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I'm just curious on how anybody doesn't understand and accept this. Why not? It's the only thing that can possibly even be true. All the other "theories" out there just contradict themselves and quite frankly just talk in BIG circles. I would just like some input on how all of you think about this.
Some of us need some sort of physical evidence to make an educated decision. Reading some Harry Potter book with a bunch of fables in it just isn't enough.
You call god up on your hotline there and have him give me a jingle and see if he can't talk some sense into me.
It think it all depends on who or what god is!!!!! How about Nature created all of this? :DQuote:
Originally Posted by chris62008
Why not believe that I created all of this? Only people way back when were lucky enough to have witnessed events that we now many many years later try to believe in. I think its always going to be on a level that were not capable of understanding just yet or maybe ever. just my two bits. I wish things were concrete cause I hate guessing.
well there is no physical evidence!!! thats the thing! science and technology CANNOT explain how the universe started!!! scientists don't know how the universe started!! You have to assume that there is somthing greater than us out there.Quote:
Originally Posted by killerweed420
well what was before nature than??? nothing? well that just sounds ridicouls AND stupid...Quote:
Originally Posted by gypski
No? There had to be something and its certainly not some guy sitting in the sky making book on all humanity. If you believe the guy in the sky thing, where did he come from? Its nature and science will prove it. :DQuote:
Originally Posted by chris62008
science and technology have not explained it as of yet... though you trust your life to them everyday you deny their ultimate conclusions.Quote:
Originally Posted by chris62008
yes there are lots of unanswered questions that cannot be explained yet... the big mistake is to then assume god or a higher being is behind it. science once could not explain the sun so they assumed it was a god riding a chariot. those assumptions will lead you wrong.
Logically speaking, it is your basic premise that is giving you problems.Quote:
Originally Posted by chris62008
Throughout the history of mankind, unexplained natural phenomenon has given rise to belief in "something greater than us". The human mind created a myriad of gods and demi-gods to explain things like lightning, daylight, night, storms, floods, earthquakes, volcanoes, etc. Eventually these were cobbled together to form pantheon gods.
Science has proven that lightning is not a god throwing a spear. Even before that happened, there were many people who did not believe in a god throwing a spear explanation without proof. Mainly because it was nonsensical.
I don't have to assume anything. I require evidence pure and simple. Like I say if you've got that hotline to the big guy have him give me a call and we'll see if he can convince me..Quote:
Originally Posted by chris62008
you see he's not just "some guy" sitting out in the clouds.. he's GOD. Something waaaaayyyy greater than ANY human. He has always been and always will be. And you just have to accept that because frankly, theres NO other explanation. Especiallly in "science" terms.Quote:
Originally Posted by gypski
Well than jerkoff, wheres your evidence? NO evidence you can get will prove the creation of the universe or better yet, what was BEFORE the creation of our universe. So please, SHUT UP!!!Quote:
Originally Posted by killerweed420
This guy has to be a troll. I'm not wasting any more of my time on him.
I came across this Perry guy and his information theory. I found one his premise quite interesting... DNA is not merely a molecule with a pattern; it is a code, a language, and an information storage mechanism. All codes are created by a conscious mind; there is not natural process known to science that creates coded information. Therefore DNA was designed by a Mind.
i understand the feeling some have to want the control, purpose, and sense of "something in control- aka: god" with some "greater plan." they attribute all that doesn't currently make sense to their minds and that causes unsurity and fear to a "big brother" or "big father" in the sky looking out for their good...
i understand the innate or, to use a pun, "god-given" need others have to not blindly believe tales they are told that attempt to box in the vast enigma of life and existence to some oversimplified set of rules that are constantly changing from century to century called religion and called god.
to each their own...
This is merely restating the creationist platform. Life itself is a natural process that creates coded information. Perry immediately discounts that, so it is not possible to go any further in the debate. He and his minions claim it has to occur by design. Opponents to this position claim it occurs naturally. Stalemate.Quote:
Originally Posted by Blazed Deafy
For anyone interested in the scientific rebuttal of this "challenge", here is a good article by Richard Dawkins: The Information Challenge | Australian Skeptics
yes.. plz go on living your pointless, worthless life. Well, according to you that IS REALLY how you feel about your life? I mean you seriously have no question on to how you got here? or what happens after you die? you just think that BAM! time was created and so was everything else and it all just came together like this on accident? haha THAT IS WHAT SOUNDS STUPID!!! Not the belief of GOD. lolQuote:
Originally Posted by hazetwostep
yea but the one thing is that the opponets are wrong. THE OPPONENTS believe life comes from nowhere!!! Thats incomprehensible for a human. That's why you have to accept that their is something bigger, and better than us! Once you do that you'll feel ALOT better :)Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueBlazer
It must have taken billions of years for your guy in the sky to write all that code, or its simply mutation after mutation and mistakes in the development or evolution of DNA and the diversity of species. Then because he got tired of his mistakes, he destroyed them and started anew. Or from random acts of nature through the geologic activities of the planet wiping them out and natural selection let the strongest, and smartest to survive. I believe in the random and natural selection. :DQuote:
Originally Posted by Blazed Deafy
OK, so I have some time to waste . . . :smokin:Quote:
Originally Posted by chris62008
You have convinced me with your impeccable logic. I now believe in a higher, better being than me. I now worship Bacchus.
Because only a truly wasted god would create us. :thumbsup:
NO! but your just being stupid. According to Einsteins theory of "General Relativity" their has to be a higher being of some sort. Einstein himself (smartest man to live probably) even concedes to a belief in God.Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueBlazer
Now as for saying a certain religion. Well... The "Holy Bible" is the only "Holy" book to explain a CREATION of time... Others speak of their Gods being created WITHIN time... The Holy Bible speaks over a dozen times about the creation of our universe... One of my favorite quotes is Hebrews 11:3. "The universe that we detect was made from that which we cannot detect" or "the things which are seen were not made of things which do appear" simple proof of an existing God!!! It's all really good stuff. I hope you enjoyed getting schooled!
Schooled?!? By you? Bwahahahaha.Quote:
Originally Posted by chris62008
First, Einstein did believe in god, but the theory relativity has nothing to do with god. You're thinking of the unified field theory which he was never able to prove. Second, no matter how smart he was he was just a man and obviously as subject to superstition as anyone.
I'm a preacher's kid son. Unlike you I have read the "holy" bible from cover to cover. I was born and raised in the church. I just don't believe in it. I will never believe in it and nothing an amateur like you can say will change that. Especially some selected verses your preacher told you to read . . . :cool:
BTW ~ Bacchus created time so he'd have something else to waste . . .
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueBlazer
there you go blaze.. what is that Roman?? lol
i am pagean, my family has been almost solidly druidic for the past 2000+ years.. i have not ever had that much interest in the things my mom tries to teach me, i find them kinda boring but she is fairly 'enlightened' and believes in recording the stories and teachings for dumb guys like me who dont pay attention when they are young and regret it for the rest of their lives..
so yes i do believe in a greater being.. Gia, the earth.. well thats the closest i can come to using written word because the one i was taught cant be written.. but i believe in the earth and it has been there before man. and man created 'GOD' so that he could brave the dark night. rather than embrace the natural order man decided he was GREATER than Gia and he was allowed to rule Her. now look where we are 2010 years later!!
lol if your GOD was so powerful he wouldnt allow his 'chosen' to be killed off by MY god Gia every year. GOD would protect them right?? GOD does protect the righteous, correct?? and he wont let the 'pure' fall till the revelations, right?? or is revelations already gone and we got left behind and god doesnt hear us anymore and we are all damned...ha ha ha ha. take your pick but either way GOD DOES NOT EXIST the way you see him
:D :D :D ;)
i am also about allowing people to make mistakes if they want.
have fun preaching bro
-J
i am pagean, my family has been almost solidly druidic for the past 2000+ years..
Pics or it didn't happen :D i have much respect for the Druids but no family has been druidic for 2000 years. The modern druid movement has been around for 150 years at the very most, and theres no way anyone can claim that they are descended from Iron Age druids :D
apologies, it's just that im a bit of a pre-history buff and i couldn't let that one slide.
family history goes way back, but i was being kinda exaggerated to get my point across....sorry i didnt think people would be quite so literal in this line of debate... about GOD.
so my bad...but our family history goes back before the crossing to america and we were on the mayflower.. i will find the pics of the family tree for ya'll and they show us moving to america somewhere around the middle of the chart...so yes i do claim to be descended from 'iron age' druids but i cant prove it that far back but i think i got at lease 300+ provable years and many more are talked about in some of the stories i was told as a youth by my parents..
hope that clears that up a bit
-J
lol :thumbsup:Quote:
Originally Posted by mainegrown
of course there is something bigger than us. trees are bigger than us, mountains are bigger than us, the earth is bigger than us, the universe is bigger than us. is there something better than us? well, i suppose what your definition of better is. there is a great deal that is more powerful, more gentle, more seemingly rational than humanity, but do these things make them better than a man? of course not, merely different.Quote:
Originally Posted by chris62008
there is so much we do not understand, so much we will never understand. that doesn't mean we should merely stamp those things as the domain of god and refuse to investigate them, that is what we do when we blindly accept the limitations that religion places on us. simply defining those things as the works of some sentient creature beyond our comprehension is the ultimate act of surrender and an insult to the potential of humanity.
do you really just want to feel a lot better? if so, clear your mind of all rational thought and indulge in the complacency of the idiot. life is not about merely feeling better, but striving to feel better. the struggle is the point of life.Quote:
Once you do that you'll feel A LOT better
thanks you hit it right on :thumbsup:Quote:
Originally Posted by delusionsofNORMALity
-J
Quote:
Originally Posted by delusionsofNORMALity
I feel just fine. Matter of fact I feel GREAT, KNOWING that their IS a God. Science itself even proves it with DNA but ignorant people just ignore that fact I guess. Even some of the "smartest" naturalists will concede that, even they, don't know what created life. They are just left talking in circles about how things just magicilly create themselves. lol. Thats nonsense if you ask me. lol
Bacchus 1:1-9
1. On on the first day Bacchus created man, woman, animals, dinosaurs, aliens, and a bunch of other stuff 2. (days were really, really, really long back then). 3. The last thing he created was cannabis. 4. On the second day, he rested. 5. On the third day, he got ready to do some more creating right after some bong hits. 6. On the fourth day, he forgot what he was going to create. 7. On the fifth day, he rested. 8. On the sixth day, he created brownies and put some cannabis in them. 9. On the seventh day, he created music and spent the day chilling and recuperating from a long week.
Book of B yo! :D
You can prove God's existance and that is through your own desire. The only 'evidence' to somone unwilling to do this in my opinion would be the countless abundance of spiritual books each one claiming things beyond our perception and most of them, though written by different people in different languages accross the world, share many similarities in their message.Quote:
Originally Posted by chris62008
admitting what you don't know is the beginning of wisdom. those who blindly claim that creation is the domain of a god can never hope to rise above their own preconceptions, they can only feign wisdom as they wallow in their ignorance.Quote:
Originally Posted by chris62008
magic? magic is the bailiwick of the religious and the "spiritually" obsessed. what may appear magical to us now might be explained tomorrow and seem mundane the following week. if the term magic can be applied to anything, it is the fantasy of gods and the miraculous nature of religion.Quote:
They are just left talking in circles about how things just magically create themselves.
you judge my life as pointless? i have been happily married for five years to the love of my life who i would gladly give my life for. i have parents who have been happily married for almost forty years and a sister who i call a best friend too. i love them and cherish them more than anything. i am healthy and happy as a nurse who works with children cancer patients helping them and their families through life and death.Quote:
Originally Posted by chris62008
you are arrogant enough to say my life is pointless? if your god is as uncaring and arrogant as you, i wouldn't want to meet him. if you are delusional enough to believe that you follow a god of love, that is simply sad. life is beautiful and this is our only chance at it. i cherish and value life more than anyone who believes that life is a "test run" to get ready for "true eternity" in "heaven."
it doesn't matter how i got here, it only matter that i am here.
it doesn't matter where i go when i die because i am too busy living.
you say it doesn't make sense that there can be such order in the universe without an intelligence to create it. then who created that intelligence? keep a sound and logical thought process and you will see your argument chokes itself. if you say god just always was, then i say the universe just always was and that doesn't make any less sense.. it just doesn't take thoughtless, blind faith to believe in. you have repeatable data to stand upon.
no, science doesn't have all the answers yet, but it is objectively working toward it. religion has been defending disproved ideas for thousands of years from the earth being flat to 7 days of creation to a world-wide total flood.
not to play devils advocate but this douche has the right (1st amendment anyone??) to believe and say what he wants AS LONG AS it does not interfere with the life liberty or happiness of others...
and we dont have to listen to his b.s.
also can any of you prove there ISNT a god??
remember the human mind is way more powerful than modern science can quantify right now and we could just MAKE a god for ourselves with OUR minds...lol
have fuun
-J
Never assume to know anything, a lack of explanation cannot be replaced by fantasy.Quote:
Originally Posted by chris62008
As for something greater than us, that's pretty much a forgone conclusion unless you subscribe to the arrogance of humans in believing that we are the peak of stellar intelligence and I don't.
yo man stop being so defensive. lol. I never called your life worthless.. YOU DID!!!!! Believing that you are just here, to be here, is totally blunt. You might as well say "MY LIFE IS WORTHLESS!!!" and that is what you said. That theres really NO reason for us to live... so our lives our WORTHLESS??? hmmm I THINK NOT!!!!! :)Quote:
Originally Posted by hazetwostep
To be brutally honest I do believe our individual lives to be a tiny little thing on a stellar scale.
I think you are forgetting something here, that believers such as my self admit to not knowing everything but, the one thing we do know is that their is a greater power then ourselves. The people who are truly ignorant are the ones who believe science can explain everything to them.Quote:
Originally Posted by delusionsofNORMALity
Well what is science? It is our PERCEPTION of the way things work in the world around us. Science is nothing more than a way of man to blind himself of the truth and feel powerful, when in fact the truth is we will never know everything, in our present state anyways. Science is always speaking of something new or unknown that the are on the verge of discovering. What does that discovery do? It makes them realize that their is another variable they forgot to put in the "equation" of the universe you know, then they look for a new thing to say is creating theses forces or acts. It is a merry go round their is never a end. If you believe in string theory then you must know that their seems to be something always smaller that we didn't know existed. Another thing science puts a label on to feel in control of the universe around us,but really they know a lot less about the world around us than we really think. If you want to believe in science so much, science it self has spoke of different dimensions that we can not perceive. You know why because we ARE limited. We are limited to our bodies and our minds, OUR way of perceiving the world around us.
i have forgotten nothing. given an infinite amount of time, we might very well be able to understand the infinite number of things we do not now understand. of course we don't have all of eternity to make those discoveries and will have to satisfy ourselves with the little time we have, but in order to understand anything we must first be willing to start the search. blind belief in that sentient "greater power" admits defeat before we even begin. most all deities have that one thing in common, their ways are mysterious and unknowable by their very nature. admitting to that unknowable force is the first step in blinding ourselves to what is knowable - everything.Quote:
Originally Posted by apocolips31
it seems you understand it, but the blinders of faith will not allow you to appreciate a very simple truth - there is never an end to discovery. with each new bit of understanding more questions reveal themselves. there is no final solution as there is to be found in religion, no simple answer to end all questions. that is the nature of scientific inquiry.Quote:
Science is always speaking of something new or unknown that the are on the verge of discovering. What does that discovery do? It makes them realize that their is another variable they forgot to put in the "equation" of the universe you know, then they look for a new thing to say is creating theses forces or acts. It is a merry go round there is never a end.
Good answer delusionsofNORMALity. :thumbsup:
Religion is anti knowledge. It is about coming to grips with the death fear and feeling better about things. Nothing wrong with that if it keeps you from popping your cork, but it doesn't make it true.