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Did anybody else see Michael Moore on the Oprah show (yes I watch Oprah sometimes) talking about his new film "Sicko" confronting the trillion dollar Health Insurance industry?? Health care has always been a huge issue with me, since I haven't had any (except when I was in the Army) and I really hope this film stirs up some shit and maybe the US can catch up with all the other coutries who already have free health care.
Would be nice to stop greed,,, but I don't think so...
Greed fuels this fascist money pit known as the USA and I can't agree more that it's highly unlikely to change anything. Just more "Delusional thoughts from Fantasy Island".Quote:
Originally Posted by Skink
Michael Moore... I agree with a lot of his messages, just sometimes it seems he needs to find a better way to get them across to a wider range of people.
This documentary coming up, though, I am *VERY* excited about. As a health care worker, I see people get fucked over time and time again by those bastards, the health insurance and pharmaceutical companies. Seriously, they really need a BIG foot up the ass, and I think Michael Moore has got the steel-toed boots on.
He does seem rather passionate about this one.Quote:
Originally Posted by Purple Banana
Lol i can honestly say i have never heard of him
must only be famous in america..
I bet you anything he's FAR more passionate about FOOD...Quote:
Originally Posted by sickstrings84
It's not in WHAT you say, but HOW you say it, and for me, my dear god, I can't stand that obese fuck. :jointsmile:
hahahaha...He is a fatass...I saw a bumper sticker once that said "If guns kill people then spoons made Michael Moore get fat."Quote:
Originally Posted by Its a Plant
Slob or not though, I really think corrupt health care is a huge issue and I commend him for having the balls to go against the Insurance companies, somebody had to and not many people in this country would have the sand to follow through with it.
Hey is Hillery still saying she's gonna fix healthcare???
"The law demands and requires that a corporation like a health insurance company maximize the profits for the shareholders, and if they don??t do that, they??re violating the law. ? If they are required by law to make a profit, and the only way they can make a profit is by denying claims or cutting people off of their insurance or never taking them on in the first place, then that??s not good for us."
LMAO! And what law is this again? I'd rather feed the health care system with thousands than his lieing fat ass the price of admission to the movie.
Have a good one!:jointsmile:
The issue isn't just the cost of health care.....It's the 18,000 people each year who die because insurance companies deny valid claims.
In Cuba, the best hospitals and health treatments are for the politicians, upper classes and tourists. The average Cuban citizen gets lousy health care.
Despite my objections to Castro, I never thought that we should have boycotted Cuba for all these years. It generates sympathy for him, among other things.
New York Daily News
Moore's 'Sicko' gives all too pleasant view of Cuba's health care
BY RAFAEL SALINAS
Monday, June 4th 2007
Celebrity filmmaker Michael Moore has brushed shoulders with plenty of famous and powerful people over the years. He should meet someone who is neither: my cousin.
Moore's latest documentary, "Sicko" - which opens this month - aims to skewer the sad state of U.S. health care, in part by comparing it unfavorably to what Moore considers Cuba's sparkling system of national care. In a signature stunt, he brings a few American citizens who couldn't get proper care here down to Cuba - where they get the treatment they need.
As usual, Moore's logic needs a checkup. The man stretches his argument into caricature and discredits himself by cherrypicking facts. To assume that Cuban citizens are getting the medical attention they need because a party of foreigners got treated decently is akin to praising prison food because you got offered a nice spread of cold cuts after the warden took you on a tour.
If Moore had taken a moment to have a little chat with my cousin, a Cuban doctor, he would have learned much more about the true state of health care in Castro's Cuba.
She's not difficult to find. Just go to her town about six hours outside of Havana and look for the woman who's missing half her left leg and trudging down the dirt covered roads on crutches to see her patients.
Though my cousin is readily available to do her job, she's frustrated daily by the lack of medicine and supplies that can facilitate the healing process. Most weeks, not even aspirin is available.
And about that leg: It's the result of a bad motorcycle accident 22 years ago. Yet in all the time that has passed since then, the Cuban health care system has not been able to provide her with either a proper prosthetic or even a motorized chair. We sent her the latter. It sits in the corner, awaiting a replacement battery, unavailable on the island.
And those who decry America's health care as stratified should save some outrage for Cuba - where tourists like Moore and Communist party officials get all kinds of care that's out of reach for Cuba's 11 million average citizens. The fact that the vast majority of them often have to bring their own food, soap and sheets to the hospital somehow didn't make it into the final cut of "Sicko."
This tale of two Cubas is typical. When I visited family in 2003, I had my pick of provisions - including extra food, toilet paper and clothes, none of which Cubans could buy on their own. Their salaries do not allow for such "luxuries," and even if they did, the stores only accepted American currency. Many are in dire need of these supplies, yet the government quotas offer too little to sustain them.
Yes, the average Cuban life span is about 77 years - comparable to what it is in the United States. But that doesn't factor in all those who flee the country, and it is likely skewed by Cuba's high rate of abortion, which tends to inflate life expectancy by driving down infant mortality.
I support Moore's right to say what he wants. Here in the U.S., we're allowed (and often even encouraged) to criticize our government. But that doesn't give him license to use a distorted lens to produce a cinematic love letter to Castro's Cuba.
It's enough to give me and my cousin a headache. And only one of us has the aspirin to dull the pain.
Salinas, the son of Cuban exiles, lives in Queens
Moore's 'Sicko' gives all too pleasant view of Cuba's health care
Ya always have to look for a silver lining dude! LOL..........here's this one:Quote:
Originally Posted by Breukelen advocaat
Michael Moore Faces U.S. Treasury Probe
The Treasury Department's Office of Foreign Assets Control notified Moore in a letter dated May 2 that it was conducting a civil investigation for possible violations of the U.S. trade embargo restricting travel to Cuba. A copy of the letter was obtained Tuesday by the AP.
"This office has no record that a specific license was issued authorizing you to engage in travel-related transactions involving Cuba," Dale Thompson, OFAC chief of general investigations and field operations, wrote in the letter to Moore.
In February, Moore took about 10 ailing workers from the Ground Zero rescue effort in Manhattan for treatment in Cuba, said a person working with the filmmaker on the release of "Sicko." The person requested anonymity because Moore's attorneys had not yet determined how to respond.
Michael Moore Faces U.S. Treasury Probe - washingtonpost.com
I wonder though if he'll do a documentory about our prison system?
Have a good one!:s4:
God forbid a man should go to Cuba without authorization.....what a horrible criminal...
Yeah, they're only messing with him because he's been anti Bush-administration. That's absurd.
You know, obese or not, the guy has important information for people, left- or right-leaning, in that film. If you wouldn't dismiss me for being slender, don't dismiss him for being fat and don't dismiss the information he's providing just because you've disagreed with his previous films. I assume you'd prefer people not dismiss your your ideas on other matters simply because you're pro-cannabis, right? Same thing here with his weight and what this film discusses. This is an issue that crosses party lines, despite the fact that it'll be a bigger election issue for the Democrats. This affects you all more than some of you seem to realize. Try and keep an open mind.
I actually missed it...I hate to admit it but I watch oprah probably 3 days a week because it can be an interesting show sometimes. I was kinda bummed about missing it too...hopefully I can catch it as a re-run.
Now birdgirl, you know I'm as open minded about these M. Moore as the next guy but fact is he broke the law. If we all just chose the laws we wanted to follow there would be chaos!! CHAOS I TELL YOU!! :D
When the day comes when a person can go to the local cigar shop and buy a Cuban......Then M.Moore can show his anti-american agenda; till then, lock up the fat boy.:thumbsup:
Have a good one!:s4:
Like you're not breaking the law every day with your grow op!!! Nice try, there, buddy . . . .
They're going to need to come a few of my friends, too, if they come after Moore for going to Cuba. At least he had the legitimate excuse of reporting for his film. These people I know went, on a whim, by way of Canada, just to see if they could get away with it, which they did. If I didn't think I'd get caught or somehow endanger my career future or that of my husband, I'd do the same thing at my earliest opportunity. I'd bring you back some Cohibas, too!
How true BUT likewise I spent my time in jail, paid the fines, did over 200 hours of community service because I was CAUGHT! He admitted his guilt with the film....are you saying that actors and such have certain privs that I don't?Quote:
Originally Posted by birdgirl73
Just keepin' it real!:D
Have a good one!:s4:
OK, then let's keep it real. Remember, Moore was there working on a documentary film. That's reporting, whether you agree with the reports or not. Even editorial reporting that takes a side is still reporting, and a documentary film falls under the category of journalism, or PBS and other documentary filmmakers, even lightweight cable travel networks, wouldn't be able to go to Cuba and film what they film regularly about Cuba. (Guantanamo, incidentally, is an American possession, so he wasn't in alleged violation there, only in mainland Cuba.)
The records show that Moore clearly applied for the visa, and OFAC in retrospect is alleging "no determination was made." Yet Treasury is having to say they're only investigating "possible violations" of the travel embargo. If they had an actual violation, reporters would have the proof of a denied visa out front on Fox, among other places, so fast your head would spin. "Investigating possible violations" is precisely what government offices say when they're trying real hard to cause problems for someone but don't have anything solid to go on.
The reality is it looks a heck of a lot like an bureaucratic vendetta against someone who's been a thorn in the side of Washington, D.C. and the Bush administration for six years. Fred Thompson is milking this not-yet-news item for everything it's worth so he has a right-wing sound byte with which to kick-start his campaign.
Once again...keeping it real.........Quote:
Originally Posted by birdgirl73
IF he applied and it was still in limbo why should this CRIME hold a political boundry preventing Mr. Thompson from doing his job?Quote:
Originally Posted by Psycho4Bud
IF it were as easy as journalistic rights OR that he actually obtained permission then why would his lawyers be so slow to respond? Should be a pretty cut and dry response I'd think.:DQuote:
Originally Posted by Psycho4Bud
Have a good one!:s4:
Yes sir, socialized health care may have a few good points but to me the bad points out weigh its soooo much. Thank you but I dont wanna have to wait weeks or months to get into my cancer checkups.Quote:
Originally Posted by Psycho4Bud
Too many folks already have their minds made up about so-called "socialized" health care, when no one really knows what it would entail because we don't have any such system yet. When we do, it'll have to be implemented gradually.
Chances are here that for people who're already insured, it'll be very much like it is right now. As is the case in countries with fully socialized medicine, the wealthy and highest-earning types will still likely have better care and more options. That's not fair, but it's reality. If you don't have to wait for your checkups now, Reb, you can't automatically assume that because people in other countries have to wait that it'll be the same way here if our system changes. Here it'll have to be a combination public-private system, which isn't how it works in other countries.
The important thing--and this is the most important message from Moore's film, in my opinion--is that by implementing some sort of system to cover the health-care-less and woefully underinsured, we'll be doing something that benefits our country as a whole and not just a chosen few. It's shifting to a "we" mentality from an "I" mentality. It's like the idea upon which education access is based on in this country: everyone benefits from an educated society, not just the people who have kids. The same would be true of health care. And the benefits would extend worldwide in the case of health care for all.
1. I have a reallllly bad gut feeling it will end up like those european countries. And why risk that? Its not like if shit goes down we say, "oops, didn't work", theyll just throw more and more money at it like they did with welfare
2. and the public education system is a wreck
3. and I hat the idea of a one world ANYTHING.
they could do alot...they could make a chevy that would last 50 years, they could make a cure for cancer, aids and all that good stuff...shit they could probably even make a rolling paper that burns perfectly everytime and never
canoes
politicans are fuckin roaches...and not the good kinda roach
wheres north americas equivelent to che and fidel???
USA equivilent to Fidel? Just look at all the liberals :thumbsup:
Well, don't go on your gut just yet on point 1. Nothing's even in the works yet. It'll no doubt have some negative aspects. But if you're informed, you know the negative aspects of our current medical system are myriad now. We who believe in cannabis need to be better aware of that than anyone else, particularly considering how hard Big Pharma, the profit-mongers that they are, have--and will continue to--fight the legalization of an immensely beneficial plant.
On 2, I didn't say anything about public education. I said education. And while our system has its faults, it's still better than nothing, and all education, public or private, benefits society as a whole. You'll be learning that as a future teacher. You also need to know there are plenty of very effective public school systems in this country. There are wrecks, certainly. There are wrecks in the highest-dollar private educational systems, too. But there are also successes. I don't know about you, but I'm the product of a successful public education. And I know a heck of a lot of other people who are, too, including nearly the entirety of my med school class.
On point 3, you and the other "nationalists" who haven't yet seen that this world is increasingly inextricably linked, whether you want to admit it or not, can hang onto the notion that keeping borders and ideas and geographies the way they've been previous decades and centuries is the way to continue. The business world has long since overcome that notion, or global business wouldn't be able to operate as successfully as it does. The fear of loss of identity with geographic area unifications is a foundless one. England and other European countries haven't lost their unique identities or laws with the EU. With more maturity, lots more travel, and further education, I suspect you'll start to see this. It's too early for you to be able to do that quite yet.
1. i think its a damnded if you do and damnded if you don't.
2. Of course theres good points on both. And really, what we both know is that a good ammount of the time its the student who is the problem.
3. I'll never agree on that. I believe that a one world anything just leads to socialism. I want to be able to leave somehwere when the country begins to go down the tube. I like being an American. I dont want to a citizen of another country AT ALL. And so many other countries are becoming socialist messes. I want NO part of that.
Rest assured, sweet Reb, you'll still be an American no matter what happens. So will I. No other country could handle us!! No other country would even want to try . . . .
I'm outta here. Everyone sleep tight.
haha night birgirl
Michael Moore is about as close as you get. He may be fat, but he's got more fortitude in his little finger than most on this site or for that matter anywhere in this country. Michael Moore is a real American Hero. The reason the wingers make fun of him is they have no substance to their arguements.Quote:
Originally Posted by Triple-P
Is there anyone else you feel is above the law of the land or does it just pertain to their political stance whether they are or not?Quote:
Originally Posted by medicinal
Have a good one!:s4:
i meant in the revolutionary change of regime kinda wayQuote:
USA equivilent to Fidel? Just look at all the liberals
Us cannabis smokers believe we should be "above the law" in the same respect. Just because something's law, doesn't make it right by default (as many people seem to believe). Charging someone for traveling to Cuba is just stupid, just like charging us for enjoying the herb is stupid. I think it's high time we stop attaching morality to arbitrary laws, I'm sure nobody's going to harm society by smoking a Cuban!Quote:
Originally Posted by Psycho4Bud
(I love that we have Cuban cigars here in Canada btw:jointsmile:)
I got busted.....had to pay the fines and do the time. What makes his him any better? He openly admitted to breaking the law....bottom line.Quote:
Originally Posted by mrdevious
Have a good one!:jointsmile:
Breitbart.tv » Exclusive: Thompson Responds to Michael Moore Challenge (Video of Fred Thompson addressing Moore)
A mental institution for Michael Moore?
In a response to Michael Moore, former US Senator Fred Thompson called upon the film-maker to speak to Fidel Castro about the fate of fellow documentary film-maker Nicolas Guillen who was tortured in Castro's prisons.
According to Thompson, Guillen was imprisoned for an unflattering portrayal of Castro and the Cuban regime and then interned in a mental asylum where he was subjected to electro-shock therapy......Guillen Landrián was incarcerated for nearly a decade by Castro and released after abusive treatment in the Mazmorra mental institution in Cuba. He was briefly imprisoned again in the 1980s and eventually left to live in the US.
??A mental institution, Michael. Might be something you ought to think about?.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rebgirl420
How about getting cancer and having no insurance?? What would you suggest I do?? Die because you don't wanna wait a couple weeks for your appointment......Sounds like a well thought out plan. :wtf:
btw....Be careful you don't hit the payout limit on your insurance when you get cancer, it can happen a lot quicker than you might think. And good luck getting approved for a transplant should you ever need one.
I agree the system would need some revamping , but we have plenty of highly intelligent people in this country fully capable of devising a system that will work. Why just assume that the system would not work?? When it comes to important issues, I tend to shy away from following my gut instinct. That accomplishes nothing, I try to use my brain on issues that matter.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Psycho4Bud
Nothing makes him better. But nothing made you deserving of your punishment either. Again, law and morality are not inseperable. Just because you suffered an injustice, doesn't mean has has to as well.
though honestly that's just related to this particular issue, overall I've become very disappointed in Michael Moore.
Have a good one.
In Cuba, the best hospitals and health treatments are for the politicians, upper classes and tourists. The average Cuban citizen gets lousy health care.
I think you've just described US health care with the exception of the 60 million that are without any!
a sadistic coward and a corrupt despot? i think we can do without them, we come close enough to destruction with the fools that run the show now.Quote:
Originally Posted by Triple-P