SO READIN ALL THIS SHIT R MOST U PEOPLE ATHEIST OR DO U JUST CALL URSELF RELIGIUOSE AND GO TO CHURCH TO BE ON "GODS GOOD SIDE" IF HE REALLY DOES EXSIST?MABY I SHOULD MAKE A POLL
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SO READIN ALL THIS SHIT R MOST U PEOPLE ATHEIST OR DO U JUST CALL URSELF RELIGIUOSE AND GO TO CHURCH TO BE ON "GODS GOOD SIDE" IF HE REALLY DOES EXSIST?MABY I SHOULD MAKE A POLL
Who says we imagine, mabe were just reactions to actions based off of genetic data.
I'm listening to Ace of base. I wish i had grown up in H.S when this music was about. You just cant compare 70's and 80's music, with nowadays.
Eminem - led zepplin, who wins?
Chad Cougar - Mc Jager. Who wins?
Tool - Pink floyd. Who wins, though tool does rock.
Alexis on fire - Iron maiden.
Common now.
The C
Remember Jesus words. I am "he" therefore "i am." (not exact qupte but the meaning)
It's fucking nuts, thats what were learnirng about now in the science community, laws are based around our dimension and they are because they haveto be, and it has to be evergoing because we are the consequnce. <-- this is me speaking now.
We havto be for the 4th dimension to make sense, were just a code of rules for there to be more advanced rules, as there needs to be a 2d for there to be the basic concepts for there to be 3D, but a person in 2d cannot comprehend what is in 3d. But he can understand all the rules of his dimension. And our string of dimensions are just one of the endless options. <-- mix of what i think and what i've heard/read.
We are so there can be a 4th dimension, and it cant end, it is because it has to be, because if there wasnt then thier wouldnt be a purpose, and there cant be nothing, because nothing is a concept, and if theres one concpet why not 10? or a billion.. +1
If this makes any sense let me know.
Ramblings of a stoner.
The C
because the innocence of 'the garden" is nature, where the carnage and death of survival of the fittest is the most perfect harmony. life rolls on, its in the stones, the fossils tell us it is so. simple animal behaviour observations tell us its so.Quote:
Originally Posted by Torog
nature is divine. it is gods great act. forget heaven and all the bits and pices in the bible, for me-it was finsished on the sixth day. its all i need to hear. yes god, youre a goddam genius, as i marvel on your creation the world (and still why, why god why, did you allow man to go evil, not heard of pre emptive salvation???aye???)
the perfect church is the earth, the congregation the cycle of matter and if you like, souls.
nature is divine. nature is god. it his his purest form, his most complex form, his most beautiful form, his most useful form.
praise him lets have a smoke.
why cant the big bang and evolution be part of gods creation? certainly evolution is a majestic thing. just because some guys 2000 years ago said "create" instead of "evolve" due to a wanting of scientific jargon and lack of a clue doesnt mean we should forever be bound to it?
what if jesus had walked past when someone was rabbitting on that the world was flat? would have made it a holy moment and therefore ultimate truth.
ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh hhhhhhhhhhhhh.
i need to be alone.
with a tree.
Every living organism has a survival instinct, that's one of the definitions of life itself. If any organism, even a single-cell being, does not have this instinct, we wouldn't be here today, nor would anything but rocks and volcanoes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Torog
BTW, there's nothing in evolution theory that disproves God exists. The theory just states that God did not create all life as it is today some 3000-4000 years ago, but that life evolved over millions of years to reach a present state. The theory also does not dismiss that fact that if you have faith in God, you can always argue that he got the ball rolling, and that in itself is a beautiful concept if you ask me, and the ultimate expression of God's gift of free will. Agree or disagree? :D
Nice post, FLESH - and, yes, I did read it all lol
I may have not explained my view-point well enough (despite Scouser's well-received compliment lol), which is a somewhat wild notion of what I believe.
-I did see the documentary about Oliver, and found it to be very bizarre and interesting-
Darwin was (IMO) absolutely correct with his evoution theory......except, I believe he was wrong in thinking that we evolved from apes. I'll explain this later.
Torog - the need to survive and adapt is an intrical part of every living things' basic instinct. The human brain is made up of 4 main areas - the smallest area (situated deep inside, near to the base of the brain) is called the 'Primary'. This houses our 'natural response instructions' (fight or flight, etc) - or our 'animal instincts', if you prefer. It is from there, that we get our 'imperatives'. I'll explain later.
In answer to C.
You make a very valid point, C - we are bound by the rules of our perception; laws of physics, for example. We in the 3rd dimension, can only hypothesise about the 4th dimension (and beyond), because we can only think in human terms - therefore, as soon as we start bending the rules, our findings become nothing more than conjecture and ideology. No need to explain this further (but may come back to it later ;) )
Imotep, you seem to think roughly along the same lines as I do, judging by your post.
I too, regard this Earth and all it's diverse inhabitants, both plant and animal, with a sense of awe. I feel it everytime I witness a beautiful sunset. I see it when I marvel at the interconnectivity and partnership that makes this planet work. I know it, when I consider the overall fragility of this self-sufficent rock, we call Earth. It truly is a magnificent creation.
You ask God "why did you allow man to go evil?" - there is a reason for this, I believe...and I'll explain it later lol
I was hoping that I could put my ideas in a txt.doc, but unfortunately I can't...so, that means I'm gonna clog the thread a bit...sorry :o
THE EXPLAINATION (woohoo :D )
*this may get a bit disjointed at times, sorry :o*
Firstly, we need to stop thinking in human terms. Forget about your immediate perception of this dimension, and the laws that govern it. In other words, the laws of physics only apply to us humans, but we are trying to address the existence of something (someone) that is beyond human. Try to look at humans and the Earth as someone would veiw something that they have made - quite simply, imagine that you were God.
Due to the results of 'natural selection', we can assume that humans are the subject matter, and that the Earth was made with a view to sustaining that life-form.
We'll ignore the presence of the universe for now, and accept that it is the required environment to create Earth in (so Earth becomes like a molecule within a saline solution in scale).
So, we've created Earth and it seems like, after many previous failed attempts, we have finally got it right - life begins to flourish.
However, after a while we discover that our chosen vessel for advancement (the ape), isn't evolving quite as well as we had thought. We decide to take a selection away from the environment, so that we can genetically modify them to accelerate their mutation, and reintroduce them once the modification had taken place.
This might go some way to explain the 'missing link' conundrum.
I mean, apes and monkeys of today, may well still be going through the original genetic programming that was meant for us. We can already see how monkeys learn like us, and reflect many of our tribal traits and 'humanistic qualities'. There is much evidence to suggest our relation to the ape, but for the ommision of a crucial element in the DNA structure - what if that missing element was that which was modified by the creator?
It might also explain why our evolution has been accelerating, both in a physical and mental sense.
The reason that it is hard for us to accept this idea, is due to our perception of reality and understanding of dimension. Yet there are some people who believe in God, who is surely of another dimension by definition alone.
If we are to believe that God created Man in the image of Himself, then we must stop referring to that 'image' as being visual; if it were so, then there would only be male (or female, of course lol). Therefore, we can assume that the 'image' is more to do with our base instincts, than our physical appearence.
We now enter into the philosophies of Yin and Yang - the battle of good vs evil, of which there can be no victor, because it would upset the very mechanism that drives nature and helps it to survive.
We all have the capacity to carry out terrible acts of evilness - some succumb to those primeval urges, and some do not. From every act of terror, to every natural disaster that has happened, or will happen, will come something equally as benefical. And with each lesson learned, we take another step towards our ultimate conclusion - thus evolving in mind and spirit.
This is why God 'allowed' Man "to go evil", Imotep, it is an (unfortunately) necessary part of our evolutionary process.
Torog believes that our 'imperatives' are divine - maybe he's not so far from the truth.
We are all subject to a genetic code - the instructions that build us into the thing that we are. That same code must contain the instructions that control our thought patterns.
That we are individual, cannot be denied (finger prints alone, prove it), however, we all have the same basic instincts; greed, selfishness, caring, compassion, etc. But the thing that seems to set us apart from every other living thing on this planet, is that 'survial of the fittest' applies to our own species as well.
In my opinion, religion has bastardised the belief in God, some people turned that belief into a money making power tool, to control the opinions of the masses toward their own political and egoistical gain.
That said, I do not blame those who follow religion - I just think that they are the victim of someone else's power trip.
I do not wish to offend, and would offer in my defense that I respect those peoples beliefs in God, but question the religious context that those beliefs reflect.
Just my honest opinion :)
I believe that there is a 'higher being', I would name that entity God, because that is the universally accepted name of such a thing. God exists in a dimension that we cannot yet comprehend, and we are subject to his quest.
To the question, "why are we here?", the answer could be as simple as, "what happens if?"
Or, even more simply - "yes, or no?"
We can apply this basic question to every aspect of our lives, and on every scale of importance; from "do I want a cup of tea?", to "shall I invent the atom bomb?"
Every single decision that we make, however small, has a repercussional effect upon the whole. It is the fundamentally basic law of physics that binds our very existence - action vs reaction. If we accpet that 'causality' exists, then we must now look at the whole, rather than the one.
What it the mission of the whole?
I wonder at the thing that we are meant to ultimately achieve.
Are we meant to achieve the ability to replicate ourselves - ie, cloning, or AI?
Are we meant to learn how to manipulte the environment of our own planet, or indeed, otherworlds?
Or is it just a case of producing the ultimate virus?
I hope I haven't offended any one, but these are my honest opinions. However, as with all theories and ideas, I remain open to proof of the contrary.
Life and let live, that's what I say. We're all in this together, like it or not, why don't we all strive to find a way to make this experience as uplifting and pleasurable as possible?
Just my thoughts :)
Res...
Right on, Res
Although I disagree with some of your suggestions, I have to agree with your parting phrase - "Life and let live, that's what I say. We're all in this together, like it or not, why don't we all strive to find a way to make this experience as uplifting and pleasurable as possible?"
I'm an Atheist. Maybe, after some deep soul-searching, one day I might progress (or regress, even lol) to an Agnostic, but for now I don't believe there is a God for my own reasons.
But the point that I want to get across is this; It Doesn't Really Matter!!... Whether God exists or not, it won't really affect our lives.. It won't really make our decisions any easier to make, or our troubles any easier to overcome.. the idea that believing in God will some how manke your life simpler is an illusion, or maybe its a fantasy.. But believing in God[s] does cause tension and anomosity between family, friends, cities, countries... what's it all for? For something we can neevr prove? That seems like a stupid reason to hate your fellow man.. Maybe we should all just give up the quest for God and begin the search for Peace? Maybe then we can all start living together instead of just tolerating (barely) eachother?? It would make a change..
these pretzels are makin me thirsty.
LOL!!Quote:
Originally Posted by Imotep