advanced string theory

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Originally Posted by Oneironaut

Umm, it's common sense. You can't just change the world with your thoughts. If you want to prove me wrong, cure cancer with your thoughts, or make a ham sandwich with your thoughts. Do anything with just your thoughts and I will be convinced. Do you have any scientific research proving I can't shoot laser beams out of my eyes if I stare at the Moon for eight hours straight? No, but that doesn't mean you should take me seriously if I make an outrageous claim like that. You should ask me to prove it before you take it seriously.

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Common sense is a relativistic anomaly. The only reason its common sense that you cant have a tangible effect upon the world using only thought, is because so many people share the same close-minded ignorance towards the world. If you think you cant do something, you wont be able to do it.

Can you prove to me that I can NOT change the world with my thoughts? I would like to see how you accomplished that.

Also... I want to publicly laugh at any of the people who make outrageous statements and then post the Wikipedia link backing their statements. Wikipedia is a nice site with some great information. However... it is not a professional reference. Anybody can change anything on that site... thats why its called "The online encyclopedia that anybody can edit." Sounds like a recipe for a solidly backed statement to me.......

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Originally Posted by Staurm

Hawkings is over rated. Just because he defied illness and disabilty with such commendable adroitness doesn't make the man a genius. Fritjof Capra has some far more progressive and interesting ideas, I reccommend any of his books, especially The Web of Life.

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You are right. His genius has nothing to do with the fact that he is battling Lou Gehrigs disease. It has to do with all the breakthrough work he has done in the fields of theoretical and astro-physics. Just because other people have some interesting ideas, doesnt mean that Hawking is discredited as a result.

*WHEW* So I have an overwhelming amount to say about this topic lol, but Im gonna try to slim it down...

As a Nuclear Physics major, I am interested in any and every theory, perspective, model, supposition, idea that can be posed. I was once enamored by superstring theory and m-theory, until I began doing more in-depth research. The greatest thing about all these is that they arent even theories... A theory must have some way for a scientist to prove or disprove it. They are merely scientific models by which many people are attempting to devise a unified theory. It is more and more becoming a joke in the scientific community because so many people are trying to figure out the mathematical logistics of it, and then trying to equate it with a physical model. Then they wonder why they have not been able to match them up for the past 60 or so years. Wikipedia's articles are informative, and for the most part, they are not exactly incorrect. HOWEVER, do not expect to read articles from an online encyclopedia that anybody can edit about highly advanced theoretical physics and expect to be well-informed and knowledgeable about the subject.

All matter is comprised of energy. Energy that has been condensed and specialized to achieve whatever properties it has. Energy can not be created nor destroyed, so when we die, that surplus of residual energy is still there. Prove to me that this energy does not remain clustered together and retain its thought-energy properties. I do not even want to go into detail on this because I will go on forever.


I love martial arts as well. I have been obsessed with martial arts techniques and philosophies since I was 4, and have studied many different ones. Shaolin Kung Fu is one of my all time favorites, and I would love to train in the temple. My Sifu worked with some pretty amazing people. Tai Chi is great for balance, strength and controlling your internal energy. Wing Chun Kung Fu is another favorite of mine, and I would love to train under a Sifu as I have only been able to study it on my own. I love Muay Thai, its alot of fun, and its almost as brutal as Wing Chun. As far as Dim Mak is concerned, that is another art that I am studying right now. I have a book written by an osteopathic physician explaining all the concepts of Dim Mak, and then showing how they are truly connected via his knowledge of osteopathic medicine. Dim Mak is no joke... its very dangerous and real. The reason why the orient has remained so relatively unchained for so many thousands of years is because their way of life, their philosophies, even their languages are all interconnected, and give them a deeper, richer perspective of the world.

The one Earthly religion I believe comes closest to the truth? In fact, eerily close.. Zen Buddhism.

Isn't the scientific term for an unproven theory, a theorem?

I too am jumping in in the middle of this, I have not the time to read it all, well I do but I'd probably end up spending even more time replying to everything, and that is what I've not got the time for really.

What bothers me about the Grand Unified Theory, apart from the fact I was inspired to take the wrong career path in my university days, led by its false promise, is that it distracts attention from more exciting prospects hidden in rather more new age sciences based on chaos theory. I think its good that they are pushing these theories to the edge, even though its becoming quite apparent that there is probably not going to be a Grand Unified Theory, it is still fun to explore the madness of science, its what make science interesting.

Zen buddhism and models of life and conciousness based around chaos theory do offer some insight into why this is the case, and it seems that in order to understand this about science you have to study it to the point where you start to know less than you previously knew. But you don't have to be a hot shot scientist, you just have to know a bit about the basics.

I think this is where science is going wrong, we are using this knowledge to destructive ends, where we should all be sitting around going wow we are really never going to work all this out, and I don't want to ever work it out. It's this perpetual state of confusion that makes it all so worth thinking about. I feel as though I have pretty much underpinned what the fuck its all about, but at the same time I have had to come to terms with the fact that I will really never know, and all I have is the feeling that I am surfing the waves of light that make up the universe, and that they will keep coming and offering new insights.

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Originally Posted by Staurm

Hawkings is over rated. Just because he defied illness and disabilty with such commendable adroitness doesn't make the man a genius. Fritjof Capra has some far more progressive and interesting ideas, I reccommend any of his books, especially The Web of Life.

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Originally Posted by GraziLovesMary

You are right. His genius has nothing to do with the fact that he is battling Lou Gehrigs disease. It has to do with all the breakthrough work he has done in the fields of theoretical and astro-physics. Just because other people have some interesting ideas, doesnt mean that Hawking is discredited as a result.

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It's not what I am saying. Hawking plagiarised his students work in his early days. He has discovered nothing that I would describe in any way as epoch making by scientific standards. I am saying the man is not a genius, he is just really clever, and that there are other less emminent scientists in the world, a lot actually, who offer more progressive ideas.

I am not saying he doesn't have my full respect, I think he is a remarkable person. it's just that I have far greater respect and admiration for other scientist and their views. I don't think the human race will ever colonise space to the extent he seems to project in his literature. Perhaps though we all colonise the universe on a spiritual level, though, and we are about to realise this. Maybe that is what he really means.

Quoted from the previous pagina.

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Originally Posted by Staurm

Isn't the scientific term for an unproven theory, a theorem?

I too am jumping in in the middle of this, I have not the time to read it all, well I do but I'd probably end up spending even more time replying to everything, and that is what I've not got the time for really.

What bothers me about the Grand Unified Theory, apart from the fact I was inspired to take the wrong career path in my university days, led by its false promise, is that it distracts attention from more exciting prospects hidden in rather more new age sciences based on chaos theory. I think its good that they are pushing these theories to the edge, even though its becoming quite apparent that there is probably not going to be a Grand Unified Theory, it is still fun to explore the madness of science, its what make science interesting.

Zen buddhism and models of life and conciousness based around chaos theory do offer some insight into why this is the case, and it seems that in order to understand this about science you have to study it to the point where you start to know less than you previously knew. But you don't have to be a hot shot scientist, you just have to know a bit about the basics.

I think this is where science is going wrong, we are using this knowledge to destructive ends, where we should all be sitting around going wow we are really never going to work all this out, and I don't want to ever work it out. It's this perpetual state of confusion that makes it all so worth thinking about. I feel as though I have pretty much underpinned what the fuck its all about, but at the same time I have had to come to terms with the fact that I will really never know, and all I have is the feeling that I am surfing the waves of light that make up the universe, and that they will keep coming and offering new insights.

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Originally Posted by Staurm

It's not what I am saying. Hawking plagiarised his students work in his early days. He has discovered nothing that I would describe in any way as epoch making by scientific standards. I am saying the man is not a genius, he is just really clever, and that there are other less emminent scientists in the world, a lot actually, who offer more progressive ideas.

I am not saying he doesn't have my full respect, I think he is a remarkable person. it's just that I have far greater respect and admiration for other scientist and their views. I don't think the human race will ever colonise space to the extent he seems to project in his literature. Perhaps though we all colonise the universe on a spiritual level, though, and we are about to realise this. Maybe that is what he really means.

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Well I can respect that, and it would seem to me like you have many of the same thought patterns that I seem to have. Whether or not we will end up colonizing the planet as much as some people seem to think we will, I think we should still aspire towards such as that. If not, I can see us losing inspiration and imagination, and that could prove fatal for our species. This planet is fragile, and if we dont start looking towards space as an entire race, and soon, we could end up getting caught in a disaster of apocalyptic proportions with too many of us eggs in basket Earth.

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Originally Posted by Staurm

Isn't the scientific term for an unproven theory, a theorem?

I too am jumping in in the middle of this, I have not the time to read it all, well I do but I'd probably end up spending even more time replying to everything, and that is what I've not got the time for really.

What bothers me about the Grand Unified Theory, apart from the fact I was inspired to take the wrong career path in my university days, led by its false promise, is that it distracts attention from more exciting prospects hidden in rather more new age sciences based on chaos theory. I think its good that they are pushing these theories to the edge, even though its becoming quite apparent that there is probably not going to be a Grand Unified Theory, it is still fun to explore the madness of science, its what make science interesting.

Zen buddhism and models of life and conciousness based around chaos theory do offer some insight into why this is the case, and it seems that in order to understand this about science you have to study it to the point where you start to know less than you previously knew. But you don't have to be a hot shot scientist, you just have to know a bit about the basics.

I think this is where science is going wrong, we are using this knowledge to destructive ends, where we should all be sitting around going wow we are really never going to work all this out, and I don't want to ever work it out. It's this perpetual state of confusion that makes it all so worth thinking about. I feel as though I have pretty much underpinned what the fuck its all about, but at the same time I have had to come to terms with the fact that I will really never know, and all I have is the feeling that I am surfing the waves of light that make up the universe, and that they will keep coming and offering new insights.

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I like this, it echoes many things I have pondered about, and I agree that Zen Buddhism is not to be taken lightly. The last paragraph could have been ripped directly out of my internal monologue.

LMAO @ internal monologue :)

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Originally Posted by GraziLovesMary

This planet is fragile, and if we dont start looking towards space as an entire race, and soon, we could end up getting caught in a disaster of apocalyptic proportions with too many of us eggs in basket Earth.

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Well if you think this planet is fragile, what's it going to be like in space?

I am more inclinced to hold the views of Fritjof Capra with more credibility. I think its important that we concentrate our efforts into sustainable technology on the planet rather than space. There are plenty of exciting new branches of knowledge emerging that are not being given credit by the institutes, largely I think because they are non-profitable. In many respect they give back the power to the people to harness their own energy from a free and seemingly inexhaustable source, the sun.

Whilst it may be possible to colonise the stars, as romanticised by Hawking and Clarke et al, I think this is a long way off and too far into the future to even consider as a possiblity that might save us from an apocalypse. At best it would only save a handful of the rich elite and powerful, I don't think there would be room for a bunch of pot heads like us.

If we can't settle our difference on planet earth, how the hell are we going to settle them in space where there are far less resources to go round.

We are a strong race, and our planet is more than sufficient for us, we just need to ger rid of the capitalists and the war hawks. If we can do that then I am more than happy to accept that I'll never go to the stars in my current mould, to sit round an open fire and just stare at them is enough of a wonder for me, but who knows what the distant future holds for any of us...

Staurm I see your points and I can appreciate your sentiment, however the only way I differ from your viewpoint is by how much energy we should be spending on the space program.

You are absolutely 100% correct... if we cant figure out what the fuck we are doing here, then we will not be able to function as a society in space. HOWEVER.. that does not stand true for everybody, simply the pathetic mass-majority. The people who enroll in, and spend their entire lives in the space program are very serious about it, and sometimes forget all about the shit that goes on here, they are so focussed. I guess my point is, we cant really decide which one is more important, I think we should continue developing each one equally: Our space program, and our ability to interact with our own species as a whole without all the embarrassing ignorance and violence.

When I say this planet is a fragile ecology, Im talking about all the many ways this planet as we know it could be destroyed. Our number one enemy is ourselves... global warming and nuclear war are the biggest threats to this planet and our lives on it, so we definitely need to start from there. However thats not where it ends. Any number of asteroids and meteoroids have the ability to take us off guard and fuck our world up, and whose to say when Yellowstone will go off?? That could happen in 10,000 years, but more likely its gonna happen on this side of a hundred. And what then? I just think we need to slowly begin stretchin our fingers outwards as well. It serves more than just one purpose.

By keeping with the goals we have set, we are starting to form a consciousness with the mindset to suck it up and stray from these natural human tendencies towards chaos and entropy.. to instead work together with a common drive and the goal of betterment and preservation of self AND species. We are also forming the beginnings or the core group of people who are serious and passionate enough about going into space that it is feasible to believe they would not succumb to the self-destructive fallacies of our species. By doing more than just dipping our toes in this endless pool of black, this final frontier, we can still have the manpower, time and resources to spend on keeping shit from falling apart here on Earth, while more and more people get inspired by the stars.


Do you want to know why I think our species is so ignorant even after all weve learned? Because for most people, reality to them ends with the atmosphere. We are still thinking of ourselves in terms of Americans, Chinese, Russians, Canadians, etc... each country thinks they are the baddest ass humans, and were the baddest ass race, and we fuckin dominate this and that and BLAHFUCKINGBLAH. We need to stop thinking we are so fucking significant... we arent. And we need to stop thinking of ourselves in terms of temporary lines drawn on an insignificant planet. We need to start thinking of ourselves as EARTHLINGS. We are all Homo Sapiens.. we are the same race of people with the same possible destinies, and we should be working together; instead of fighting over fucking fossil fuels, we should be collaborating on how to more effectively utilize hydrogen and all the MANY other energy sources.

I dont think we will come together as a species like that until first contact is finally made on a global scale. When our planet as a whole finally realizes we arent alone, maybe then we will begin to coallesce into something fantastic. Until then all we can do is keep reaching a finger or two towards the stars while trying to continue balancing shit out here on Earth. But I firmly believe we do need to maintain some sort of balance or we could end up getting locked into some amazingly stupid shit. Like for instance, a two-term presidential war with a personal agenda.

Most of the people who enroll in these space programs are in it for the money and the career. I once had a job in space, 30 quid an hour they were paying me. I walked out after three days because it bored the shit out of me, and I couldn't be arsed wearing all the clean suit gear. I decided to go to India instead. The job I had to do was making me lethargic and depressed, and the immediately senior management/ex army boys were annoying me too much.

Your right about some peoples concept of space though, I had to laugh recently when someone I was working with on a normal banjo man job asked me what shooting stars were. It's debris from space entering the atmosphere and burning up, you know rocks and stuff. His reply to that was "But how do they get up there?" To be fair though, it was 4 in the morning and we were all blazed on the job. Furthermore he didn't have a university degree in physics, and therefore effectively had the astronomical mind of a 6 year old.

I don't mind all this sending probes to Mars, and I hope to see the human race go to the moon again within my lifetime, or even Mars who knows. It just annoys the crap out of me that there's money for that, there's money for war, but there is no money for me to start some new sustainable non-starship enterprise. There's no money for me to buy a plot of land back from the empire and grow vegetables in my garden, whilst spending the rest of my days getting phased and studying fractal patterns.