Comcast blocking BitTorrent users

I don't use it (I use limewire) but heres the story ( I know a bunch of you do!):

U.S. ISP blocking BitTorrent users
PETER SVENSSON

Associated Press

October 19, 2007 at 11:08 AM EDT

NEW YORK â?? Comcast Corp. actively interferes with attempts by some of its high-speed Internet subscribers to share files online, a move that runs counter to the tradition of treating all types of Net traffic equally.

The interference, which The Associated Press confirmed through nationwide tests, is the most drastic example yet of data discrimination by a U.S. Internet service provider. It involves company computers masquerading as those of its users.

If widely applied by other ISPs, the technology Comcast is using would be a crippling blow to the BitTorrent, eDonkey and Gnutella file-sharing networks. While these are mainly known as sources of copyright music, software and movies, BitTorrent in particular is emerging as a legitimate tool for quickly disseminating legal content.

The principle of equal treatment of traffic, called "Net Neutrality" by proponents, is not enshrined in law but supported by some regulations. Most of the debate around the issue has centred on tentative plans, now postponed, by large Internet carriers to offer preferential treatment of traffic from certain content providers for a fee.

Comcast's interference, on the other hand, appears to be an aggressive way of managing its network to keep file-sharing traffic from swallowing too much bandwidth and affecting the Internet speeds of other subscribers.

Comcast, largest cable TV operator and No. 2 Internet provider in the United States, would not specifically address the practice, but spokesman Charlie Douglas confirmed that it uses sophisticated methods to keep Net connections running smoothly.

"Comcast does not block access to any applications, including BitTorrent," he said.

Douglas would not specify what the company means by "access" â?? Comcast subscribers can download BitTorrent files without hindrance. Only uploads of complete files are blocked or delayed by the company, as indicated by AP tests.

But with "peer-to-peer" technology, users exchange files with each other, and one person's upload is another's download. That means Comcast's blocking of certain uploads has repercussions in the global network of file sharers.

Comcast's technology kicks in, though not consistently, when one BitTorrent user attempts to share a complete file with another user.

Each PC gets a message invisible to the user that looks like it comes from the other computer, telling it to stop communicating. But neither message originated from the other computer â?? it comes from Comcast. If it were a telephone conversation, it would be like the operator breaking into the conversation, telling each talker in the voice of the other: "Sorry, I have to hang up. Good bye."

Matthew Elvey, a Comcast subscriber in the San Francisco area who has noticed BitTorrent uploads being stifled, acknowledged that the company has the right to manage its network, but disapproves of the method, saying it appears to be deceptive.

"There's the wrong way of going about that and the right way," said Elvey, who is a computer consultant.

Comcast's interference affects all types of content, meaning that, for instance, an independent movie producer who wanted to distribute his work using BitTorrent and his Comcast connection could find that difficult or impossible â?? as would someone pirating music.

Internet service providers have long complained about the vast amounts of traffic generated by a small number of subscribers who are avid users of file-sharing programs. Peer-to-peer applications account for between 50 per cent and 90 per cent of overall Internet traffic, according to a survey this year by ipoque GmbH, a German vendor of traffic-management equipment.

"We have a responsibility to manage our network to ensure all our customers have the best broadband experience possible," Douglas said. "This means we use the latest technologies to manage our network to provide a quality experience for all Comcast subscribers."

The practice of managing the flow of Internet data is known as "traffic shaping," and is already widespread among Internet service providers. It usually involves slowing down some forms of traffic, like file-sharing, while giving others priority. Other ISPs have attempted to block some file-sharing application by so-called "port filtering," but that method is easily circumvented and now largely ineffective.

Comcast's approach to traffic shaping is different because of the drastic effect it has on one type of traffic â?? in some cases blocking it rather than slowing it down â?? and the method used, which is difficult to circumvent and involves the company falsifying network traffic.

The "Net Neutrality" debate erupted in 2005, when AT&T Inc. suggested it would like to charge some Web companies more for preferential treatment of their traffic. Consumer advocates and Web heavyweights like Google Inc. and Amazon Inc. cried foul, saying it's a bedrock principle of the Internet that all traffic be treated equally.

To get its acquisition of BellSouth Corp. approved by the Federal Communications Commission, AT&T agreed in late 2006 not to implement such plans or prioritize traffic based on its origin for two and a half years. However, it did not make any commitments not to prioritize traffic based on its type, which is what Comcast is doing.

The FCC's stance on traffic shaping is not clear. A 2005 policy statement says that "consumers are entitled to run applications and services of their choice," but that principle is "subject to reasonable network management." Spokeswoman Mary Diamond would not elaborate.

Free Press, a Washington-based public interest group that advocates Net Neutrality, opposes the kind of filtering applied by Comcast.

"We don't believe that any Internet provider should be able to discriminate, block or impair their consumers ability to send or receive legal content over the Internet," said Free Press spokeswoman Jen Howard.

Paul "Tony" Watson, a network security engineer at Google Inc. who has previously studied ways hackers could disrupt Internet traffic in manner similar to the method Comcast is using, said the cable company was probably acting within its legal rights.

"It's their network and they can do what they want," said Watson. "My concern is the precedent. In the past, when people got an ISP connection, they were getting a connection to the Internet. The only determination was price and bandwidth. Now they're going to have to make much more complicated decisions such as price, bandwidth, and what services I can get over the Internet."

Several companies have sprung up that rely on peer-to-peer technology, including BitTorrent Inc., founded by the creator of the BitTorrent software (which exists in several versions freely distributed by different groups and companies).

Ashwin Navin, the company's president and co-founder, confirmed that it has noticed interference from Comcast, in addition to some Canadian Internet service providers.

"They're using sophisticated technology to degrade service, which probably costs them a lot of money. It would be better to see them use that money to improve service," Navin said, noting that BitTorrent and other peer-to-peer applications are a major reason consumers sign up for broadband.

BitTorrent Inc. announced Oct. 9 that it was teaming up with online video companies to use its technology to distribute legal content.

Other companies that rely on peer-to-peer technology, and could be affected if Comcast decides to expand the range of applications it filters, include Internet TV service Joost, eBay Inc.'s Skype video-conferencing program and movie download appliance Vudu. There is no sign that Comcast is hampering those services.

Comcast subscriber Robb Topolski, a former software quality engineer at Intel Corp., started noticing the interference when trying to upload with file-sharing programs Gnutella and eDonkey early this year.

In August, Topolski began to see reports on Internet forum DSLreports.com from other Comcast users with the same problem. He now believes that his home town of Hillsboro, Ore., was a test market for the technology that was later widely applied in other Comcast service areas.

Topolski agrees that Comcast has a right to manage its network and slow down traffic that affects other subscribers, but disapproves of their method.

"By Comcast not acknowledging that they do this at all, there's no way to report any problems with it," Topolski said.

Associated Press Writers Ron Harris, Brian Bergstein, Deborah Yao and Kathy Matheson contributed to this story.

globeandmail.com: U.S. ISP blocking BitTorrent users

man you know what.... i'm getting reallyc lose to switching my ISP's.... the service is iffy, customer service is a joke... not only do they not help anything, i can call 3 times in one day and there's no way i'd hear the same thing more than once.... they ALWAYS tell me completely diffrent things.... such as one person telling me there's an outage, then another saying the outage is over and if i'm not getting internet there's a problem and then a third telling me (after a 3-4 hour wait) that i don't have a problem with my modem or anything that service has been down and is STILL down

I know what you mean, last time I called customer service for my internet service (adelphia) I got a women who was from India and barely knew English! I was so confused! And when I got frustrated and hung up she called me back!

I also use limewire. Ive never liked bit torrents though. I find it hard to get to get download speeds over 20kb/s opposed to 120kb/s I get from servers.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by rebgirl420

I know what you mean, last time I called customer service for my internet service (adelphia) I got a women who was from India and barely knew English! I was so confused! And when I got frustrated and hung up she called me back!

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From india? You were probally calling India. Call centers in india are like 7-11s here in the states, they are everywhere and many companies outsource thier calls to them especially for after hours calls.

Maybe it was. But man was that lady confusing. She asked me what my name was and then proceeded to ask me about my day and the day before. She was talking to me like your friend would. Then when I asked my question she porceeded to go back to asking me personal questions.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by dean0000

I also use limewire. Ive never liked bit torrents though. I find it hard to get to get download speeds over 20kb/s opposed to 120kb/s I get from servers.

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You need to tweak the settings of the Client to get torrents to go at full speed. I use Torrents over Limewire (which I also have and use incase I can't find a torrent for something I want) and find it to be of much better quality. I can help you out sorting out the settings if you do want to use torrents. :)

I think it's ok for any ISP to put limits on uploads, but they method of which they used as notification is terrible, misleading and a outright lie in the way it's presented to the user.
It should be clear exactly what you are missing out on if you go with a ISP that has limitations like that. Although that's part of the job for competitive ISP's to show this.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by dean0000

I also use limewire. Ive never liked bit torrents though. I find it hard to get to get download speeds over 20kb/s opposed to 120kb/s I get from servers.

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I have comcast and get download speeds between 100 and 500kb/s easy using limewire. heres a speed tester if you wanna see how fast yours goesVerizon Online SpeedTest
the fastest I got in 10 tries was 1855.3KBits 231.9KBytes

not smart on their behalf...I think they'd rather have customers...if they haven't changed the law, it's only illegal to upload files to others, not to download them...so fuck them.

Hey Reb ,
All fukn day w/ these ppl. yesterday , or day before ???? I'm pretty baked .
But even my Limewire wouldn't give me a connection , just throwing firewall msgs. It's not just bit tor. but gnutella too .

I too was on here w/ some comcast chat bimbo that claimed they had no contol over it . Yet when I was done ranting about not being able to use services I've paid for and was looking into DSL - I got back on Limewire and the prob. was fixed / unblocked. -Turbo fukn chgd. connection then = W.T.F kinda games are they playing ????

Is it time for a dif. ISP for you too ?????
G/B Sis.
Crispi :jointsmile:

Well, I dont use comcast so its not an issue for me and my limewire has always been fast and efficent. I just posted this b/c I knew so many of the people on here use torrent.

When I last rang my ISP, first I got some Indian or similar guy and couldnt tell what he was saying. I hung up and rang back, got a similar nationality woman who I also couldnt understand. Hung up and third time got a Scottish guy who I could understand ok.

Its so fustrating that you pay all the money and you cant even get someone who you understand/understands you.

Comcast is hated by those who use torrents

its generally not a good service for internet users with high traffic, it gets slow @ times of heavy load unlike dsl and its too pricey and requires contracts

but oh well, only major company out there who is not giving into RIAA and MPAA bullshit is verizon, even AT&T announced they are working on similar solutions like comcast to throttle bit torrent traffic.

also latest news suggests that both comcast and at&t are after implementing bandwidth quotas for each user, if exceeded there will be hefty fees or disconnection... but i dont think any plans are yet in effect in this regard

yeah, i knew they did something to slow down the torrents and files and such. but i also havent noticed that any of my files are missing parts, though i dont use bitcomet specifically, though i do use limewire, but like many before said, to supplement my torrent searches.

torrent is better than limewire because you can download a whole cd in the same amount of time as a few tracks off limewire, but the quality is better overall, and you can actually see the probability that you will actually be able to download the album because they give you counts on how many have it, and how many are downloading it. But comcast sucks, last time i had to call them, i left the phone with my mom and told her to let me know when we got off hold.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jimmy8778

yeah, i knew they did something to slow down the torrents and files and such. but i also havent noticed that any of my files are missing parts, though i dont use bitcomet specifically, though i do use limewire, but like many before said, to supplement my torrent searches.

torrent is better than limewire because you can download a whole cd in the same amount of time as a few tracks off limewire, but the quality is better overall, and you can actually see the probability that you will actually be able to download the album because they give you counts on how many have it, and how many are downloading it. But comcast sucks, last time i had to call them, i left the phone with my mom and told her to let me know when we got off hold.

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limewire used to be good. now its just full of spam! plus chances are they can make a case easier when u r caught using limewire than some secure bittorrent client like utorrent (with certain options enabled)

here are just a few related articles
WikiAnswers - Is it illegal to use Limewire
Music industry sues P2P firm Lime Wire - CNET News
FOXNews.com - Judge Throws Out LimeWire's 'Antitrust' Lawsuit Against Record Companies - Science News | Science & Technology | Technology News
How To Not Get Sued for File Sharing | Electronic Frontier Foundation
fuck comcast! BitTorrent Users Seek Compensation from Comcast | TorrentFreak
this is how people can win and did win in this case!
FCC Rules Against Comcast for BitTorrent Blocking | Electronic Frontier Foundation