Oneironaut said:
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What does the Bible say about rape? A lot of Christians don't read the Bible so they don't know, but they assume that somewhere in there is an explicit statement that rape is always immoral. And of course, if we do a little digging, we're bound to come up with something like that...right?
Rape , by definition is immoral yes.
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A few comments on this verse. First of all, if the woman is raped and does not scream loud enough and she is in a populated area, she is to be killed. This was because it would be presumed that she willingly had sex with the man, and they had some strange idea that having sex for fun is bad and people who do it outside the context of marriage should be killed. Obviously this cannot be a law that was cooked up by a moral being, yet the Bible is claiming these are the words of an infinitely moral God. How can that possibly be?
First of all sex is an intimate part of a special relationship that's private and sacred and kept in faithfulness and love. Adultery is an attack against the holy and sacred bond of man and woman in marriage. Jesus says:
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Mathew 19
4And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female,
5And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh?
6Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.
Now man can have more than one wife and here is why. It has to do with the nature of the woman. Woman was created for man, and is the glory of man.. And man was created for God, and is the glory of God..Now man is the master of a woman, but not in the sense that you would think of like a slave being abused. But rather as the leader and authority. Jesus's disciples called him master too.
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John 13:13
Ye call me Master and Lord: and ye say well; for so I am
Now you really need to understand more about the nature of the woman. These verses can give us a better understanding:
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Ephesians 5
20Giving thanks always for all things unto God and the Father in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ;
21Submitting yourselves one to another in the fear of God.
22Wives, submit yourselves unto your own husbands, as unto the Lord.
23For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the saviour of the body.
24Therefore as the church is subject unto Christ, so let the wives be to their own husbands in every thing.
25Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;
26That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,
27That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish.
28So ought men to love their wives as their own bodies. He that loveth his wife loveth himself.
29For no man ever yet hated his own flesh; but nourisheth and cherisheth it, even as the Lord the church:
30For we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones.
31For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall be joined unto his wife, and they two shall be one flesh.
32This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church.
33Nevertheless let every one of you in particular so love his wife even as himself; and the wife see that she reverence her husband.
You see he is using the relationship with a man and his wife as an allegory to Christ and his church! And what's more, she was created in that image. Now this righteousness and love towards the wife that Paul speaks of is the same love that God expected in the old Testament. And Paul would know, he was a pharisee amoung pharisees. He was a Jew, and he was well acquainted with what the bible taught . Now it's true that there were many evil men towards wifes and likewise evil women towards husbands in the old testament and the new for sure ( I mean the time periods). But there are also examples of love and dedication such as Jacob who worked 14 years to get the wife he desired and cherished. Or Abraham who loved his wife and bought a piece of land to bury her and honor her when she died. And surely others. And you forget that God told children to honor their mothers, do you think then that he would expect women to be treated as objects? No way.
Their were men with hard hearts towards their wifes, just as Jesus said:
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Mathew 19
7They say unto him, Why did Moses then command to give a writing of divorcement, and to put her away?
8He saith unto them, Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so.
If women were not special creations to God, then the idea of a private and sacred fellowship between man and woman would be meaningless. Didn't God also say, love your neighbor as your self? Women are surely our neighbors also.
Now Paul also speaks of how women should act and be treated. This will shed more light on things:
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1 Peter 3
1Likewise, ye wives, be in subjection to your own husbands; that, if any obey not the word, they also may without the word be won by the conversation of the wives;
2While they behold your chaste conversation coupled with fear.
3Whose adorning let it not be that outward adorning of plaiting the hair, and of wearing of gold, or of putting on of apparel;
4But let it be the hidden man of the heart, in that which is not corruptible, even the ornament of a meek and quiet spirit, which is in the sight of God of great price.
5For after this manner in the old time the holy women also, who trusted in God, adorned themselves, being in subjection unto their own husbands:
6Even as Sara obeyed Abraham, calling him lord: whose daughters ye are, as long as ye do well, and are not afraid with any amazement.
7Likewise, ye husbands, dwell with them according to knowledge, giving honour unto the wife, as unto the weaker vessel, and as being heirs together of the grace of life; that your prayers be not hindered.
You see? This is how the Bible teaches we should treat women. We should honor them with our strength as to a weaker vessel, this being also an allegory of Christs love for his bride, the church. Does God despise his bride? No! And he created women as something very dear and special to him.
In the book of Genesis, when God created Eve, Adam said of her:
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Genesis 2
23And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man.
24Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh.
Now remember what Christ said conscerning this last verse:
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5And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh?
6Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.
So you see, just as woman was born of man, the bride of Christ, that is his church and body of believers were born of him by his word which is spirit. It says of him:
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1 Corinthians 15:45
And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.
It is by his Spirit that we are made into new creatures.
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2 Corinthians 5:17
Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.
Now, Christians are children of God, are are held together in the bond of fellowship. But Christ is also our master, and we are his servants. But it's as Jesus said:
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Mathew 6
24No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other.
Now just as Christ is our master, and we are to be set apart (holy) and faithful to him, in the same way is the woman to have one husband and master also. This is the natural order, and it is an allegory of Christs love for his church. To remind you again:
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28So ought men to love their wives as their own bodies. He that loveth his wife loveth himself.
29For no man ever yet hated his own flesh; but nourisheth and cherisheth it, even as the Lord the church:
30For we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones.
31For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall be joined unto his wife, and they two shall be one flesh.
32This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church.
I hope that's understood.
Now, the verses you pointed out in Deuteronomy 22 do, in fact contain a judgment against rape:
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25But if a man find a betrothed damsel in the field, and the man force her, and lie with her: then the man only that lay with her shall die.
26But unto the damsel thou shalt do nothing; there is in the damsel no sin worthy of death: for as when a man riseth against his neighbour, and slayeth him, even so is this matter:
Now from what you've said you seem to be making an objection because the woman who screams in the field and isn't heard gets stoned even though she was raped. But that's not true! Pay close attention.
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23If a damsel that is a virgin be betrothed unto an husband, and a man find her in the city, and lie with her;
24Then ye shall bring them both out unto the gate of that city, and ye shall stone them with stones that they die; the damsel, because she cried not, being in the city; and the man, because he hath humbled his neighbour's wife: so thou shalt put away evil from among you.
You see in this verse it's talking about the woman being in the city. In the city if she cried out then people would hear her.
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25But if a man find a betrothed damsel in the field, and the man force her, and lie with her: then the man only that lay with her shall die.
26But unto the damsel thou shalt do nothing; there is in the damsel no sin worthy of death: for as when a man riseth against his neighbour, and slayeth him, even so is this matter:
27For he found her in the field, and the betrothed damsel cried, and there was none to save her.
But in this one the woman is in the field and no one could hear her cry. So she was not worthy of death. She would have ran back to the village and told her father or someone what happened immediately. And they wouldn't have stoned him or made him marry her.
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Nobody cares about the woman, but defiling another man's property is considered a serious offense.
Actually, you would be surprised to know that one of the reasons why the man is forced to marry a woman he raped, is for the very reason that God cares about her.
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Leviticus 21
7They shall not take a wife that is a whore, or profane; neither shall they take a woman put away from her husband: for he is holy unto his God. ..
...13And he shall take a wife in her virginity.
14A widow, or a divorced woman, or profane, or an harlot, these shall he not take: but he shall take a virgin of his own people to wife.
15Neither shall he profane his seed among his people: for I the LORD do sanctify him.
It was against the law for any Israelite to take a wife that had been raped. This is because of the special relationship between a man and a woman which is an allegory of Christ's private and sacred love for his church. For a woman to become defiled is to impart in some other relationship outside of the special love of her husband. It is unfaithfulness and defilement from the sacred fellowship.
Men, as they should be expected to today were the leaders of the home. It was their responsibility to take care of the family and be a leader.
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Genesis 3:17-19
17And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life;
18Thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee; and thou shalt eat the herb of the field;
19In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return.
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1 Timothy 5:8
8But if any provide not for his own, and specially for those of his own house, he hath denied the faith, and is worse than an infidel.
If nobody provided the needs that a woman needed through a husband, then she is in big trouble! But God does care about women and widows too. For instance, if a woman's husband died, it was the next of kin's duty to be her husband and carry on her brothers name. But this wasn't the only reason. It was also to take care of the womans needs. It was the next of kin's duty, since she had become part of the family through her marriage, and because it was the relatives duty to help carry on the name of his kin.
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Deuteronomy 25
5"When brothers live together and one of them dies and has no son, the wife of the deceased shall not be married outside the family to a strange man. (G)Her husband's brother shall go in to her and take her to himself as wife and perform the duty of a husband's brother to her.
6"It shall be that the firstborn whom she bears shall assume the name of his dead brother, so that (H)his name will not be blotted out from Israel.
7"(I)But if the man does not desire to take his brother's wife, then his brother's wife shall go up to the gate to the elders and say, 'My husband's brother refuses to establish a name for his brother in Israel; he is not willing to perform the duty of a husband's brother to me.'
8"Then the elders of his city shall summon him and speak to him. And if he persists and says, 'I do not desire to take her,'
9(J)then his brother's wife shall come to him in the sight of the elders, and pull his sandal off his foot and (K)spit in his face; and she shall declare, 'Thus it is done to the man who does not build up his brother's house.'
10"In Israel his name shall be called, 'The house of him whose sandal is removed.'
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Psalm 68:5
A father of the fatherless, and a judge of the widows, is God in his holy habitation.
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How come God doesn't come out and say "Thou shalt not rape"? In his list of Ten Commandments, he considers it important to prohibit breaking the Sabbath or coveting your neighbor's donkey, but he doesn't consider it important to prohibit sexual abuse? How come?
Why does it need to be in the Ten commandments? " Do not molest children" isn't in the ten commandments either. These things are so vile and disgusting that everyone knows they're wrong. The ten commandments actually does cover it. Part of rape is coveting, and another part is adultery.
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Exodus 20
14"(R)You shall not commit adultery.
17"(V)You shall not covet your neighbor's house; (W)you shall not covet your neighbor's wife or his male servant or his female servant or his ox or his donkey or anything that belongs to your neighbor."
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The fact that the Bible does not condemn rape (or slavery for that matter) is one of the most obvious reasons, to me, that it could not have possibly been penned by a moral genius of any sort.
God doesn't condone slavery the kind you may be familiar with. The Israelites weren't allowed to go roaming around and catch unsuspecting people like white men did in Africa and make them slaves. The slaves in Israel were paid wages, and they were to be treated kindly, and not as some scum that has no rights of his own. Only when they captured people in war did they forcibly make them slaves, and even then they had to provide for them. They weren't to mercilessly beat them or be cruel. Your understanding of slavery is probably much much different then what it meant back then. back then a servant worked for a number of years, and then he was free to go, unless he chose to become a slave for life.
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In the same chapter I quoted above, actually right before the passage I quoted, is the bit where it says that a woman is to be stoned to death if on her wedding night her husband discovers she has already had her cherry popped.
But it's not as if back then women were being stoned left and right because their hymen broke before marriage. If it broke before they were to be married, then the blood was to be put on some fabric and shown to the priest. Also, women back then were not active in the same way some women are today, and their hymens would break much less than with women in today's society,
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Sex was basically the purpose of marriage in Israelite culture. You didn't ask your wife's permission to have sex. You owned her. Marriage and the virginity commandments were just a way to make the sexual relationship exclusive, so that if the woman got pregnant the man could be assured that he was the father. If the woman was not a virgin when she was married or if she committed adultery during the marriage, the man would not be assured that he was the father. That's why they considered it such a heinous crime.
This is not true, as I have now shown above. Marriage was and is a gift from God meant to be special and full of Love and kindness and faithfulness. And women were to submit to their husbands as they should in all things including sex. But surely if a righteous man's wife did not want to have sex, he would not force her. The only thing you got right is that marriage is meant to be exclusive.Your assertion that is was that way merely because he wouldn't know he was the father is false and makes no sense. If the man had sex with a virgin when they become married, and she chooses to sneak off and have sexual intercourse and get pregnant then he could not be the Father then and he wouldn't know it. Marrying a virgin is no safeguard against such a thing and your assumption is simply that.
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In fact, if a man had his eye on a virgin that he wanted to be his, all he had to do apparently was rape her, pay 50 shekels of silver to her father, and badda-bing badda-boom she's required to marry him.
Actually that's not true. They could stone him if they wanted to. It's up to the Father. And remember that now that they're married he has to live with and support a wife that in all likeliness hates him to the core so it wouldn't be a very enticing idea for most people. Not to mention he's now accountable to the woman's family who probably hate him too.
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In fact, according to the chapter immediately preceding the one I quoted in the original post, a man in battle is allowed to take a woman captive to marry her and essentially rape her.If he doesn't like his new rape toy, he can let her go, and the only reason he can't sell her for money is because he screwed her. Isn't it amazing how much barbaric sexism the Bible can cram into just a few pages?
Your understanding is flawed. You have been raised up in a secular culture and these faulty presuppositions about the nature of woman and marriage etc. have permeated your mind, giving you a false understanding. It's important to recognize your presuppositions. You have this presupposition that it's wrong for a man to have authority over a woman or that it's wrong for a Father to decide who his daughter should marry. But you're wrong, not them. These customs are exactly in line with who God created man to be, and woman to be. The culture today teaches women and others have certain "unalienable" rights which they claim in error, being full of rebellion and self willed.
What do you think is better, to be killed in battle or be taken care of by a husband? If anything, this is an act of mercy, and anyone who has been captured in war against an evil nation has no right demanding they be set free, or they be given freedom to do as they will. They are captives subject to the best desires of their captors. But the consequence of being captured into marriage doesn't even come close to the righteous judgment that might be brought upon such wicked nations as the Israelites encountered and suffered. If anything it is an act of mercy.
You speak about things you do not understand. You don't see as you ought to see because of the intentions of your heart. Let this be a lesson to you. Yes, the bible is firmly against rape, and your presuppositions are invalid and should be recognized and dealt with.
