â??Damascus Nancyâ?? And Unlawful Diplomacy

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Originally Posted by medicinal

Pelosi might have talked some sense into the syrian leader and asked him to influence Iran

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Nancy Pelosiâ??s recent bumbling foray into foreign policy with Syria shows why diplomacy should be left to that branch of government - the executive branch - that actually has the authority to conduct it. Pelosi conveyed a â??peace messageâ?? from Ehud Olmert to Bashar Assad that - woops! - the Israeli government says it never gave to Pelosi. Apparently Nuancy not only missed the shades of gray there, she missed the black and white as well.
Amateurish and embarassing, yes, but is it illegal also? There is a law called the Logan Act that forbids U.S. citizens from conducting diplomacy without approval from the government. The act, as amended in 2004, reads as follows:

18 U.S.C. § 953. Private correspondence with foreign governments.
Any citizen of the United States, wherever he may be, who, without authority of the United States, directly or indirectly commences or carries on any correspondence or intercourse with any foreign government or any officer or agent thereof, with intent to influence the measures or conduct of any foreign government or of any officer or agent thereof, in relation to any disputes or controversies with the United States, or to defeat the measures of the United States, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than three years, or both.

This section shall not abridge the right of a citizen to apply himself, or his agent, to any foreign government, or the agents thereof, for redress of any injury which he may have sustained from such government or any of its agents or subjects.

Members of Congress are not immune from the Act, nor do members of Congress have any constitutional authority to conduct foreign policy. The role of the Senates in foreign policy is basically to ratify treaties and confirm ambassadors. The role of the House is to declare war, and control the purse strings. Thatâ??s it, no more - only the President has the power to actually conduct or authorize foreign policy and diplomacy.
AGORAVOX - The Citizen Media

World opinion has been discussed in here and it seems that our friends in France have issues with "Damascus Nancy" with good cause. Now she DID openly do this atrosity of her own free will against the U.S. constitution.

I hope that the members of congress and senate find their way to bring formal charges up against her, demote her from Speaker of the House, and set an example so this type of breach of power never happens again!:D

Now don't get me wrong, I really feel for the lady; it's a shame that she abused her position is such a manner. :D

Have a good one!:s4:

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Originally Posted by Psycho4Bud

Nancy Pelosiâ??s recent bumbling foray into foreign policy with Syria shows why diplomacy should be left to that branch of government - the executive branch - that actually has the authority to conduct it. Pelosi conveyed a â??peace messageâ?? from Ehud Olmert to Bashar Assad that - woops! - the Israeli government says it never gave to Pelosi. Apparently Nuancy not only missed the shades of gray there, she missed the black and white as well.
Amateurish and embarassing, yes, but is it illegal also? There is a law called the Logan Act that forbids U.S. citizens from conducting diplomacy without approval from the government. The act, as amended in 2004, reads as follows:

18 U.S.C. § 953. Private correspondence with foreign governments.
Any citizen of the United States, wherever he may be, who, without authority of the United States, directly or indirectly commences or carries on any correspondence or intercourse with any foreign government or any officer or agent thereof, with intent to influence the measures or conduct of any foreign government or of any officer or agent thereof, in relation to any disputes or controversies with the United States, or to defeat the measures of the United States, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than three years, or both.

This section shall not abridge the right of a citizen to apply himself, or his agent, to any foreign government, or the agents thereof, for redress of any injury which he may have sustained from such government or any of its agents or subjects.

Members of Congress are not immune from the Act, nor do members of Congress have any constitutional authority to conduct foreign policy. The role of the Senates in foreign policy is basically to ratify treaties and confirm ambassadors. The role of the House is to declare war, and control the purse strings. Thatâ??s it, no more - only the President has the power to actually conduct or authorize foreign policy and diplomacy.
AGORAVOX - The Citizen Media

World opinion has been discussed in here and it seems that our friends in France have issues with "Damascus Nancy" with good cause. Now she DID openly do this atrosity of her own free will against the U.S. constitution.

I hope that the members of congress and senate find their way to bring formal charges up against her, demote her from Speaker of the House, and set an example so this type of breach of power never happens again!:D

Now don't get me wrong, I really feel for the lady; it's a shame that she abused her position is such a manner. :D

Have a good one!:s4:

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If neglecting the U.S. constitution and abusing power is grounds for "demotion", George W. Bush and Dick Cheney should be cleaning trash off the white house parking lot by now.

Have a good one!

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Originally Posted by VaporDaddy

If neglecting the U.S. constitution and abusing power is grounds for "demotion", George W. Bush and Dick Cheney should be cleaning trash off the white house parking lot by now.

Have a good one!

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LOL....the exact response I was expecting.

Now Pelosi is in violation of "18 U.S.C. § 953. Private correspondence with foreign governments"; exacty what law is Bush/Cheney in violation of? Wait! You could actually create a new thread to address that........this ones about Pelosis' crimes against the fine people of the United States.:D

Have a good one!:s4:

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Originally Posted by Psycho4Bud

LOL....the exact response I was expecting.

Now Pelosi is in violation of "18 U.S.C. § 953. Private correspondence with foreign governments"; exacty what law is Bush/Cheney in violation of? Wait! You could actually create a new thread to address that........this ones about Pelosis' crimes against the fine people of the United States.:D

Have a good one!:s4:

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Re-read the law you posted. She was not in violation.

Have a good one!:thumbsup:

" in relation to any disputes or controversies with the United States, or to defeat the measures of the United States"

Damascus (AsiaNews/Agencies) â?? US-Syrian relations were at the centre of the meeting that took place this morning between US House Speaker, Democrat Nancy Pelosi, and Syrian President Bashar al-Assad, IRNA news agency reported.

She told Syrian officials to end Syriaâ??s interference in Iraq and Lebanon, stopping terrorists from crossing into the two countries, and halt its support for Hamas and Hezbollah, a US delegation member is reported as saying.

US President Bush criticised Ms Pelosi's trip to Syria for sending "mixed signals" that undermine US-led efforts to isolate the Syrian president.
SYRIA ââ?¬â?? UNITED STATES Lebanon and Iraq top Nancy Pelosiââ?¬â?¢s Syrian talks - Asia News

It's pretty clear.......guess we'll have to see what the Democrat controlled congress and senate have to say.

Have a good one!:s4:

Its pretty clear what Nancy did wrong was piss in the rights kool-aid--Ohhh Yeaaaah

Ms. Pelosi said that members of Congress had a responsibility to play a role in national security issues and that they needed to be able to gather information on their own, and not be dependent on the White House.
Think Progress » Pelosi: Bush administration threw a tantrum.

Now Pelosi is in violation of "18 U.S.C. § 953. Private correspondence with foreign governments"; exacty what law is Bush/Cheney in violation of? Wait! You could actually create a new thread to address that........this ones about Pelosis' crimes against the fine people of the United States.
Just the response I was expecting: a member of our government makes a gesture of peace and you want to have her hung by the ?s. I guess if she'd of said Israel would like to blow the shit out of you, she'd have been doin the right thing, stiring the warmongers huge bowl of shit. This is why we're one of, if not the most, hated countries on the planet. A country run by a bunch of egomaniacle warmongers that bully every other country into giving them their way. It's not our country I don't like, just the sorry bastards running it.

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Originally Posted by medicinal

Just the response I was expecting: a member of our government makes a gesture of peace and you want to have her hung by the ?s. I guess if she'd of said Israel would like to blow the shit out of you, she'd have been doin the right thing, stiring the warmongers huge bowl of shit. This is why we're one of, if not the most, hated countries on the planet. A country run by a bunch of egomaniacle warmongers that bully every other country into giving them their way. It's not our country I don't like, just the sorry bastards running it.

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Hey, if there were republicans, libertarians, etc...over there at the time doing the same they should also be prosecuted. We have ALL stated on how WE should be following the constitution.....I find it amazing that this document NOW should pertain to some but not others.

By the way, this article was from a FRENCH paper.......aren't we concerned about "world opinion" or is that a partisan subject also?:D

Have a good one!:s4:

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Originally Posted by eg420ne

Ms. Pelosi said that members of Congress had a responsibility to play a role in national security issues and that they needed to be able to gather information on their own, and not be dependent on the White House.
Think Progress » Pelosi: Bush administration threw a tantrum.

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eg420ne....tsk,tsk.........you of all people have posted many, many times on how we're crapping on our constitution. Could you point out the article that states that the congress or senate has the right to negotiate on behalf of the U.S.
LII: Constitution

The executive branch is in control of foreign affairs........not the congress.

Have a good one!:s4:

Ohhhh Psycho,:silly: i forget your for peace and im for war

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Originally Posted by eg420ne

Ohhhh Psycho,:silly: i forget your for peace and im for war

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I'm for upholding our Constitution.......like we ALL should be!:D

Have a good one!:s4:

"eg420ne....tsk,tsk.........you of all people have posted many, many times on how we're crapping on our constitution. Could you point out the article that states that the congress or senate has the right to negotiate on behalf of the U.S."

She never claimed to be there to negotiate anything. She made it known that she was only there to to listen and had no power of the administration like the secretary of state... However she third in line to the presidency..*cough* *cough* hint *wink*

You ever notice that when condi goes anywhere nothing ever happens.

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Originally Posted by Zimzum

She never claimed to be there to negotiate anything. She made it known that she was only there to to listen and had no power of the administration like the secretary of state.

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Once again:

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Originally Posted by Psycho4Bud

Damascus (AsiaNews/Agencies) â?? US-Syrian relations were at the centre of the meeting
SYRIA ââ?¬â?? UNITED STATES Lebanon and Iraq top Nancy Pelosiââ?¬â?¢s Syrian talks - Asia News

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Not to mention the false message from Israel....LOL.

Have a good one!:s4:

PSYCHO your for upholding the constitution .Well u should be the last person to root for Bush then,or do u not read the newspapers?

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Originally Posted by fishman3811

PSYCHO your for upholding the constitution .Well u should be the last person to root for Bush then,or do u not read the newspapers?

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"â??Damascus Nancyâ?? And Unlawful Diplomacy "

This is what happens when the left has nothing to say about one of their own. LOL

You COULD make a thread about Bush OR reply to the other 100 Bush bash threads in here.........so what do ya think of Pelosi?

Have a good one!:s4:

hahaha

deleting replys now old boy, LOL

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Originally Posted by VisionaryUrbanTactic

hahaha

deleting replys now old boy, LOL

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You mean this one that you posted in another thread?

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Originally Posted by VisionaryUrbanTactic

well it looks like one repub is foaming at the mouth huh?

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It's a rule of thumb that nothing gets deleted in politics unless it's in big time violation of the rules. You need to get a grip....there are NO deleted posts in this thread!

Have a good one!:jointsmile:

Man P4b, I think you picked the wrong side in this one, I seriously doubt if she could be brought up on charges and if she was, there would be hell to pay for Bush. He would be subpoened for every infraction his administration has ever commited, and there are many. She was simply on a fact finding forray and there is nothing that says that is un-lawful. Maybe she slipped with a peace gesture (My My how awful, a gesture of peace, she should be hung) but she was doing the job that Dickhead refuses to do, namely correspond with foriegn governments. "Keep your friends close and your enemies closer", an intelligent postulate if ever there was.

You hit it on the spot.^^^...maybe thats why p4b has 3 threads on nancy cause he lost it

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Originally Posted by eg420ne

You hit it on the spot.^^^...maybe thats why p4b has 3 threads on nancy cause he lost it

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LMAO!!! Make sure you post the same to pisshead when we see thread #1000 on 9-11. I'm SURE he's getting damn close by now.

Have a good one!:s4:

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Originally Posted by medicinal

Man P4b, I think you picked the wrong side in this one, I seriously doubt if she could be brought up on charges and if she was, there would be hell to pay for Bush.

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Good...in fact GREAT! It's about time these pompous assholes are brought to a standard. All this partisan bullshit is the reason why our government is in such a mess.

The only problem about going after the prez is the "Nixon factor"....remember that bitch slap to the citizens? Nixon pardons Spiro Agnew of any and all charges, appoints Ford for a replacement, resigns so Ford can do the same for him.

Have a good one!:s4:

"Keep your friends close and your enemies closer", an intelligent postulate if ever there was

so you agree Syria is not an ally, moreso a enemy to USA.

Psycho still has sum fight in him:gunfighter2: hey p4b how many people nancy killed since that trip compared to how many this bush regime has killed in the name of War On Terror.............you alll want war, then lets have one on our soil, but its not gonna be muslims, that we be fighting...................

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Originally Posted by eg420ne

Psycho still has sum fight in him:gunfighter2:

Despite popular belief in here I really got no time for any of the existing parties. Just choosing what I feel is the less of the evils running instead of who would be great. Their ex-lawyers for christs sake.....that should be the clue.

hey p4b how many people nancy killed since that trip compared to how many this bush regime has killed in the name of War On Terror.............you alll want war, then lets have one on our soil, but its not gonna be muslims, that we be fighting...................

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Almost all the ex presidents have blood on their hands.....hell, Clinton ignored Rwanda that resulted in almost 1,000,000 dead. WE should have stepped in but hell.........the French were involved in that crap, can't step on their toes. Thats not to mention his actions in Sudan and Kosovo.........oh ya, he enjoyed throwing a few tomahawk missiles into Iraq from time to time also.

LOL...let another 9-11 happen and you'll see what happens with the Muslim community in the U.S. Right or wrong....it would be nasty. I recall spending some time in Atlanta back in 95 and the hatred was heavy and hard for them back then. Michigan would be the area to watch........

Have a good one!:s4:

Its OUR Government(and its masters) thats the real enemy of the American people....

have a bad one:toilet_claw:

Pelosi is number 3 in line for the presidency if anything god forbid happens to Cheney and Bush.So whats wrong with her talking about peace???Sure as shit Bush doesnt want peace.

Wow! cant wait to see the response on that one, fishman3811

i thought war was peace...maybe i'm wrong...

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Originally Posted by psykoactive420

"Keep your friends close and your enemies closer", an intelligent postulate if ever there was

so you agree Syria is not an ally, moreso a enemy to USA.

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Well, I'm sure Syria (the Government of Syria) believes the US considers them an enemy, and our government surely doesn't consider them an ally, but they are no enemies of mine. So in answer to your question they are probably considered an enemy. Is it not better to converse with your enemy as opposed to bombing them. There are too many people that believe in Gunboat diplomacy. I think what Nancy did was to try and open dialog between Syria and the US, not a bad thing in my opinion. Those countries do not have the capacity to take us on militarily. It would be an intelligent thing to bring them over to our way of thinking as opposed to the Muslim extremests. Once a country becomes entirely under Sharia law, the opportunity for dialog is over.

Iraq doesnt or didnt have the capacity to take on the mighty American army but look at that mighty army now.I dont think America has learned anything from the Vietnam fiasco.The Americans will kill for a cause but the muslims are ready to die for a cause and thats the big differance.You cant beat someone who is ready to give up their life.

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Originally Posted by fishman3811

Pelosi is number 3 in line for the presidency if anything god forbid happens to Cheney and Bush.So whats wrong with her talking about peace???Sure as shit Bush doesnt want peace.

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It's called Job Responsibilities:

Executive Branch: Headed by the president. The president carries out federal laws and recommends new ones, directs national defense and foreign policy, and performs ceremonial duties. Powers include directing government, commanding the Armed Forces, dealing with international powers, acting as chief law enforcement officer, and vetoing laws.

Legislative Branch: Headed by Congress, which includes the House of Representatives and the Senate. The main task of these two bodies is to make the laws. Its powers include passing laws, originating spending bills (House), impeaching officials (Senate), and approving treaties (Senate).

Judicial Branch: Headed by the Supreme Court. Its powers include interpreting the Constitution, reviewing laws, and deciding cases involving states' rights.

Speaker Of The House:
As the leader of the majority party, the Speaker may use the powers of the office to advance the legislative agenda of the party. The Speaker is influential in determining which bills the House will consider and determines the schedule. The Speaker also places his party's members on committees. The powerful Committee on Rules, which has been called "the arm of the Speaker," sets the rules for debate, including which, if any, amendments may be in order. The Speaker negotiates many internal matters with the minority leader, such as the membership ratio between parties on committees, and the Speaker selects members of conference committees to negotiate differences with the Senate.


Now unless someone, ANYONE can come up with a link, whatever that states that the Speaker of the House has the right to bypass the President on Foreign relations great; if not, well then I guess saying screw the constitution is o.k. when it works out in the favor of the left only.

IF nobody can challenge this BUT still believes that Pelosi was in the right, lol, please don't throw this b.s. on how were pissing on our constitution up again........it'll be kind of hypocritical to say the least.

Have a good one!:s4:

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Originally Posted by Psycho4Bud

It's called Job Responsibilities:

Executive Branch: Headed by the president. The president carries out federal laws and recommends new ones, directs national defense and foreign policy, and performs ceremonial duties. Powers include directing government, commanding the Armed Forces, dealing with international powers, acting as chief law enforcement officer, and vetoing laws.

Legislative Branch: Headed by Congress, which includes the House of Representatives and the Senate. The main task of these two bodies is to make the laws. Its powers include passing laws, originating spending bills (House), impeaching officials (Senate), and approving treaties (Senate).

Judicial Branch: Headed by the Supreme Court. Its powers include interpreting the Constitution, reviewing laws, and deciding cases involving states' rights.

Speaker Of The House:
As the leader of the majority party, the Speaker may use the powers of the office to advance the legislative agenda of the party. The Speaker is influential in determining which bills the House will consider and determines the schedule. The Speaker also places his party's members on committees. The powerful Committee on Rules, which has been called "the arm of the Speaker," sets the rules for debate, including which, if any, amendments may be in order. The Speaker negotiates many internal matters with the minority leader, such as the membership ratio between parties on committees, and the Speaker selects members of conference committees to negotiate differences with the Senate.


Now unless someone, ANYONE can come up with a link, whatever that states that the Speaker of the House has the right to bypass the President on Foreign relations great; if not, well then I guess saying screw the constitution is o.k. when it works out in the favor of the left only.

IF nobody can challenge this BUT still believes that Pelosi was in the right, lol, please don't throw this b.s. on how were pissing on our constitution up again........it'll be kind of hypocritical to say the least.

Have a good one!:s4:

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Just call me a hypocrite. I just believe in common sense. If the president isn't doing his job and has no intentions of doing it, then someone with some common sense (also second in line to the presidency) seems like an OK person to deal with foriegn governments, soften them up so to speak. I seriously doubt if Pelosis' talks with Syria will have any profound results, but if they help the Syrian leader soften up to a future Democratic regime that might open Dialog with these nations, what's the foul. Hey Bushco will do whatever evil they intend to do, with or without Nancys' influence. I just hope that someone from our country speaking peace might soften the rest of the worlds opinion of us. Right now, we are known as the bullies on the block. You know, this is not a foot ball game. The rest of the world knows we are the toughest in the world, we don't have to threaten everyone we see. Benevolence is a good thing as in more flies with honey than shit etc.

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Originally Posted by medicinal

I just believe in common sense. If the president isn't doing his job and has no intentions of doing it, then someone with some common sense (also second in line to the presidency) seems like an OK person to deal with foriegn governments

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IF Congress really feels that Bush isn't doing his job their position grants them the right to call for impeachment proceedings.....nothing more.

If you are a supervisor at a company and the C.E.O. has a policy that you don't agree with and feel that it's not in the best interests of that company; you don't have the privilage of overriding his policy and if you do your probably fired. Same thing here.......Pelosi decided to take it upon herself to act like she had the rights and privs of the Executive office. Hell, that started off with her request for a Presidential plane upgrade when she took the position. She might be #3 in the rankings but is still considered part of Congress........NOT the Executive branch.

Have a good one!:s4:

Hell, that started off with her request for a Presidential plane upgrade when she took the position. She might be #3 in the rankings but is still considered part of Congress........NOT the Executive branch.
II believe that fiasco was started by the master of arms of the House that dictated protocol that she have a plane at her disposal, Not really nancys' idea. I believe that she was perfectly willing to fly commercial, but for safety reasons they wanted her to have her own airplane. What happened next was the executive jet they assigned her was too small for her entourage, family and friends so she requested a non-stop capable plane as it would be more dangerous to make multiple stops on her cross country flights, and the plane was too small. All she really wanted was to make a nonstop flight from Washington to her home in Calif. So I believe now, she flies commercial. And I believe it is congress' job to keep the executive branch from being a one man show, you know the old checks and balances thing, something that has been missing for the last 6+ years.

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Originally Posted by medicinal

And I believe it is congress' job to keep the executive branch from being a one man show, you know the old checks and balances thing,[/COLOR]

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I'm VERY glad you bring up "checks and balances":

Another system that was developed was the system of checks and balances. Checks and balances, or the separation of powers, is based upon the philosophy of Baron de Montesquieau. In this system the government was to be divided into three branches of government, each branch having particular powers.
Checks and Balances

You either have to admit that Pelosi was crossing lines by trying to act like she belonged to the Executive Branch; or your stating that our entire system needs a revamp and ALL these people should just be able to do whatever they want. The Executive Branch is the ONLY one in charge of foreign policy.....Congress controls the purse strings, not talking to world leaders on our current shit list.

Now if Newt Gingrich would have pulled this during the Clinton years I'm SURE some of you would have been on the warpath!;)

Have a good one!:s4:

beat that dead horse:stoned:

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Originally Posted by eg420ne

beat that dead horse:stoned:

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LMAO! Didn't you mean to post that in a Prisonplanet 9-11 thread.......there's only how many in here now?:D OOOPS.....this isn't about bashing a republican, sorry!!:thumbsup:

Have a good one!:s4:

Nope! people still learning about whatreallyhappened on 911:thumbsup:

P4B What about all the other members of congress who have gone to other countries for diplomacy reasons.Example congressman Danny Haster who went to Columbia to tell them how to handle drug dealers while Clinton was in office,he went on his own not because Clinton told him to go.