to escape.

Rates of Application.

Presoak for peat or coco pucks 0.25ml/L (mixed with same amount of A+B and PK)
Young rooted clones and seedlings 0.5ml/L every second or third watering
Vegging plants 1ml/L every second watering
Early flowering plants 1ml/L every watering
Mid flowering 2-3ml/L every watering
late flowering 1-2ml/L " " " "

And when the weather is very hot and I am watering flowering plants twice a day, I tend to split the feed and give the A+B and PK in the morning and the homebrew at night. Otherwise it is all in one feed.

I'm thinking of making a second brew for flowering, adding in some alfalfa (lucerne). I have a friend who has raved over alfalfa for years so I thought I'd trial it against the 2 part brew and see if there is any difference. Just have to sort a way of introducing the alfalfa without losing the stability of the solution. ATM after the fermentation is complete the mixture will keep for several months without noticeable deterioration.

Thankyou for taking the time to write such a comprehensive answer. :thumbsup:

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Originally Posted by sarah louise

I dilute molasses with equal parts warm water and seaweed extract, allow it to ferment and then bottle.

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Do you know if Seaweed Extract is similar to Sea Minerals? As I had a bottle of sea minerals in my box of free food.

Agricultural Organics - Sea Minerals
Phosphate - 4.51%
Soluble Potash - 2.94%
Magnesium - 10.32%
Sulphur - 3.97%
Sodium - 1.86%

Should look into Maxicrop Liquid Seaweed (Kelp Extract). Friend introduced me to this- I haven't used it yet but it sounds promising.

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Derived from fresh Norwegian kelp (Ascophyllum nodosum), Maxicrop Kelp contains over 70 minerals, micronutrients, amino acids and vitamins. Also contains growth regulators which stimulate vigorous root development and plant growth. Encourages tolerance to plant stresses such as frost, pests, disease and drought. 10.7 oz. wettable powder (WP) makes one gallon of concentrate and is OMRI Listed for use in organic production (powder only).

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Found online for about $8.50, maybe it's similar to Rhizotonic :hippy:

Started adding PK to my feed (Agricultural Organics PK 19.5/21). The girls are looking healthy, but bud formation is still slower than last time. Hopefully it will start to speed up.

Main Cola (Plant D)
http://imgur.com/Nis8Vl.jpg

Four Tops
http://imgur.com/Ir6yOl.jpg

The Jungle
http://imgur.com/RhoPWl.jpg

Quote:

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Originally Posted by aquanaut

Should look into Maxicrop Liquid Seaweed (Kelp Extract).

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Cheers mate... :thumbsup:

Although I used the manufacturers recommended dosage, it looks like this Agricultural Organics PK (19.5/21) is a little too strong for my ladies. They have a tiny little touch of nute burn on the tips of 2 or 3 of the lowest fan leaves, so I am going to back off the PK to half dosage till day 35 and then try 3/4 dosage.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by aquanaut

Should look into Maxicrop Liquid Seaweed (Kelp Extract).

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Yep, that's what I am using.

GREAT LOOKINâ?? PLANTS, MON!

Great tip on the trade show thing! Thanx!!!

I love the idea of the 'Grow Show' tradeshow visit! I have always been a tradeshow slut as far as freebies go, and usually manage to score a lotta stuph, but I hadn't thought about it for my current hobby....

Muah hah hah...

Gon' hit up de nex' TO gawden shoaw... ;)

Looking good Phatjay, cant wait to see how much they give ya, dry weight.

The bud growth on my girls has exploded in the last 7 days. Unfortunately the camera I borrow to take my pics has gone on holiday, so the only picture I have is one I took 3 days after the last one (Day 31). The difference between the 2 pics is very noticeable and the buds are even bigger now (Day 35) so hopefully next weeks pics should make a few mouths water.

Plant D Main Cola (Day 31) (click for hi-res versions)...............................Plant D Main Cola (Day 28)
http://imgur.com/QsRovl.jpg http://imgur.com/Nis8Vl.jpg

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Originally Posted by CovertCarpenter

Gon' hit up de nex' TO gawden shoaw... ;)

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Just be careful you don't bump into me, I have fast feet and sharp elbows. :D

Quote:

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Originally Posted by COOLWHIP

Looking good Phatjay, cant wait to see how much they give ya, dry weight.

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I can't wait either! I got 2oz a plant last time, if I match that I will be happy, if I beat it, I will be ecstatic.

I'm no expert but perhaps look into chopping some of those fan leaves to let the light into the buds.

Excellent looking grow!

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Originally Posted by bigsby

I'm no expert but perhaps look into chopping some of those fan leaves to let the light into the buds.

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I am no expert either, but between what I have read, my own limited knowledge of plant biology and gut instincts, I think the larger fan leaves are very important.

Here's an article on fan leaf function, maybe it will change your opinion. :)

HOW DO FAN LEAVES FUNCTION T - Fan Leaf Function - VSbge4Wu - Pastebin.com

Like I said, I'm no expert...

A little further reading determines that opinions vary widely. Some advocate removing *some* fan leaves so that light reaches further down the plant, some advocate training them down, some advocate cutting them in half (i.e. cutting off the tips), and some advocate leaving them alone.

I can see the merits of getting them out of the way so that the light better reaches the the lower parts of the plant. That way the lower leaves can do the work needed to feed bud sites further down the plant thereby increasing yield. That said, I can definitely see the argument for not removing them. Of course, scrog deals with this issue quite nicely.

I'm learning all the time.

I agree this is a debated subject and there are differences of opinion. I do believe that there are some situations in which trimming fan leaves is advantageous.

THEORIES WHY TO TRIM FAN LEAVES Increase Lower Bud Development The fan leaves shade lower buds and that these buds do not develop to there full potential because of a reduction in lighting intensity due to shading from upper fan leaves. To conserve energy for upper bud development Trimming fan leaves and lower, shaded branches focuses the plantâ??s development on main top buds (Che Bleu, 03. 13.2002). A plant wastes precious energy several ways. A tall plant needs to use energy to build extra stem, and then use extra energy to move water up higher, this is why I believe "scrog" methods are productive. An untrimmed bushy plant causes the plant to expend energy to build elaborate branches and leaves, and then has to use excess energy to supply all these structures. Careful trimming to remove unnecessary branches (which wont produce nice buds) and unproductive suckers will leave more energy for a larger yield. Suckers do exactly as their name suggests, they suck needless energy from the plant which can be put to better use, towards yield (Leaf, 03.13.2002). Reduce the Stretch If fan leaves are trimmed during the early flowering stage, the stretch is reduced (Che Bleu, 03.13.2002). Reducing the stretch might be advantageous in certain cultivation conditions. Speeding Up The Flushing Process Remove some of the fan leaves 14 days before harvest. It helps speed up the flushing process and or makes flushing unnecessary (Homemadepot, 03.13.2002). Reduce The Chance of Mould Removal of dead fan leaves is necessary to reduce the risk of mould. Failing to "clear the airway" can lead to development of mould in the "crowded" areas of the plant (Jeast, 03.13.2002). Scrog growers may also reduce the chance of mould by removing fan leaves due to reduce the level of transpiration. This is because many scrog grows are in a confined space where humidity is a serious problem (DoctorDangerous, 09.04.2002). However with better ventilation it may be necessary to avoid the mould problem (Nietzsche, 09.04.2002). Increase root development on Clones Fan leaves on clones should have their blades cut in half, to make the clone grow slowly while a root system develops (Weezil, 03.12.2002).

I was applying my comments to your situation where training, trimming or removing some of those fans would let light further down the plant, especially given that this is a CFL grow. That said, that read was a good refresher - thanks!

My only further comments would be that dead leaves on a flowering plant should be removed as soon as they are clearly on their way out, unless you suspect issues with nutes, PH, or potting. Dying leaves are obvious vectors for diseases and pests. So removing dying leaves on a mature plant is beneficial. Also, larger, older leaves produce significantly less chlorophyll than newer, younger leaves and can be safely trimmed if needed.

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Originally Posted by bigsby

I was applying my comments to your situation where training, trimming or removing some of those fans would let light further down the plant, especially given that this is a CFL grow.

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Yeah.. I have taken the cautious approach on my grows, so I could watch and learn, then see how the various techniques affect my harvest. The 1st I did absolutely no trimming at all. On this second grow I took out some of the lower leaves and tried fimming as I was considering a scrog next time round. I am not prepared to take out these large upper fan leaves at this stage of flowering, as I plan to flower for 10 or 11 weeks this time. That said, once the top buds have completely filled out, I might follow your suggestion and remove/train the large fans.

I do appreciate your input, anything that makes me question or examine what I am doing is a good thing in my opinion. :thumbsup:

Hey - those plants are looking great. Nothing wrong with leaving well enough alone. How did the fim cut go?

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Originally Posted by bigsby

How did the fim cut go?

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It worked beautifully on one plant (four tops) but I got it wrong on the second and it grew as normal. The pics are on page 1.

Yeah that plant E is a beauty. She did really well with the fim cut. How many nodes were there when you did the cut?

Hey Phat,

You prompted a bit more research. I knew some of the pruning stuff but clearly there was more to learn - more detail on the when, why, how stuff. Also, like you, I'm reading up on scrog techniques. I came across this outstading tutorial that goes into crazy detail on pruning, fimming, scrog and much more. It is a ton of reading so use your search function! Hope it is as useful to you as it is to me.

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Originally Posted by bigsby

Yeah that plant E is a beauty. She did really well with the fim cut. How many nodes were there when you did the cut?

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Well... I reckon it was the 3rd node, this pic was taken 5 minutes before I Fimmed them (Day 15 Veg).

http://boards.cannabis.com/grow-log/...ml#post2078886

but then, I had a coupla' flower tops forming that were just a wee bit ahead of everyone else, and so I thot: "Hmm.. it can't hurt too much, why not try FIMming 'em instead..."

Even if you don't get the magical '4' or '6' flower tops you're 'supposed' to, if you do it anywhere near right, you wind up with a much bushier flowertop, or two, and this is Not a Bad Thing. You can also help keep a plant more level with judicious use of the the technique.

Had a bad bit recently where some exhaust fans weren't running for like two hours of full light, and so some wilting occurred. BIGtime. After emergency measures were taken, and some mega-fan-leaf-chopping done, I FIMmed a few tops (that were burn't) for good measure, and the results are, well, kinda spectacular...