Golden boy.. all I have to say is that you are my new friend. I've been hoping additional voices of reason would be able to come in here and explain the situation as unbiased as you have.
Excellent posts.. all of them have been so far. :thumbsup:
Printable View
Golden boy.. all I have to say is that you are my new friend. I've been hoping additional voices of reason would be able to come in here and explain the situation as unbiased as you have.
Excellent posts.. all of them have been so far. :thumbsup:
Thank you:jointsmile:Quote:
Originally Posted by daihashi
Nobody suspects a stoner to be so in tuned with the economy.
I disagree that Bush inheritted this mess. THIS mess is mostly about the mortgage meltdown and real-estate bubble spreading throughout the economy. We did not have a real-estate bubble or mortgage financing bubble at the time Bush came into office. And the Fed Chairman serves at the pleasure of the President. If Greenspan was a problem that Bush inherrited, all he had to do was assign someone else.Quote:
Originally Posted by GoldenBoy812
When a president inherrits a problem (and I'm not agreeing that is entirely the case with Bush), then it is up to him to DO something about it. You can't just sit on a problem for 8 years not doing anything about it, and then say, "Well I didn't cause this --- I inherrited it!"
The other part to this mess, is the lack of room to maneuver, and that is mostly due to the massive debt. Again, Bush is not responsible for the enitre debt, but he is responsible for a very large portion of it! The massive Bush tax cuts and the cost of the unnecessary Iraq war have driven the debt so high, that there is very little room to borrow our way out of this situation.
We are just about completely painted into a corner. There is very little room to drop interest rates to stimulate the economy, and it might trigger inflation anyway. A bailout might be necessary, but who will lend us that much money, and under what terms? Maybe we'll just "print" the money, and we're back to inflation again. Maybe we'll need to rais taxes in order to deal with the problem, but what will that do to the economy?
We are getting into a situation where we are very susceptible to having our economy held hostage. Any number of foregin countries could kick us right over the edge --- massive oil embargo, dumping dollars to devalue the currency, another terrorist attack.
I understand that. What I'm saying is we should put out the fire but somehow arrest the arsonist. The plan Congress is arguing over right now is says nothing about holding the directors, CEO's, and even corporations accountable for their actions.Quote:
Originally Posted by Breukelen advocaat
So, in keeping with the metaphor, it's like putting out the fire and telling the arsonist...
"That could have been disastrous! Be more careful next time!
Exactly, but I should have worded it a bit differently since these loans, and loans on loans, were probably within the framework of being legal at the time. The CEO's, corporations and directors must be held accountable - but first we have to develop and enforce better regulations.Quote:
Originally Posted by JakeMartinez
Hopefully, AIG should be able to sell off some of their non-essential assets and pay back the government within 24 months.
Hopefully.Quote:
Originally Posted by Breukelen advocaat
Since the loan is coming out of the Federal Reserve's pockets (not really the taxpayers', though it affects us indirectly through inflation), they're not really required to pay it back unless the Fed withdraws a lot of the money supply.
So...hopefully AIG and any other soon-to-be-bailed-out corporations aren't stingy with the money they make with the huge "loans".
...hopefully...
I'd be a lot happier about these bailouts if the Governemnt would mail me a share certificate for each company they bail out. They got what, something like an 80% ownership stake in AIG for the bailout loan? Maybe they should do a stock split so that it comes out to exactly a share for each citizen and mail us out each a share certificate. That would take the stink of "nationalization" off of the bailout since the shares would still be privately held. And if it is actually true that each and every one of us has a stake in the success or failure of these companies, maybe they should make that real by actually giving us a share. I'd also feel like I had got more for my money.
dude as it is its going to cost us 700Billion. now add printing stock certs and mailing costs as well.Quote:
Originally Posted by dragonrider
From: Minister of the Treasury Paulson
Subject: REQUEST FOR URGENT CONFIDENTIAL BUSINESS RELATIONSHIP
Dear American:
I need to ask you to support an urgent secret business relationship with a transfer of funds of great magnitude.
I am Ministry of the Treasury of the Republic of America. My country has had crisis that has caused the need for large transfer of funds of 800 billion dollars US. If you would assist me in this transfer, it would be most profitable to you.
I am working with Mr. Phil Gram, lobbyist for UBS, who will be my replacement as Ministry of the Treasury in January. As a Senator, you may know him as the leader of the American banking deregulation movement in the 1990s. I assure you, this transaction is 100% safe.
This is a matter of great urgency. We need a blank check.
We need the funds as quickly as possible. We cannot directly transfer these funds in the names of our close friends because we are constantly under surveillance. My family lawyer advised me that I should look for a reliable and trustworthy person who will act as a next of kin so the funds can be transferred.
Please reply with all of your bank account, IRA and college fund account numbers and those of your children and grandchildren to [email protected] so that we may transfer your commission for this transaction. After I receive that information, I will respond with detailed information about safeguards that will be used to protect the funds.
Yours Faithfully
Minister of Treasury Paulson
My idea was more of a joke than anything, but believe me, the mailing costs would be a mere drop in the bucket compared to the $700 Billion...Quote:
Originally Posted by flyingimam