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First attempt at a 24-hour "Martian Method"
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dogznova
Sal I got another question for ya. Have you looked into ceramic infrared heat emitter lamps that are used for reptiles to provide a far red - infrared source during the SID?
The sensitivity of the plants is primarily in the Far Red 700nm to 800nm range, while Infra Red is primarily above the 800nm range. So while there might some benefit to using a Infra Red emitter, the benefits per watt would be less than using a source with more Far Red emmisson.
Infra Red LEDs are much cheaper than Far Red LEDs, but no one uses the Infra Red LEDs for plant growth due to the lack of responce compared to the more costly Far Red LEDs.
Dollar for dollar, regular clear and colorred incandescent lamps are a much better investment than Infra Red Reptile emitters.
I'll get that email out to you soon. I just have a few other things I gotta get done first. Sorry for the delay on that.
Take Care, Sal.
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First attempt at a 24-hour "Martian Method"
Thanks sal... You the man :thumbsup:
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First attempt at a 24-hour "Martian Method"
Sal, don't you think the halogen is more efficient in the red, farred, and Infarred than the Incan?
<img>http://heelspurs.com/a/led/black3.gif
<IMG SRC="http://heelspurs.com/a/led/black3.gif" ALT="http://heelspurs.com/a/led/black3.gif">
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First attempt at a 24-hour "Martian Method"
Quote:
Originally Posted by billyjojimbob11
Sal, don't you think the halogen is more efficient in the red, farred, and Infarred than the Incan?
<img>
http://heelspurs.com/a/led/black3.gif
<IMG SRC="http://heelspurs.com/a/led/black3.gif"
Halogen does seem to be more efficient in those areas but halogen lights would only be able to be used during your (blue light) on time or your clear INC on time. Halogen lights go to far below 500 nm to replace PAD lights such as red,orange,yellow,black and (green with a filter) INC's. Hope that helps. I'm sure Sal will post a better explanation then I. :thumbsup:
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First attempt at a 24-hour "Martian Method"
Quote:
Originally Posted by billyjojimbob11
Sal, don't you think the halogen is more efficient in the red, farred, and Infarred than the Incan?
<img>
http://heelspurs.com/a/led/black3.gif
<IMG SRC="http://heelspurs.com/a/led/black3.gif" ALT="http://heelspurs.com/a/led/black3.gif">
Yes they most certainly do, but in my conception at least the Halogen is an Incandescent, just a better version of one, and I would in fact refer to it as a Halogen Incandescent or Incandescent Halogen lamps, not to mention Quartz Halogen lamps witch are the same thing only then their hyping the envelope material. I think marketting of "Halogen" lamps is a bit pumped up since they are barrowing a bit from (metal) Halide fame, before the "Halogen" marketting hit the automotive industry, "Quartz" bulbs were the best and often considered reserved for only high performance applications like motorcycle and 4X4 Off Road Vehicle lamps, but then again they Quartz bulbs, just the better ones.
But, I also agree with Dogznova somewhat, since he makes an excellent point:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dogznova
Halogen does seem to be more efficient in those areas but halogen lights would only be able to be used during your (blue light) on time or your clear INC on time. Halogen lights go to far below 500 nm to replace PAD lights such as red,orange,yellow,black and (green with a filter) INC's. Hope that helps. I'm sure Sal will post a better explanation then I. :thumbsup:
I agree that the over the counter colorred "Party" bulbs are the cheapest and easiest Far Red PAD sources you can ahold of, but once you've got the PAD bug moving on to a more advance set-up allows you to use more efficient sources with better cooling provisions.
I do use Halogen's as much as possible and since I'm a huge fan of air cooled hoods and cool tubes, and I use sealed (ducted) air cooled hoods as much as possible while running Incandescent (~Halogen) type Far Red sources.
So BillyJoJimBob, I'm sorry if I left some confusion as to the desirability of Halogen sources verses standard Inc.'s, but again I consider them the same thing basically and colorred Halogen's aren't out there at the moment and I doubt they ever will be (no serious demand). Even the better collored Reptile Far Red bulbs are just better quality glass Inc.s, but if Halogen colorred bulbs do come out, I bet they'll probably be top of the line Reptile lamps.
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First attempt at a 24-hour "Martian Method"
Actually this is the one I use. Should filter out all of the 400-500nm?
Your thoughts?
Color PAR 20 Halogen Light Bulb 130V 50W Narrow Flood Red, Case of 15
There are many more on the market, Am I not filtering my blues?
Used with Leds in the dark
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First attempt at a 24-hour "Martian Method"
BTW, I use this cockelbur method with a procyon.
Im using the "E" method on this chart. hours 18-24
http://users.rcn.com/jkimball.ma.ult...leburChart.gif
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First attempt at a 24-hour "Martian Method"
Nice chart BJJJB :thumbsup:
Got a link where I can browse the rest of that info?
Mahalo,
Weezard
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First attempt at a 24-hour "Martian Method"
Fo sho!
Photoperiodism
also do a google image search for photoperiodism.
You will find a wealth of info.
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First attempt at a 24-hour "Martian Method"
I had such a nice wordy post on this for you, but the server got busy and kicked me off and I lost it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by billyjojimbob11
Gotta run, so really short version:
Actually those can have problems, due to light leakage through the dichroic reflectors used on the these kind of bulbs. And they are harder to block any light leaks on due to their higher operating tempertures.
I'd check them by looking through a Blue filter for any glow they might put off in the Blue wavelengths, but then again I'd check that when setting up any PAD system sources.
I'm late, hope that leaves you with more questions than answers. Gotta run.
Take Care, Sal.
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First attempt at a 24-hour "Martian Method"
So far so good, I am in flower.
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First attempt at a 24-hour "Martian Method"
billyjoe... Did I read that correct. You are using blue light (wavelengths below 500nm) in your 12 hour dark period and getting flowers? How long is it on for? Is it a halogen light source.
Sorrry for so many questions..:thumbsup:
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First attempt at a 24-hour "Martian Method"
Here is 14 days using this new light schedule and my DIY form of
the "Martian Method".
The first pic is the 400w HPS. The second pic is using an old white
CFL light (just for pic shots not for growing). The third pic is
when the 4 red inc's are on. The forth pic is under the 2
blacklights (can't see a thing) LOL.
The INC bulbs are attached to the outside of a yield master II hood
and the whole setup is on a light mover. The light rail is also
moving when the PAD lights are on. More pic's soon of the "Tub O
Clones" "SOG" "Martian Method" extravaganza.
The 24 hour schedule we currently are using.....
10 hours of 400w 2K HPS (our blue light source)
4 hours of 100w Red Inc's - 4/25w red inc party bulbs (our PAD
light source)
1 hour of 120w BlackLight Inc's - 2/60w blacklight inc bulbs. A
form of SOD (standard outdoor darkness) w/AD dynamics
9 hours of SID (standard indoor darkness)
On a side note my uncle has been doing some foliar feeding,
Unfortunately I had to get him to stop. What ever he was spraying
on them is causing the leaves to wrinkle and show some little
spots. I understand Blueberry is known for it's leaf wrinkle but it
started to look a little excessive to me. He has used this spray in
the past but not wile doing any form of the "Martian Method". We
had similar problems before with the procyon and it's red led
lights. Something about red lights do funky things with nutrient
uptake IMO. I think what my uncle was spraying on the girls is a
diluted version of Grandma Enggy's Fulvic Acid. Sal do you have any
thoughts on this red light nutrient uptake syndrome?
Sal... If you got time I also got another question for ya. After 2.5 to
3 hours into the red inc's (on time) the tops of my girls start to
turn away or (lean away from the red inc lights). This is the first
time I've noticed this. I made sure to have my uncle check it for
another 3 to 4 days just to make sure it wasn't a one time thing.
He say's it's happing every day at the 2.5 to 3 hour mark of the
red inc's (on time). If my memory serves me correctly you said let
the plants dictate what they want. I'm not so sure the girls want 4
hours of red inc's at this early stage of flowering. Should we
start turning the red inc's off just before this happens or is this
one of the effects of having increased far red?
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First attempt at a 24-hour "Martian Method"
Very pretty, Dog! I love the updates! Sorry I haven't had any of my own. I'm waiting a little bit before I start my next grow log... probably a few weeks or so. Keep up the hard work!
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First attempt at a 24-hour "Martian Method"
Thank's mom. Hope you don't mind me still posting in this log. I still need some practice before starting my own tread.. Is it ok ?
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First attempt at a 24-hour "Martian Method"
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First attempt at a 24-hour "Martian Method"
Dog, I have a red lense filter on the Halogen and I used a homemade spectrometer and could not find any blue light coming through. To answer your question, no I do not use blue light on the dark side of the "martian method". But a sidenote...At the begining of flower, I use shitloads of blue leds and filterless halogen, along with the procyon during the light period. For the dark I use the red halogen.
As far as the nute uptake, I had a similar problem, then I used a bone meal tea and some epsom salt cause I was getting nute lockout. Dont know if that is related to your prob.
GL HF!
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First attempt at a 24-hour "Martian Method"
Thanks for the info billyjoj.. Not sure myself about the nut uptake. We have done a few other grows using some form of the Martian Method and not had this type of leaf curl before. My uncle will be starting a second batch of the "Tub O Clones" soon and we will not be spraying the girls this time. :thumbsup:
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First attempt at a 24-hour "Martian Method"
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dogznova
On a side note my uncle has been doing some foliar feeding,
Unfortunately I had to get him to stop. What ever he was spraying
on them is causing the leaves to wrinkle and show some little
spots. I understand Blueberry is known for it's leaf wrinkle but it
started to look a little excessive to me. He has used this spray in
the past but not wile doing any form of the "Martian Method". We
had similar problems before with the procyon and it's red led
lights. Something about red lights do funky things with nutrient
uptake IMO. I think what my uncle was spraying on the girls is a
diluted version of Grandma Enggy's Fulvic Acid. Sal do you have any
thoughts on this red light nutrient uptake syndrome?
Sal... If you got time I also got another question for ya. After 2.5 to
3 hours into the red inc's (on time) the tops of my girls start to
turn away or (lean away from the red inc lights). This is the first
time I've noticed this. I made sure to have my uncle check it for
another 3 to 4 days just to make sure it wasn't a one time thing.
He say's it's happing every day at the 2.5 to 3 hour mark of the
red inc's (on time). If my memory serves me correctly you said let
the plants dictate what they want. I'm not so sure the girls want 4
hours of red inc's at this early stage of flowering. Should we
start turning the red inc's off just before this happens or is this
one of the effects of having increased far red?
I haven't grown that strain and I haven't used that particular spray, so I couldn't tell you what it might be. If you were growing the same plant and using that same spray using a standard 12/12 method, then some comparison could be made, but with out such information to determine that this is a "red light nutrient uptake syndrome", I wouldn't assume it's it's the spectrum or time schedule that's doing it. Also since it's a foliar application of nutrients, there shouldn't be an uptake problem, and I'd be more inclined to think it's a problem caused by some aspect of the spray itself. I do a lot more prep on my nutrient sprays specifically because the nutrient go straight into the plants tissues and can cause much more rapid and serious nutrient problems than root feeding.
What you are seeing with the tips of the plants turning is related a conbination of plant reponses to spectrums. Blue light destroys auxin and the auxin causes plant cells to expand, but blue light destroying the auxin causes the cells to stink, which causes the plant to turn towards Blue light. A similar effect occurs from increased Far Red to Red ratios, which cause the cells on the opposite side of the stem from the radiation source to expand.
What you are seeing is a response to the segregation of the Blue, Red and Far Red spectrums compared to time as the plant changes from one spectrum responce to another. Without the Blue responce in PAD (Red Inc.'s) the plant isn't as strongly guided towards the radiation source and it wanders a bit due to the increase in auxin in the expanding cells on the sources side of the stems. Plants do this in Natural Darkness, both SID and SOD, and the only reason it seems odd to you is that you wouldn't likely notice this in Natural Darkness where it's harder to make such observations. Interesting how how PAD teaches stuff that was always there but we just don't notice it in more "Natural" environments.
As to "let the plants dictate what THEY WANT", they are telling you more here in respect to what they "will do". The question is "Do YOU WANT them to do this?" I can tell you that do things to take advantage of the larger number of options PAD provides me as a grower, custom alter the plants environment to give ME what I WANT. The tips bending away from the radiation sources makes them spread out more that otherwise, but people always training their plant to bend in such a manner? Do YOU want it?
I've concentrated my decisions concerning early flowering mainly on growth rate and stem elongation, and I keep the plants in my preferred "zone" by changing spectrums and their scheduling dictates in each stage of flowering to give ME what I WANT. And what I get is both better yield, potency and convenience (by reducing stem elongation/stretch, it's more convenient for me not to spend more time bending tips and training them down to keep the light intensity on my canopy up, keeping yeild up).
"Should we start turning the red inc's off just before this happens or is this
one of the effects of having increased far red?" If you can't stand to see it, but the Far Red:Red ratio would actually be higher when this happens in the dark when you wouldn't notice it so much.
Something that is helpful to remember when trying to predict the final results of what you are seeing now is: Plant cells take 10 hours to reproduce and the resulting stem elongation is from the state of the cells when they reproduce, so if you maintain less stem elongation (Far Red:Red ratio) during your 24 hour growing day on average - you'll get less stem elongation, but with more photosynthesis you get more growth.
I do use PAD in early flowering, using lower Far Red:Red ratios than I increase them to as stem elongation subsides at the end of early flowering.
As long as you don't overdue it with the Blacklights, then using PAD should always result in less stem elongation, but using Inc.'s to increase growth during the Blue "Day" will increase stem elongation.
I'd say watch your stem elongation for the final decision. And by stem elongation I mean the internode distance more than the overall stem height increase, because you get more growth from PAD compared to SID.
An equal length of stem elongation with more nodes will give you more yield!
I hate to keep harping on synergy, but most people never consider the node count during early flower stretch. There's a lot more going on at any one time than just one factor.
If I was getting more nodes with the same exact amount of early flower stretch, I'd consider it an advantage.
It's all about "What you want". Here I don't see a symptom that the plant is sick or wanting for something. I see an option, you didn't have before.
Sorry if choices seem like headaches.
Choosing to do an old school 12/12 the first 10 days to 2 weeks of flower is one option people have used, switching to PAD after that. I choose the lower Far Red:Red ratio PAD option, but I use a lot more spectral/scheduling steps and combinations than others (I like using all my options, that's how I get the best results).
Even in Darkness... ...It's lonely at the top... ...(where no one can see you grin.)
Take Care, Sal.
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First attempt at a 24-hour "Martian Method"
hey just read this thread, I'm not going to pretend I understand it all.
Had an idea though, how about this..
Instead of dealing with a '24' hour based cycle, why not take this one step further and 'divide by' - change the cycle time, say by a reducing factor of 24x.
e.g. 30 minutes light + far red + red, 10 minutes SID 20 minutes martian night, this is just an example I know those figures aren't right.
Has anyone ever tried anything like that or is this just a whacked out idea? :]
Peace,
Denial
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First attempt at a 24-hour "Martian Method"
Quote:
Originally Posted by salmayo
What you are seeing with the tips of the plants turning is related a conbination of plant reponses to spectrums. Blue light destroys auxin and the auxin causes plant cells to expand, but blue light destroying the auxin causes the cells to stink, which causes the plant to turn towards Blue light. A similar effect occurs from increased Far Red to Red ratios, which cause the cells on the opposite side of the stem from the radiation source to expand.
What you are seeing is a response to the segregation of the Blue, Red and Far Red spectrums compared to time as the plant changes from one spectrum responce to another. Without the Blue responce in PAD (Red Inc.'s) the plant isn't as strongly guided towards the radiation source and it wanders a bit due to the increase in auxin in the expanding cells on the sources side of the stems. Plants do this in Natural Darkness, both SID and SOD, and the only reason it seems odd to you is that you wouldn't likely notice this in Natural Darkness where it's harder to make such observations. Interesting how how PAD teaches stuff that was always there but we just don't notice it in more "Natural" environments..
This explains it nicely.. Thanks
Quote:
Originally Posted by salmayo
"Should we start turning the red inc's off just before this happens or is this one of the effects of having increased far red?" If you can't stand to see it, but the Far Red:Red ratio would actually be higher when this happens in the dark when you wouldn't notice it so much..
Oh ya I can stand to see it. I just wanted to make sure it wasn't some funky thing happening to the girls. I like it..:thumbsup:
Quote:
Originally Posted by salmayo
I'd say watch your stem elongation for the final decision. And by stem elongation I mean the internode distance more than the overall stem height increase, because you get more growth from PAD compared to SID..
Defiantly will watch internode distance
Quote:
Originally Posted by salmayo
If I was getting more nodes with the same exact amount of early flower stretch, I'd consider it an advantage..
Me too..
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First attempt at a 24-hour "Martian Method"
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dogznova
Here is 14 days using this new light schedule and my DIY form of
the "Martian Method".
The 24 hour schedule we currently are using.....
10 hours of 400w 2K HPS (our blue light source)
4 hours of 100w Red Inc's - 4/25w red inc party bulbs (our PAD
light source)
1 hour of 120w BlackLight Inc's - 2/60w blacklight inc bulbs. A
form of SOD (standard outdoor darkness) w/AD dynamics
9 hours of SID (standard indoor darkness)
Dog, I've been squinting at those pictures trying to gauge the progress of the tips in terms of morphology. And something to watch for is small popcorn type bud development if you have overshot the equivalent SID length (~12hrs).
The Dark timing schedule you're using suggests that you need a Red Inc. Time Factor of about 2.5 to 3.5 to hit a 12 hour equivalent total SID target. BUT, Red Inc.'s move pretty fast (fairly low Time Factor) and I think that you're probably overshooting a 12 hour equivalent SID Darkness duration.
So I would be looking at the plants for signs that they are responding to what THEY percieve as more like a 11/13 type SID schedule, which would produce tiny buds that would finish up and slow growth as if ready to harvest, even though the plants could support more yield the genetics on the clock will tell it that it's finished since it percieves the clock signals as telling it that the season is over and it's time to put everything into protecting the seeds (pods) which gives good potency rather that yeild at this early stage.
If you get the feeling that this is happening, I would drop the hour of Blacklights (since they don't photosynthesize anyway) and watch for improved growth (it should get you pretty close), and then if you want to adjust it more, just vary the regular SID time to fine tune it in.
My personal game is to push how much SID I can swap for PAD (Red Inc. in your case here) to see how much extra photosynthesis and improved growth I can get in, but it's you world in your garden (we each are Masters in our own realms).
Time to practice and exercise those Grow Master Brain muscles.
Take Care, Sal.
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First attempt at a 24-hour "Martian Method"
Quote:
Originally Posted by denialisback
hey just read this thread, I'm not going to pretend I understand it all.
Had an idea though, how about this..
Instead of dealing with a '24' hour based cycle, why not take this one step further and 'divide by' - change the cycle time, say by a reducing factor of 24x.
e.g. 30 minutes light + far red + red, 10 minutes SID 20 minutes martian night, this is just an example I know those figures aren't right.
Has anyone ever tried anything like that or is this just a whacked out idea? :]
Peace,
Denial
Things like this will result in veg type growth, since flowering does require more dark time on the plants genetic clock.
Take Care, Sal.
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First attempt at a 24-hour "Martian Method"
Quote:
Originally Posted by salmayo
Dog, I've been squinting at those pictures trying to gauge the progress of the tips in terms of morphology. And something to watch for is small popcorn type bud development if you have overshot the equivalent SID length (~12hrs)..
Yes... In those pic's there are no popcorn buds yet. Under a standard 12/12 there would be at the 14 day mark.
Quote:
Originally Posted by salmayo
The Dark timing schedule you're using suggests that you need a Red Inc. Time Factor of about 2.5 to 3.5 to hit a 12 hour equivalent total SID target. BUT, Red Inc.'s move pretty fast (fairly low Time Factor) and I think that you're probably overshooting a 12 hour equivalent SID Darkness duration.
So I would be looking at the plants for signs that they are responding to what THEY percieve as more like a 11/13 type SID schedule, which would produce tiny buds that would finish up and slow growth as if ready to harvest, even though the plants could support more yield the genetics on the clock will tell it that it's finished since it percieves the clock signals as telling it that the season is over and it's time to put everything into protecting the seeds (pods) which gives good potency rather that yeild at this early stage..
It dose seem like it's on a 11/13 type of SID schedule. But since we did not veg the girls for the extra two weeks (like we normally do).. This type of flowering schedule worked great for us in the first two weeks and the extra growth was what the girls needed IMO. We will cut down the Red Inc's (on time) to 3.5 hours after week two with the next batch. The next batch will also only get two weeks of veg time under the T5's. Tonight I will get my uncle right on switching the red inc's on time since were kind of a week late on this thought.
Tomarrow is the end of week 3 :(.
Quote:
Originally Posted by salmayo
If you get the feeling that this is happening, I would drop the hour of Blacklights (since they don't photosynthesize anyway) and watch for improved growth (it should get you pretty close), and then if you want to adjust it more, just vary the regular SID time to fine tune it in..
Yes, we will get rid of the blacklights and put the red inc's on for 3.5 hours. By the way the blacklights looked cool as hell when they were on. :thumbsup:. I think 3 to 3.5 will be the sweet spot for this strain.
Quote:
Originally Posted by salmayo
My personal game is to push how much SID I can swap for PAD (Red Inc. in your case here) to see how much extra photosynthesis and improved growth I can get in, but it's you world in your garden (we each are Masters in our own realms)
This is a game I will someday learn...
More pic's tomorrow. I talked to my uncle yesterday and he said that the girls were starting to get popcorn buds. We shall see.
Sal thanks for your help. :rasta:
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First attempt at a 24-hour "Martian Method"
Quote:
Originally Posted by salmayo
Things like this will result in veg type growth, since flowering does require more dark time on the plants genetic clock.
Take Care, Sal.
hey salmayo, firstly thanks for taking me seriously, it's quite a mad hat idea..
secondly, ahh I see, so its the plants genetic clock. I've been looking into a way of changing that, not something for this thread I guess, I've started another "new strain flowering 2 weeks" if people are interested. The basic aim would be to change the plants natural cycle. I guess this is something that can only be accomplished genetically not photosynthetically as such :-)
Peace,
denial
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First attempt at a 24-hour "Martian Method"
Here is 21 days using our first 24 hour "Martian Method" schedule. 10 hours HPS, 4 hours PAD, 1 hour blacklights, 9 hours SID.
The first pic is under the 400w HPS. The second pic is using an old white CFL light. The third pic is a group shot under the CFL.
The new "Martian Method" 24 hour schedule will be.....
10 hours 400w 2K HPS (our blue light source)
3.5 hours 126w 4/25w red inc party bulbs 2/13w red cfl's (PAD light source)
10.5 hours SID (standard indoor darkness)
We pulled the blacklights and added two 13w red cfl's in there place. We also took away some PAD light (on time), as noted above. The girls are doing ok but as you can see in the pic's the small spots from my uncle's impressive foliar feeding program are now bigger and the leaf wrinkle is still there. I'm glad I got him to stop spraying. It looks to me like his spray mixture was too strong. Ether he didn't mix it properly or the solution he used was bad, I'm not sure. I would think in about 5 or 6 weeks from now we will hardly be able to see it's effects. I hope.... LOL
The girls are starting to get small popcorn buds. I tried to take close up pic's of this for ya Sal so you don't have to squint. To my eyes the girls are actually looking about 3 or 4 days ahead of our "standard" 16 week schedule at this point. I'm counting our first two weeks of this "Martian Method" grow as veg time. So to me these girls have only been flowering 1 week and already are showing the start of popcorn buds. The girls are 30 inches tall now and pretty much have stopped growing in height at this point. They were 6 inches or so when we put them in the tubs. The growth has been great so far.
The next batch my uncle and I will use a 400w MH light for the first two weeks then switch to a HPS for the rest of the flowering duration. I still want to overshoot our 12 hour of equivalent SID Darkness duration and keep the girls in the veg/flower mode for the first two weeks like we did this time. The reason for this is our clones are only getting 2 weeks of T5 veg time (in 16oz cups). We can make up for the missing 2 weeks of veg time using this type of overshoot Martian schedule for 2 weeks. Then my uncle can bring down our PAD "on time" after the growth we want has been achieved. Somewhere between 25 and 30 inches. He is going to start a new batch of "Tub O Clones" next weekend.
More pic's soon of the "Tub O Clones" "SOG" "Martian Method" extravaganza.
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First attempt at a 24-hour "Martian Method"
Whats up Dog, this site kind of "quit working" for me for a while.. it's cool to see you guys are still going at it and it sounds like you've all been tuning this system in better too. I still don't quite get it all but I love seeing healthy plants!
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First attempt at a 24-hour "Martian Method"
Hay farred good to see ya back. Ya the site went down for about a month.
There is some "trick" stuff one can do with PAD lights. I think Mother and I have just scratched the surface. Stay tuned Sal promises quite the ending to this adventure.
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First attempt at a 24-hour "Martian Method"
I've been hooked.. I hope Sal the best with his publishing, I'm already ready alread to just buy the damn book! ;)
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First attempt at a 24-hour "Martian Method"
Quote:
Originally Posted by farredeyed
I've been hooked.. I hope Sal the best with his publishing, I'm already ready alread to just buy the damn book! ;)
me too, great idea, looking forward to seeing the end game (harvest!)
Peace,
Denial
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First attempt at a 24-hour "Martian Method"
Here is 28 days of "Tub O Clones".
The first two pic's are under the 400w HPS. The second two pic's are using a white cfl light. The third pic is under 4 red inc's and 2 red cfl's.
The current "Martian Method" 24 hour schedule is.....
10 hours 400w 2K HPS (our blue light source)
3 hours 126w 4/25w red inc party bulbs 2/13w red cfl's (PAD light source)
11 hours SID (standard indoor darkness)
We took away some more PAD lights (on time), as noted above, a 1/2 hour. The girls seem to be doing great......................
More of "Tub O Clones" next week
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First attempt at a 24-hour "Martian Method"
New "Tub O Clones 2"
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dogznova
The next batch my uncle and I will use a 400w MH light for the first two weeks then switch to a HPS for the rest of the flowering duration.
This is not going to happen this time, Sorry folks. One of the reason for this is that both batches have to be in the same flower room. If we overshoot the SID time in our new batch "Tub O Clones 2" with extra PAD lights (on time) then our first batch "Tub O Clones" current SID time will also be overshot because of the PAD red light bleed. We simply can't block off one of the areas to prevent this right now. Plus we will need to get another timer. LOL
Most of the clones here spent 3 weeks in a EZ cloner then 3 weeks in cups under 18 hours of T5. These girls are about 8 to 10 inches tall on the average. This will be somewhat of a good comparison to the first batch (as far as height and stretch goes). Since this batch will go directly into full "Martian Method" flower and there will be no overshooting of the SID time with PAD lights for the first three weeks like our first "Tub O Clones" did.
The first pic is a group shot of "Tub O Clones 2". The second pic is under 4 25w red party bulbs and 2 red cfl's (same as the other area).
This "Martian Method" 24 hour schedule will be on the same timer as "Tub O Clones".
10 hours 400w 2K HPS (our blue light source)
3 hours 126w 4/25w red inc party bulbs 2/13w red cfl's (PAD light source)
11 hours SID (standard indoor darkness)
More of "Tub O Clones 2" next week
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First attempt at a 24-hour "Martian Method"
Thanks for keeping us updated, Are the PAD lights shut off during regular daylight hours?
edit: i know ive been following this long enough i should know this but i get really mixed up in all the terminology PAD SID PAR ET TU BRUTE ?
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First attempt at a 24-hour "Martian Method"
Yes they are. I know I get confused also...:thumbsup:
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First attempt at a 24-hour "Martian Method"
"Tub O Clones".
The flowers are doing good. From the looks of things these flowers should be done in about 6 more weeks. I will be cutting some of the fan leaves before next week's pic's.
The 24 hour "Martian" schedule is still the same.
More of "Tub O Clones" next week :thumbsup:
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First attempt at a 24-hour "Martian Method"
"Tub O Clones 2"
Not much to say here. These girls have now flowered one full week.
If my uncle and I have hit the SID target time correctly with this 24 hour "Martian" time schedule, then there should be popcorn buds on the girls next week. We shall see.
More of "Tub O Clones 2" next week :thumbsup:
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First attempt at a 24-hour "Martian Method"
Looks great Dog!
:thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
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First attempt at a 24-hour "Martian Method"
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First attempt at a 24-hour "Martian Method"
Are you running 2 sets of 2 tubs each, which is 4 tubs total?
Are you running the Red Compact fluorescents mixed evenly throughout the growing area, or are you putting the Red CFL's over the vegging #2's tubs?
Also do you have some king of divider between the #1's area and the #2's area?
Mylar and other curtains would not contain the Far Red as much as the Red, but it would help separate the two areas spectrally.
You can successfully run a vegging and a flowering area with minimul light dividers/divission/separation, but the more the spectrums are separated the better. If you're running the same timing schedule in both, then separating the spectrums is the key to separating the results, since you can have vegging under one PAD spectrum and Flowering under another PAD spectrum while using the same scheduling timers to run both.
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It looks like the first batch (#1's) are at the popcorn stage in certain ways to me. One thing to look for is the white hairs don't fill into the nice full fuzzy balls found on normal flowering formations. Another sign could be the early formation of trichomes on the leaf structures.
The main thing to watch for is the slowing of the growth rate, moreso than other typical signs of excess darkness length, with the PAD mix type you're using.
Take Care, Sal.
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First attempt at a 24-hour "Martian Method"
Quote:
Originally Posted by salmayo
Are you running 2 sets of 2 tubs each, which is 4 tubs total?.
Yes there are 4 sets of tubs. 2 in each area.
Quote:
Originally Posted by salmayo
Are you running the Red Compact fluorescents mixed evenly throughout the growing area, or are you putting the Red CFL's over the vegging #2's tubs?
The #2 tubs are flowering. We did not extend the PAD lights (on time) in tubs #2 because of light bleed into the tub #1 section. Both sets of tubs #1 and #2 are on the same trimmers and are divided by a side wall (but not the fronts). So instead of using some kind of blocking wall in the front at this time we just put tub o clones #2 into flowering.
AS far as the red cfl's go, There are two 13 watt red cfl's per section. In tub O clones #1 they are on each side of the hood. In tub o clones #2 they are more in the middle of the hood.
Both areas have the PAD lights on light movers with the HPS hood. So I guess they are being somewhat distributed evenly
Quote:
Originally Posted by salmayo
Also do you have some king of divider between the #1's area and the #2's area?
Just a side wall at this point.
Quote:
Originally Posted by salmayo
You can successfully run a vegging and a flowering area with minimul light dividers/divission/separation, but the more the spectrums are separated the better. If you're running the same timing schedule in both, then separating the spectrums is the key to separating the results, since you can have vegging under one PAD spectrum and Flowering under another PAD spectrum while using the same scheduling timers to run both.
We are going to work on this for the future.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by salmayo
It looks like the first batch (#1's) are at the popcorn stage in certain ways to me. One thing to look for is the white hairs don't fill into the nice full fuzzy balls found on normal flowering formations. Another sign could be the early formation of trichomes on the leaf structures.
They look on schedule for 3 weeks of flowering to us. I know the blueberry looks small. It doesn't have verry large yields.
Quote:
Originally Posted by salmayo
The main thing to watch for is the slowing of the growth rate, moreso than other typical signs of excess darkness length, with the PAD mix type you're using.
If they start to slow in growth. Should the PAD light (on time) go up or down?
