Long time grower seeks LED information.

If you follow the links in my signature, you will see that I am a long time grower. I came here to cannabis.com after overgrow.com was shut down. I have dabbled with cultivation growing in totes, cabinets, and closets. I have also done multiple multiple grows in both soil and hydroponic media using both CFLs and HPS lightning. :jointsmile:

I would like to think that that I am fairly adept in all things cannabis; however, I need help from my fellow readers in regards to LED lightning information.

Quite a few months back shit hit the fan so to speak and to cover my ass, I was forced to get rid of EVERYTHING. From containers to lights to air pumps, from hydroton to pipes to rolling pappers to nutes... To yes... even distruction of my beloved cabinet... even my grow books and journals. :(

Bottom line is that I feel that it is safe to start back up, only this time I wish to keep my grow on the smallest of scales using 2 steralite totes. (Because God almighty I miss my sacred herb :jointsmile: ) One for veg/clones, the other for small scale SoG flowering.

Given the nature of the confined space I will be utilizing, I feel that LEDs due to efficency and the substantially insignificiant amount of heat produced will be ideal for the miniature scale in which I wish to employ.

I have read the boards many times over searching for quality LED grow lightning information; however, the only information that I can ever find seem s to deal with much larger scale grows.

I guess my question for those adept with LED lightning technology is this:

How many watts of LEDs would one need to produce a small scale 1ftx1ft1ft container with between 4 and 6 plants SoG style, and what would your reccomendation(s) be for optimum flowering R/B spectrum wavelenghts for quality yields?

Sorry for the lenghty post. Thank you in advanced for your time.

~BHB420
:greenthumb:

Hey,
From personal experience I can reccomend the Procyon 100 grow light. It might be a bit much for your 1x1x1, but worked great in my 3x3 closet with 4 23w cfls. I have a 4'' PC fan mounted in the ceiling for exhaust and have not had any real heat issues. It got a bit warm in the room a few days this summer (90) but caused no damage. Right now the closed closet is only 3-4 degrees above ambient room temp. Getting ready to harvest. You can check my log too for more info. Good luck!

I realize now I really didn't answer your question, (my 1st LED/indoor grow) but hopefully it helped.

I'll take stab at it.

All I can offer is personal experience, but I have grown some large, tight buds in a 2' X 2' area with 56 Watts of 660 nm. and 460 nm. Ledengin emitters with a ratio of 4:1.

About $170 worth of parts for the "cake-pan" light.

'bout $250 for the 150 Watt "Frankenlight".

There's pics in my albums.

Course now I'm seeing UFO knock offs on da bay for $150 w/shipping.
But, dunno how well they grow.
I was impressed with what my homebrewed light produced.
Rivaled their outdoor twins. :thumbsup:

Aloha
an a ha'penny,

Weezard

I have a couple UFO grows completed and the one thing I noticed is that the plants did not like the LED to be too close to them... maybe it was the strain? But I have to keep it about 12-15" above my plants or they definitely show me they arent happy. I dont know if they would work in that small of an area, but im no expert just telling you my exp.

Weez,

How did you get all those parts for around $250? Aren't those 15W reds $31 each? Eight of the reds takes us to $248. Then two blues is another $58.

Meanwell for blues is $55, Heatsink is $30, Mastech to put it all together and drive most of the reds is $165?

I had the cost of your light around $540. If you could put one together for less than $350 I'd pay you to do it for me. I'm not too good with soldering and would probably waste way too many LED's. I had to supplement my 120W 1W base LED lamp with eight 23W CFL's. Not too happy with my results. Did alright, but nowhere near yours.

I have contemplated just going to a 400W HPS for flowering due to cost. I'd much rather stick with the LEDs due to power consumption and heat disbursion.

Please light the way....

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ledtime

Weez,

How did you get all those parts for around $250?

Clever shopping!:D

Aren't those 15W reds $31 each? Eight of the reds takes us to $248. Then two blues is another $58.

Bought a few, got a small discount But, you're right.
The red leds were about $270 by themselves.
Plus $ 20 for my 12V source $10 for the 15V source, $30 for the 'sink w/shipping, $12 for the fan and $15 for the ducting.
Actual parts cost? about $400!
.
Guess if I really paid attention to the cost, I wouldn't have done it. :D

Meanwell for blues is $55,

Nope.


Heatsink is $30, Mastech to put it all together and drive most of the reds is $165?

That's in da tools budget.:)

I had the cost of your light around $540. If you could put one together for less than $350 I'd pay you to do it for me.

No can!
Would not have built it for me, If I could have just bought something decent.
I'm hoping that the new 126W. panels test well. They run 'bout $400. ea.

I'm not too good with soldering and would probably waste way too many LED's. I had to supplement my 120W 1W base LED lamp with eight 23W CFL's. Not too happy with my results. Did alright, but nowhere near yours.

Did you use 660nm emitters?
That's what made the difference for me.:cool:


I have contemplated just going to a 400W HPS for flowering due to cost. I'd much rather stick with the LEDs due to power consumption and heat disbursion.

Please light the way....

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Dunno 'bout dat.
But, I will say I'm not thrilled with one Watt emitters, or with 625nm. red emitters.
Plant's optimum wavelength is at 652nm.
So, 635 will work, but 660 nm. does more with less.
Just my opinion based on my observations.
Even the "cake pan" grew good bud with only 56Watts!

Always willing to read different opinions 'bout everything.
And thanks for makin' me look at da real numbers.

Aloha,
Weeze

Here's my take on it:

$2 per watt for top-quality emitters. Slight discounts for volume purchases.

Meanwell drivers are about $1 per watt. The PLN60-15 is currently $55 (I think that's what ledtime was referring to) but that'll drive 60 watts of blue leds -- that's enough for 4 Procyon eqivalents (in flowering lamps). If cost is an issue, I'd use 15W 660nm for red, and a CFL or T5 for blue. Otherwise, your blue driver's almost wasted driving just 1 or 2 blues.

I tend not to figure in costs for kick-ass heatsinks (you can use "scrap" aluminum, or copper) PC fans (gotta dozen or so layin' around) or soldering and equipment like a volt-ohm meter. Where you expense a Mastech bench supply is up to you. It's not required to build a light. But it'll let you "dial in" the leds to whatever YOU decide is the most effective way to run them. And the Mastech can double as a driver.

So, $3 per watt's still my claim. If you wanna get into building your own power supplies using LM317's or similar, those devices cost mere pennies--that's how the Chinese UFO's can be made so inexpensively. (That, and using basically obsolete, low powered leds in bought in huge quantities at steep discounts.)

You can get a 20 amp 12V supply for what, $20? (Prolly got summa dem roun' heah, too.) So, doing it that way, your power supplies can cost almost nothing. You could run a blue or two off an old wall wart with an LM317 added to regulate current. Cost just a few bucks for the whole assembly.

The Meanwells, IMO, are just too good a bargain to pass up, and you can certainly re-sell them when you're done with 'em. I'm gonna build myself some power supplies when I get a round tuit, just for fun. But I'm willing to pay for the Meanwells, even though I could build my own for less $. I think they're worth it.

Acquiring all the odds and ends you need to build the first 75-watt led light might be pretty pricey if you have no tools or scrap electronics to start with. But if you can get one going, adding onto it is simple and very cost effective.

P.S. I just retired my Procyon. It worked well enough to replace my HPS, but these 15 watt 660's are totally kicking its ass as a flowering lamp. The Procyon, remember, cost $6 per watt. :eek:

all I can say is stay away from the ufo-their round for starters-and they cant compete with the type of set-up that the Weeze is talking about.Big monster diodes- ufo and 1w panel dealers will talk about the efficiency of the 1w diode, but the best led grows you'll see are with those high power, high quality diodes.Heres the inside of a 90w ufo-

some ufo(2-3)/panels/floods-you name it-300+ watts at times in a 2x2 homebox....I really dont know what I was thinking

cool looking...but not very productive.Heres some pics taken today of my hps/mh grow-400w hps/250w mh+ 2 45w cfl's

I'm just not interested enough anymore to build a big rig, so it's hid for me.Just a little heads up on the ufo-cant say anything about any other style as I havent used anything else, but-I cant imagine anything with 1w diodes being any different.

did I use the word "any" enough in that post?

just for scale on the hid grow-heres a pic I took 3 or 4 days ago.When I grew led, I wouldnt put a lighter next to my buds

Cool gutshots, Beef74! I was wondering what was in those--although there's probably a buncha different versions. Those innards look better than I would have expected. Looks like a dedicated unregulated supply for the fans and separate drivers for the reds and blues. Coulda been worse...

As far as the OP's problem, I vegged an outdoor sativa (I'm a dumbass) in a 15"d x 13"h x 11"w box, but had to move to something slightly bigger for flower to accommodate light traps for the ventilation. I used a top-center mounted CFL, and LST'd the sativa around it like an olive around a pimento. That worked, but I don't know if the OP needs everything enclosed within that cubic foot (ducts and all) or if the plant(s) get the whole volume. That is REALLY not much room, and heat's gonna be an issue.

I was thinking maybe something like the HGL 14 watt panels, and build the box so the panels form the ceiling and at least a wall or two, maybe all around--surround the plant with low-power panels that the plant can actually touch. The junction heat would be on the outside of the enclosure, so maybe...

But I've never worked with those things. The diodes I'm using will bleach your plants snow white if they're within 3 inches, and the blues will actually stop a plant from growing if they're cranked up. Make the leaves twist and turn avoiding the light. A Procyon will do that too, because of the lensing on the leds. The Procyon's designed to be used more like an HID in terms of working distance. I assumed from how users describe their UFO's that most of those leds have a fairly tight beam angle, also--otherwise the working distance would hafta be real close. So, no room for the hi-power stuff in a tiny box. Maybe an un-lensed kinda UFO, but if this is super-stealth that UFO sitting on top of the enclosure's gonna give it away...

So, Beef74--did you have decent panels? Might something like that work for Bonghitboy, if he basically builds his enclosure out of them?

Nice pics, BTW. The LED plants look good, too. It's obvious you know how to grow. :thumbsup:

If you ever crack those drivers open, post a pic, please? (Just curious what they did.) :D

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DreadedHermie

Cool gutshots, Beef74! I was wondering what was in those--although there's probably a buncha different versions. Those innards look better than I would have expected. Looks like a dedicated unregulated supply for the fans and separate drivers for the reds and blues. Coulda been worse...

As far as the OP's problem, I vegged an outdoor sativa (I'm a dumbass) in a 15"d x 13"h x 11"w box, but had to move to something slightly bigger for flower to accommodate light traps for the ventilation. I used a top-center mounted CFL, and LST'd the sativa around it like an olive around a pimento. That worked, but I don't know if the OP needs everything enclosed within that cubic foot (ducts and all) or if the plant(s) get the whole volume. That is REALLY not much room, and heat's gonna be an issue.

I was thinking maybe something like the HGL 14 watt panels, and build the box so the panels form the ceiling and at least a wall or two, maybe all around--surround the plant with low-power panels that the plant can actually touch. The junction heat would be on the outside of the enclosure, so maybe...

But I've never worked with those things. The diodes I'm using will bleach your plants snow white if they're within 3 inches, and the blues will actually stop a plant from growing if they're cranked up. Make the leaves twist and turn avoiding the light. A Procyon will do that too, because of the lensing on the leds. The Procyon's designed to be used more like an HID in terms of working distance. I assumed from how users describe their UFO's that most of those leds have a fairly tight beam angle, also--otherwise the working distance would hafta be real close. So, no room for the hi-power stuff in a tiny box. Maybe an un-lensed kinda UFO, but if this is super-stealth that UFO sitting on top of the enclosure's gonna give it away...

So, Beef74--did you have decent panels? Might something like that work for Bonghitboy, if he basically builds his enclosure out of them?

Nice pics, BTW. The LED plants look good, too. It's obvious you know how to grow. :thumbsup:

If you ever crack those drivers open, post a pic, please? (Just curious what they did.) :D

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thanks brother...I'll have those drivers flayed open for you tomorrow-how bout that high tek cooling system.Nah...you homebrew cats got the right idea.Like I said the only decent led grows I've seen used 3w and up.Procyon didnt do bad at all tho.And the lumigrow is pullin some nice nugs.But these mutant beasts you guys build are what catch my eye.The china panels...I wouldnt let them take up space in my grow-room.They just cant justify the cost for the performance.Weeze busted one of those things apart a while back I believe...Weeze wasnt impressed, from my gatherings.They just have absolutely no output.I'd recommend doing what you guys are doing-diy.Let me see if I can pull up this really cool led spider lights diy.

"Autos" LED/CF guide - LED Home Build (Hello friends ! ) Marijuana Growing

Beef, I've got some pics in a "private" album. 3'+ plants under leds. Sent you a friend offer so you can see 'em. I have a patented LST method. I have my trophy wife sit on them to bend 'em over. ;)

It was just seed from some "commercial" indica smoke, so the frost ain't real showy. But don't be fooled...white you out. :stoned:

Build these lights in a couple hours. Send a Procyon home with its tail between its legs, and I thought those were pretty decent. (Too blue to flower real well, though, IMO.)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DreadedHermie

Beef, I've got some pics in a "private" album. 3'+ plants under leds. Sent you a friend offer so you can see 'em. I have a patented LST method. I have my trophy wife sit on them to bend 'em over. ;)

It was just seed from some "commercial" indica smoke, so the frost ain't real showy. But don't be fooled...white you out. :stoned:

Build these lights in a couple hours. Send a Procyon home with its tail between its legs, and I thought those were pretty decent. (Too blue to flower real well, though, IMO.)

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Bagseed can do some amazing things when grown with a little TLC.And that plant is crazy man, reminds me of my last pull.Heres a shot of her-got a little over 6 oz's with this gal.Not my best pull, but Nightshade is some sweet ass smoke-

what the hell...I liked that plant...heres a couple more

Very nice.

Does look similar, I agree. :thumbsup:

Pretty nice yield for that footprint, by anybody's reckoning.

(Sounds like Jed Clampett...)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DreadedHermie

Very nice.

Does look similar, I agree. :thumbsup:

Pretty nice yield for that footprint, by anybody's reckoning.

(Sounds like Jed Clampett...)

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thanks man, I just had those other 4 big bangs in there with her, and I should've done her alone.But...I figure the big bangs will be done in 3 weeks, predicting around 12 oz's.That'll give me over a pound between 2 harvests-3 weeks apart.I just didnt time it right.

L.e.d got served!~!